MMRCA may be scrapped by year end

[RazorMC]

Don't jump the gun yet people, negotiations are going on and it will be ratified in a few months time.

This deal is too big to be scrapped anyways. Dassault loses billions of dollars and India loses out on a really good aircraft.

 

[illusion8]

This deal is too big to be scrapped anyways. Dassault loses billions of dollars and India loses out on a really good aircraft.

It's a highly complicated deal with lots of local production issues, TOT built in - so surely there will be some disputes and delays which is understood.

HAL is buying land and recruiting people for the Rafale production line.

 

[RazorMC]

It's a highly complicated deal with lots of local production issues, TOT built in - so surely there will be some disputes and delays which is understood.

HAL is buying land and recruiting people for the Rafale production line.

Does it also have to do with Dassault's preference in working with a private company rather than HAL?
Else they might not have objected to HAL's involvement (even though they knew HAL was going to get the bulk of the manufacturing done).

 

[foxbat]

PAF says: pfft

As of late we have noticed lots of one-liners and off topic useless comments. Please revisit the forum rules, if you have nothing good to write, don't write at all.

.............

Depends on what kind of contract India can pull. Just license production or full Tech transfer. LP would prevent HAL from manufacturing those engines for other projects, but a full transfer is almost similiar to buying the rights to the tech itself.

Licensed productions are also time bound, which means HAL can later utilize what it "learnt" from that design after the period is over.

And since HAL is currently license producing that engine for Su 30 MKI, that period is still not over I guess

 

[illusion8]

Does it also have to do with Dassault's preference in working with a private company rather than HAL?
Else they might not have objected to HAL's involvement (even though they knew HAL was going to get the bulk of the manufacturing done).

I am sure Reliance is involved in this, no details are out in the open - but Dassault did enter a contract with Reliance but HAL that time issued a statement that HAL will be the principle integrator and will be solely in control to issue production orders to any third parties. I have a doubt that Reliance is putting a spanner in the works to get into the contract because its a major deal.

http://www.defence.pk/forums/indian-defence/158545-rafale-partners-reliance.html

 

[RazorMC]

And since HAL is currently license producing that engine for Su 30 MKI, that period is still not over I guess

There is going to be a time-period for which the agreement is effective. You can stop honoring it if you chose (Russia would call it it violating though).

And depends on what India learnt from putting them together. Have you gathered enough info to build your own from scratch?

 

[Storm Force]

FOR THOSE SUGGESSTING THIS DEAL IS TOO BIG TO BE CANCELLED let me explain this

THE POINT THAT MANY OF YOU GUYS ARE MISSING IS THIS.

The deal has to works for both parties ie for dassult they have to make it profitable, and to retain some control in the TOT so has not to pass everything to HAL and there by give birth to a new RIVAL .

For INDIA it has to be affordable and on TIME to be meaningful and useful both in TECHNOLOGY gained and combat system inducted.

AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME both parties are not budging

There is an election soon in india and MANY oppsition parties want this DEAL scrapped sugesting foul play in the VENDOR SELECTION prehaps even bribes.

Budget cuts have already effected SEVERAL DEFENSE DEALS far smaller than MMRCA.

For Pakistan despite REHOTRIC from some PAK members THIS WIL A great relief BECAUSE no doubt RAFALE F3 will have been a AWESOME addition to an already formidable opponent.

 

[Safriz]

told you so.........

 

[T90TankGuy]

FOR THOSE SUGGESSTING THIS DEAL IS TOO BIG TO BE CANCELLED let me explain this

THE POINT THAT MANY OF YOU GUYS ARE MISSING IS THIS.

The deal has to works for both parties ie for dassult they have to make it profitable, and to retain some control in the TOT so has not to pass everything to HAL and there by give birth to a new RIVAL .

For INDIA it has to be affordable and on TIME to be meaningful and useful both in TECHNOLOGY gained and combat system inducted.

AT THIS MOMENT IN TIME both parties are not budging

There is an election soon in india and MANY oppsition parties want this DEAL scrapped sugesting foul play in the VENDOR SELECTION prehaps even bribes.

Budget cuts have already effected SEVERAL DEFENSE DEALS far smaller than MMRCA.

For Pakistan despite REHOTRIC from some PAK members THIS WIL A great relief BECAUSE no doubt RAFALE F3 will have been a AWESOME addition to an already formidable opponent.

For one budget cut was for just one financial year 12-12 . which is over . second there was no cut for a capital purchase such as this. while i do concede some of your points , its nothing new, all of these issues come up when ever we have a big ticket purchase. . so having said that do you have any source to back your claim or are these just your opinions?

 

[danger007]

News from SEVERAL sources in New Delhi in MOD and media are suggesting that indians are having a MASSIVE CHANGE OF HEART on the whole MMRCA project/saga for the IAF.

NEGOTIATIONS between the winners Dassult/rafale and the MOD in New Delhi have actually ceased for over week

Intially it was cited that there was DIFFERENCES in who shares the work load and TOT absorbtion between HAL & DASSULTS preferred indian partner AMBANI RELIANCE industries.

TODAY THE NEWS indicates that the INDIANS have several misgivings

1. THE TOTAL price could be as high as $26 billion ($6 billion for weapons alone)
2. FRENCH are not willing to share 100% TOT as was previously suggested
3. FRENCH want to control production as they see FIT
4. timescales ARE CLASHING with proposed INDUCTION OF FGFA IN 2019-2020

coupled with FINANCIAL DEFENSE CUTS coming into EFFECT the indians ARE READY to ditch this hyper expensive deal.

THIS DEAL WAS SCHEDULED TO BE CONCLUDED in Dec 2012 THEN summer 2013.

all contracts communication currently IS ON HOLD

Storm force... dassult may be push reliance over HAL but they are not in a position to loose this massive contract for Reliance aerospace.... Do you think they will Push Reliance other wise willing to cancel the deal? do you think they will easily give up this contract?

 

[PWFI]

The sad part of the story is, now PAF will cancel FC-20 project also !

 

[jha]

Makes sense.. $ 26 Bill. is just too much for 126 aircrafts...

 

[indian_foxhound]

what a idiotic post made me laugh.

Makes sense.. $ 26 Bill. is just too much for 126 aircrafts...

Its not 26biln yara. Wrong info. It wont cost more than 16-18biln

 

[Storm Force]

DANGER

The french is not the problem.

THE INDIAN MOD and GOVT are having second thoughts re the COST

They are looking to PULL OUT by blaming DASSULT to save FACE and suggest it was the FRENCH causing the issues.

THE REAL ISSUE IS THE $26 BILLION... and timeline to license production and HALS slow tech absorbtion.

its RUMOURED it will cost $1 billion to SET UP manfacturing in HAL/INDIA AND 5 YEARS timespan.

 

[indian_foxhound]

Makes sense.. $ 26 Bill. is just too much for 126 aircrafts...

Its not 26biln yara. Wrong info. It wont cost more than 16-18biln