More Chinese Navy in Indian Ocean, US OK, India not

[Speeder]

The "border dispute" is of India's own making - quite pathetic acturally. Mcmahon is nobody and he drew a line on a map hence the indians have believed that it's their on the other side of the line. Just think about it: what a crap!

Look at the people there. Do you look like Indians? Check out historical momuments there. Do they look like Indian? Look at neutral history books, did India have any historical claim on that prior Mcmahom? No!

China only claims what belongs to her historically before mcmahon's forefathers' balls have ever dropped. Have you guys seen China claimed New Delhi? NO, even it were a sort of gift because historically New Delhi has been Indian.

Then India has started to immigrate its people into the region since mcmahon while CHina was in the Civil War, and propangated hate mongering amongst uneducated common Indians towards China, and set tp "forward policy" for more Chinese lands, to complicate the matter.

You know what? "negotiaition" or not, we Chinese will take what belongs to the montherland sooner or later in any scenario, a peaceful way or a war. All other issues are negoatiable, not our historical land, no one square metre of it!

 

[sensenreason]

The "border dispute" is of India's own making - quite pathetic acturally. Mcmahon is nobody and he drew a line on a map hence the indians have believed that it's their on the other side of the line. Just think about it: what a crap!

Look at the people there. Do you look like Indians? Check out historical momuments there. Do they look like Indian? Look at neutral history books, did India have any historical claim on that prior Mcmahom? No!

China only claims what belongs to her historically before mcmahon's forefathers' balls have ever dropped. Have you guys seen China claimed New Delhi? NO, even it were a sort of gift because historically New Delhi has been Indian.

Then India has started to immigrate its people into the region since mcmahon while CHina was in the Civil War, and propangated hate mongering amongst uneducated common Indians towards China, and set tp "forward policy" for more Chinese lands, to complicate the matter.

You know what? "negotiaition" or not, we Chinese will take what belongs to the montherland sooner or later in any scenario, a peaceful way or a war. All other issues are negoatiable, not our historical land, no one square metre of it!

I can agree with you to the point where you say that North East was not an integrated part of the Indian subcontinent and that the Brits made up the line as they wished.

However, I dont agree that China has any historical right on the land as well; infact its occupation of Tibet is an occupation of a land to its south. So its like Tibet is in the middle of India and China (just like Nepal is now) and both countries have tried to move North or South to expand their borders.

China occupies Aksai Chin illegally what belongs to India.What historical claim does China have on Kashmir? So Speeder, its easy to blame the other side and have a victim mentality. The problem is all three countries..India, Pakistan, China have a victim mentality. While China has teamed up with Pakistan; the team is squarely against India. The role played by Britain and even US since WW2 on these issues have been to instigate differences.

Unfortunately, China and Pak think India is culprit of all problems.

 

[gpit]

To paritosh,

Nice posts!

You are among a few wise Indians who see things through on this aspect.

I could be wrong, but I feel that the fan-up of anti-China sentiment and fermentation for extra-nationalism is very useful for your democratic politicians, because that is how they manage their vote pool and shift attention of the constituents. Unfortunately, that hurts Indian national interest profoundly.

Let me share with you some of my experiences with Chinese netizens. I’ve been browsing Chinese internet constantly for about 10+ years. Initially, there weren’t much Indian topics, then there were some but mostly about your open-up stories, now there are fairly amount of talks about belligerent statements from Indian warlords (such as Mr. Fenandes and the alike who consider China as India’s number one enemy). If that trend persists, it is bad for both countries.

Everyone living in a democratic country knows that sensation-making is essential in winning any election. Nonetheless, for a country with vast uneducated or undereducated mass with external news overwhelmingly from West, IMHO, this is detrimental to your national interest, if not suicidal, as the constituents’ only access is a one-sided story.

If you look at Sino-Russia boarder dispute, both governments bear a lot of pressure from nationalism within. The same applies to the resolution of Sino-Vietnam, Sino-Kyrgyzstan, Sino-Kazakhstan, … border issues. In each an every case, a negotiation on the sovereignty of an “integral part” of one’s country is necessary, and a take and a give is a must.

Since the day one of Nehru, GOI’s position is always that an integral part of Indian territory is not negotiable. Whatever British Imperialists said must be treated as gods’ instruction.

Please tell us, if there is no negotiation, how can a conflict be solved?

Are Indian politicians so stupid as not to be able to see this but some ordinary people can? No, of course not! There is no lack of wise Indians in political arena, but they want use this as a slogan to summon nationalism for enlarging their vote pool to benefit themselves. And this is an easy and cheap play in any democratic country.

Just look at how much people in US touting the wonderful fruit in toppling Iraq Hussein regime and spreading democracy to the country, but seldom discussing vast Iraqis who celebrate US troop withdrawal from the country and want that day to be they national liberation day.

You probably also noticed that when I brought forth facts about US and communism movements, how my fellow US countrymen call/imply me a “runaway criminal” that needs to be beheaded.

Please remember that the citizens in US are on average much better educated than those in India, yet symptoms of being brainwashed and blind-nationalism are palpable everywhere.

If a wiseman like you paritosh who wants to settle the border issue through negotiation, he is a traitor, and he will never get elected, even though he serves broader interest of India.

As territorial dispute and Dalai Lama are the two major issues facing India and China, I’m not very optimistic on Sino-India relationship in near future. Hope reality will prove me wrong.

 

[DesiGuy]

The "border dispute" is of India's own making - quite pathetic acturally. Mcmahon is nobody and he drew a line on a map hence the indians have believed that it's their on the other side of the line. Just think about it: what a crap!

Look at the people there. Do you look like Indians? Check out historical momuments there. Do they look like Indian? Look at neutral history books, did India have any historical claim on that prior Mcmahom? No!

China only claims what belongs to her historically before mcmahon's forefathers' balls have ever dropped. Have you guys seen China claimed New Delhi? NO, even it were a sort of gift because historically New Delhi has been Indian.

Then India has started to immigrate its people into the region since mcmahon while CHina was in the Civil War, and propangated hate mongering amongst uneducated common Indians towards China, and set tp "forward policy" for more Chinese lands, to complicate the matter.

You know what? "negotiaition" or not, we Chinese will take what belongs to the montherland sooner or later in any scenario, a peaceful way or a war. All other issues are negoatiable, not our historical land, no one square metre of it!

I dared you to take the land which belongs to India.

You Chinese are just grabbing land of another countries.

Than start lecturing about Indian land.

 

[arihant]

I dared you to take the land which belongs to India.

You Chinese are just grabbing land of another countries.

Than start lecturing about Indian land.

Stop it. There are lot of Pakistani in the face of Chinese.

There literacy seems to be like Pakistan so I heavily doubt from where they belongs.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

The "border dispute" is of India's own making - quite pathetic acturally. Mcmahon is nobody and he drew a line on a map hence the indians have believed that it's their on the other side of the line. Just think about it: what a crap!

Look at the people there. Do you look like Indians? Check out historical momuments there. Do they look like Indian? Look at neutral history books, did India have any historical claim on that prior Mcmahom? No!

China only claims what belongs to her historically before mcmahon's forefathers' balls have ever dropped. Have you guys seen China claimed New Delhi? NO, even it were a sort of gift because historically New Delhi has been Indian.

Then India has started to immigrate its people into the region since mcmahon while CHina was in the Civil War, and propangated hate mongering amongst uneducated common Indians towards China, and set tp "forward policy" for more Chinese lands, to complicate the matter.

You know what? "negotiaition" or not, we Chinese will take what belongs to the montherland sooner or later in any scenario, a peaceful way or a war. All other issues are negoatiable, not our historical land, no one square metre of it!

There are 2 main issues:

(1) Indian' ILLEGAL occupation of foreign land

(2) India's ongoing (and increasing) need FOR land to satiate her over-population.

I have 'hinted' many times how a United Asia will benefit the world, and in here lies the best solution to resolving world issues. I'll say it clearly: India alone is not match for rest of world in negotiations, but if India joins a united Asia-Africa-Arabs-Natives alliance then the voice of ~6 billion people will be OBEYED. Alone even if you increase your population, the power of your voice will still be meek. That is because sheer population alone is not enough, especially when most voices will be weak from lack of food and water.

You all know STRENGTH is determinate in LAND 'negotiations'. All of these land treatise were signed by Natives & Aboriginals at the end-of-the-guns-barrel. Asia is already over-crowded. But there are other places on Earth that is not so crowded....

 

[paritosh]

To paritosh,

Nice posts!

You are among a few wise Indians who see things through on this aspect.

I could be wrong, but I feel that the fan-up of anti-China sentiment and fermentation for extra-nationalism is very useful for your democratic politicians, because that is how they manage their vote pool and shift attention of the constituents. Unfortunately, that hurts Indian national interest profoundly.

Let me share with you some of my experiences with Chinese netizens. I’ve been browsing Chinese internet constantly for about 10+ years. Initially, there weren’t much Indian topics, then there were some but mostly about your open-up stories, now there are fairly amount of talks about belligerent statements from Indian warlords (such as Mr. Fenandes and the alike who consider China as India’s number one enemy). If that trend persists, it is bad for both countries.

Everyone living in a democratic country knows that sensation-making is essential in winning any election. Nonetheless, for a country with vast uneducated or undereducated mass with external news overwhelmingly from West, IMHO, this is detrimental to your national interest, if not suicidal, as the constituents’ only access is a one-sided story.

If you look at Sino-Russia boarder dispute, both governments bear a lot of pressure from nationalism within. The same applies to the resolution of Sino-Vietnam, Sino-Kyrgyzstan, Sino-Kazakhstan, … border issues. In each an every case, a negotiation on the sovereignty of an “integral part” of one’s country is necessary, and a take and a give is a must.

Since the day one of Nehru, GOI’s position is always that an integral part of Indian territory is not negotiable. Whatever British Imperialists said must be treated as gods’ instruction.

Please tell us, if there is no negotiation, how can a conflict be solved?

Are Indian politicians so stupid as not to be able to see this but some ordinary people can? No, of course not! There is no lack of wise Indians in political arena, but they want use this as a slogan to summon nationalism for enlarging their vote pool to benefit themselves. And this is an easy and cheap play in any democratic country.

Just look at how much people in US touting the wonderful fruit in toppling Iraq Hussein regime and spreading democracy to the country, but seldom discussing vast Iraqis who celebrate US troop withdrawal from the country and want that day to be they national liberation day.

You probably also noticed that when I brought forth facts about US and communism movements, how my fellow US countrymen call/imply me a “runaway criminal” that needs to be beheaded.

Please remember that the citizens in US are on average much better educated than those in India, yet symptoms of being brainwashed and blind-nationalism are palpable everywhere.

If a wiseman like you paritosh who wants to settle the border issue through negotiation, he is a traitor, and he will never get elected, even though he serves broader interest of India.

As territorial dispute and Dalai Lama are the two major issues facing India and China, I’m not very optimistic on Sino-India relationship in near future. Hope reality will prove me wrong.

well thank you!

We have for decades seen Pakistan as the enemy...we aren't sure why but every country needs promise in the form of an all-evil enemy state.
yesterday...on some news channel...there was a debate on Admiral Sureesh's admission that the Indian navy is weaker in comparison to the Chinese one....and that we ought to be working with the Chinese and not against them.
Many known leaders from the different political parties were participating...they all concluded by calling the Nehru era's 'forward policy' moves as blunders and disastrous(much to the congress's candidate's dismay)
A lot of times...it has been pointed out by many Chinese on this forum and elsewhere...that " we in China do not talk about the Indians and when we do it's only when someone from your side makes outrageous statements"
believe it or not...it's the same with the Indians...the only times the commoners talk about the Chinese is when someone from our side makes outrageous statements...

China did not become our enemy when they so convincingly defeated us in '62...yes there were some bollywood films about the coward Chinese of '62...but the Chinese became the enemy when they made deals with our enemy....the fear of having to fight not on just one front but on two..against two nuclear powered nations...stems the anti-china..ness.

then there are revelations that do make news...like the recent one being satellite images of chinese bases having topographical models of some of the Himalayan passes into India....indian army think-tanks were into a frenzy...!

in the backdrop of all of the chaos...there is a more powerful saner lot...that has no face...this lot gets the CBMs in place...involves itself in peaceful talks for resolution of the border disputes...like the one we had a couple of days ago with the Chinses saner, faceless counterpart...which sadly most people did not notice...as it ended peacefully for both the nations..

 

[paritosh]

As territorial dispute and Dalai Lama are the two major issues facing India and China, I’m not very optimistic on Sino-India relationship in near future. Hope reality will prove me wrong.

the world fears and resists change...till the change steam rolls into existence.
the change of the powers center from Europe to America was met with many European powers engaging with the USA(Spain,Britain,France and later Germany)

the shift of the power center from the western to the eastern Europe resulted in the cold war and the western European countries allying with the USA against Russia.

India and China manifest the next change....and as long as the billion of ours do not clash with the billion of yours....there is no stopping us from increasing our economies and influence.

with some subtle handling...there'd be no need of any war not even a border clash...talks would see our troubles home...as they have done recently.
Regarding the change that is to come...I sure am optimistic.

 

[SinoIndusFriendship]

the world fears and resists change...till the change steam rolls into existence.
the change of the powers center from Europe to America was met with many European powers engaging with the USA(Spain,Britain,France and later Germany)

the shift of the power center from the western to the eastern Europe resulted in the cold war and the western European countries allying with the USA against Russia.

India and China manifest the next change....and as long as the billion of ours do not clash with the billion of yours....there is no stopping us from increasing our economies and influence.

with some subtle handling...there'd be no need of any war not even a border clash...talks would see our troubles home...as they have done recently.
Regarding the change that is to come...I sure am optimistic.

Senoir Paritosh (or should I call you Che Paritosh). "Che" Guevera, the "Che" actually means 'friend' in Argentina. You read me message below?!




There are 2 main issues:

(1) Indian' ILLEGAL occupation of foreign land

(2) India's ongoing (and increasing) need FOR land to satiate her over-population.

I have 'hinted' many times how a United Asia will benefit the world, and in here lies the best solution to resolving world issues. I'll say it clearly: India alone is not match for rest of world in negotiations, but if India joins a united Asia-Africa-Arabs-Natives alliance then the voice of ~6 billion people will be OBEYED. Alone even if you increase your population, the power of your voice will still be meek. That is because sheer population alone is not enough, especially when most voices will be weak from lack of food and water.

You all know STRENGTH is determinate in LAND 'negotiations'. All of these land treatise were signed by Natives & Aboriginals at the end-of-the-guns-barrel. Asia is already over-crowded. But there are other places on Earth that is not so crowded....

 

[Tango25]

Excuse me, but on what authority do you state that the North East was not a part of the subcontinent?

Do you know the culture of the North East? Do you know their language, their architecture, their dance, their cuisine, their mythology?

You should know better than to get convinced by such nonsense.

I can agree with you to the point where you say that North East was not an integrated part of the Indian subcontinent and that the Brits made up the line as they wished.

 

[paritosh]

Senoir Paritosh (or should I call you Che Paritosh). "Che" Guevera, the "Che" actually means 'friend' in Argentina. You read me message below?!




There are 2 main issues:

(1) Indian' ILLEGAL occupation of foreign land

(2) India's ongoing (and increasing) need FOR land to satiate her over-population.

I have 'hinted' many times how a United Asia will benefit the world, and in here lies the best solution to resolving world issues. I'll say it clearly: India alone is not match for rest of world in negotiations, but if India joins a united Asia-Africa-Arabs-Natives alliance then the voice of ~6 billion people will be OBEYED. Alone even if you increase your population, the power of your voice will still be meek. That is because sheer population alone is not enough, especially when most voices will be weak from lack of food and water.

You all know STRENGTH is determinate in LAND 'negotiations'. All of these land treatise were signed by Natives & Aboriginals at the end-of-the-guns-barrel. Asia is already over-crowded. But there are other places on Earth that is not so crowded....

I'd very much like to blame the Brits for all of our boundary issues
but the fact is that we are entangled in a series of complicated territorial disputes since our inception.
and no country would refuse extra land...even if it has a negative growth rate.
While on defense forums....we Indians fight with our 'enemies'...
there are people working to resolve these issues diplomatically.
it's a sad fact that the issues that get resolved dont make up for a spicy topic on a defense forum.
it is human to be patriotic...

 

[hack]

no chinese would even know that unknown website if someone didn't try so hard to google a post in that forum

with all due respect ,you guys just don't have guts to throw all scruples to the air and separat Tibet,it's not smart anyway,that's why you creat a so-call "religious leader"

No need to separate anything..just recognizing Tibet as even disputed area will p1ss the Chinese off.India has never done that.

Dalai Lama was not created by India.

 

[hack]

Senoir Paritosh (or should I call you Che Paritosh). "Che" Guevera, the "Che" actually means 'friend' in Argentina. You read me message below?!




There are 2 main issues:

(1) Indian' ILLEGAL occupation of foreign land

(2) India's ongoing (and increasing) need FOR land to satiate her over-population.

I have 'hinted' many times how a United Asia will benefit the world, and in here lies the best solution to resolving world issues. I'll say it clearly: India alone is not match for rest of world in negotiations, but if India joins a united Asia-Africa-Arabs-Natives alliance then the voice of ~6 billion people will be OBEYED. Alone even if you increase your population, the power of your voice will still be meek. That is because sheer population alone is not enough, especially when most voices will be weak from lack of food and water.

You all know STRENGTH is determinate in LAND 'negotiations'. All of these land treatise were signed by Natives & Aboriginals at the end-of-the-guns-barrel. Asia is already over-crowded. But there are other places on Earth that is not so crowded....

I may be wrong but does not India have more arable land than any country in the world except the US? I don't think they will have any trouble with their population.And has not the population growth reduced in many parts of India already?

And the excess population can be moved to the east...AP as they are already doing.

 

[dbc]

our approach is not right at all... the American are fueling the hatred between India and China...and we are playing into their game...

And you know this because... ? next you’ll be blaming the United States for India’s poor relations with Pakistan, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka. IMHO, India’s done a pretty good job of making enemies out of almost all its neighbors.

Want proof? Just look at all the Thanks this post will receive from your adoring neighbors!

 

[dvk1982]

Senoir Paritosh (or should I call you Che Paritosh). "Che" Guevera, the "Che" actually means 'friend' in Argentina. You read me message below?!




There are 2 main issues:

(1) Indian' ILLEGAL occupation of foreign land

(2) India's ongoing (and increasing) need FOR land to satiate her over-population.

I have 'hinted' many times how a United Asia will benefit the world, and in here lies the best solution to resolving world issues. I'll say it clearly: India alone is not match for rest of world in negotiations, but if India joins a united Asia-Africa-Arabs-Natives alliance then the voice of ~6 billion people will be OBEYED. Alone even if you increase your population, the power of your voice will still be meek. That is because sheer population alone is not enough, especially when most voices will be weak from lack of food and water.

You all know STRENGTH is determinate in LAND 'negotiations'. All of these land treatise were signed by Natives & Aboriginals at the end-of-the-guns-barrel. Asia is already over-crowded. But there are other places on Earth that is not so crowded....

u know what... u can't pick both sides... like calling other nations lands as illegal and expecting others to show unconditional faith-both r contradictory... subtly implying that in ur history that at some point china was so big, so now u r natural inheritors of the land... Just like some stupid Indians dream about having entire southern peninsula as one as it did during Asoka period or like wise..... Boundaries change for ever... they will change in future, but using that as excuse u can't live in past if u REALLY DREAM ABT A UNITED FACE...
THis is how exactly westerners use if they can.... by inflating the boundary issues instead of helping to control them... thats how britishers did by helping different Indian kingdoms by assuring them from other Kingdoms .. when in fact they assured both the kingdoms against each other in the event of a war.....