Is the military gap between Pakistan and India increasing or decreasing?

[Joe Shearer]

In case of PA...I'm disappointed in the lack of vision and focus. An example is that of tanks...Pakistan has Ukraine, Turkey, and China(others too) that it could've worked with to develop a decent tank(which I was hoping would be Al-Khalid 2 going forward). Instead they went for stop gap measures with 300 VT4(not to take away from its capabilities). It echoed the same stop gap measures taken before with T80UD and others. At this point it's a hodge podge mix of a a few hundred of this and few hundred of that. What the army needs is to focus on a decent domestic(or JV) tank(analogous to what the JF17 was for PAF)...churn it out over time to replace older tanks...and standardize the fleet. It can be improved over time as well(like JF17 blocks were)...
...either put all the focus in that...or decide once and for all...to import. So that money doesn't have to be squandered on an indigenous effort. If that's what the decision is...then go all in with some Chinese tank that fits the needs(like VT4 for example)...and go for license production(akin to Su30 MKI strategy of India).

I was happy to hear that PA was going for T129 with ToT...but that too is kinda up in the air.

Money makes the mare run, my dear Sir. Everybody posting has carefully stepped around that landmine.

 

[Pandora]

Credit Musharaf who bridged technological and numerical gap massively. All our current indigenous efforts started in his era otherwise our country had no concept of any sort of local development. US kept us technologically deficient but China making strides in technological domain has given us much need qualitative and quantitative parity with India at least in terms of Army and Air force. As for Navy Pakistan currently gone a procurement spree so hopefully we can bridge the gap in that area as well.

 

[saiyan0321]

Frankly there are two aspects to this and both need to be studied.

The constant conflicts between India and China and the containment policy of several nations to contain China and the second study of what is the purpose of the force and what is required to fulfill the objectives in any conflict. Both have a relation with each thus must be studied in tandem.

First thing that we need to look at is the China and India angle. As conflicts on the LAC grow constantly and the Chinese policy of slowly expanding its influence, it will become clear that India will be the central stage of the containment policy and for such a policy to be enacted successfully the Indian warfare capability will need to be modernized. While we may celebrate seeing India embroiled in another conflict however its negative impact is that India will be forced to do two things immediately.

1. That they will be forced to militarize the regions of the LAC and this militarization will mean building of bases, airbases, barracks, weapon depot and much much more which will enhance their ability to make warfare or support troop deployment and air support and for this they will build road strategic networks which will allow for quicker responses. To do all of this, India will undergo militarization and modernization and they have the funds to do it and while they will excuse that as China centric however the increase in military capability will be a huge threat for us especially the strategic networks they will build in Kashmir and Ladakh. This will make sure that any attempted offensive by Pakistan will be heavily contained and any Indian offensive will be difficult to blunt. Whenever India and Pakistan will enter into a conflict, they will do so alone which means that an India that will have made preparations for conflicts with China, ( not even a two front war but China alone) will be able to use those preparations against Pakistan. In such a manner one can very easily argue that the gap is all set to widen even more and the LAC conflict will be negative for Pakistan in the long run.
2. Now if we look at the other end we must come to understand that what will the conflict between Pakistan and India will contain. Will it be small skirmishes? then by all means a gap shouldnt arrive since we only have to modernize our weapon systems, alert systems and modernize our bases. We dont have to purchase alot of equipment nor raise squadrons or corps. If its a limited affair then we can keep the gap in check however if its a prolonged conflict, then we are not prepared at all. As the gap widens and India is forced to match China and its capabilities, it will increase whereas we will not be able to do the same since we wont have the resources to do the same, unless our economy takes a drastic turn like China's did or India's did. I think at one point, our ability to mount large offensives will also be contained like we did in 1965 or 1971.

In such a scenario we must work on our defensive capabilities and make sure that the India Pakistan border and the LOC are heavily defended places with extreme strategic placements for air and troop support which can blunt any Indian offensive. Our defensive capabilities must grow as well and they have alot to be desired. Air defense system will be key here and if we can somehow completely protect our air space then frankly, we shouldnt worry about many things.

 

[arjunk]

In other words, even while making careless, stupid mistakes, Army can easily defeat Indian Army while defending.

Your logic is, as always, impeccable.

I literally said they can't afford to make careless mistakes but leave it to an Indian to twist other's words like a 1.0 gpa student trying to solve an algebra equation

 

[The BrOkEn HeArT]

The Navy will need a lot more time due to sheer size

Airforce is way ahead of IAF

Army can easily defeat Indian Army if going defensive; For offensive moves, cannot afford to make careless stupid mistakes like they did in the past wars.

For a Pakistani, even Uganda Army can beat Indian army. So what? sote reho.....

 

[Goenitz]

@Cookie Monster The flight path mustn't be changed for oreliken to engage. May be better for cruise missile or rocket artillery hitting some base.. but idk its effectiveness.
what about APS like trophy or iron fist? I mean what would Al-Zarar do in north east w/o it? @Signalian @PanzerKiel
and what about converting some to mine dispenser? ( from T59/T60 )

 

[PanzerKiel]

@Cookie Monster The flight path mustn't be changed for oreliken to engage. May be better for cruise missile or rocket artillery hitting some base.. but idk its effectiveness.
what about APS like trophy or iron fist? I mean what would Al-Zarar do in north east w/o it? @Signalian @PanzerKiel
and what about converting some to mine dispenser? ( from T59/T60 )

Money......

 

[Kyusuibu Honbu]

Combat capable aircraft

MBT

Frigates

 

[VCheng]

Money makes the mare run, my dear Sir. Everybody posting has carefully stepped around that landmine.

A quote I have had to use often:


"The sinews of war are infinite money." - Cicero.

 

[FuturePAF]

The Navy will need a lot more time due to sheer size

Airforce is way ahead of IAF

Army can easily defeat Indian Army if going defensive; For offensive moves, cannot afford to make careless stupid mistakes like they did in the past wars.

very true about the Air Force; according to a recent interview of Ex-IAF high ranking officers Pakistan has 22 active squadrons to IAF’s 28

 

[GHALIB]

For a Pakistani, even Uganda Army can beat Indian army. So what? sote reho.....

Dont spoil the party .

 

[GHALIB]

very true about the Air Force; according to a recent interview of Ex-IAF high ranking officers Pakistan has 22 active squadrons to IAF’s 28

There wont be any war even if we have 22 squadrons

 

[blain2]

The PAF has definitely improve a lot in 2019 as proven in Feb 29 LOC air battle.

During Kargil 1999, PAF even need to turn away as IAF Mirage 2000 BVRAAM is a threat which PAF has nothing to counter that.

I don't see IAF has any advantage over PAF in current context. Most of IAF hardware are overhyped.

This is nothing but un-substantiated claim that PAF had to turn away @ Kargil because of IAF BVRAAM.

A few basic reasons why this is not the reality:

a) Getting PAF to fly over to the Indian side of the LoC to conduct OAO would have been tantamount to a major escalation leading to a full scale war. This is why the PAF did not engage.
b) Both sides were flying quite close to each other and in many cases WVR and nothing happened so this talk of PAF not engaging on account of the BVR threat is an Indian-propagated story.
c) PAF has been training on anti-BVR tactics for decades now. This started when Russians started bringing Mig-29s on their inventory and PAF realized that the VVS could introduce the platform into the Afghan theater by the late 80s (circa ~1987!).
d) The old technology of the then BVRAAMs in service with the IAF posed very limited risk to PAF fighter. Back then, IAF was fielding Matra R530D, a derivative of AIM-7 Sparrow which is not known for its lethality.

All of the above were reasons why the PAF was not too bothered by the Indian BVR threat. Keep in mind that R530D has an operational range of approx. 40NM. The AIM-9L in use by the PAF then had a range of 22 miles with front-aspect shots possible. As such, with proper employment, PAF was well within the realm of possibility to counter the IAF with a higher degree of potency than the IAF.

Fortunately for the two sides, they did not tangle, otherwise IAF may have been surprised.

 

[vishwambhar]

In air force Pakistan is currently enjoying an edge but India has successfully managed to keep its ground forces and naval forces upper hand over Pakistan..... after all Pakistan air advantage (thanks to major non NATO ally status) is not that overwhelming that it would destroy India's ground and naval offensive totally at the same time enjoying total air superiority over India.....

Apart from that BRAHMOS has now totally changed the entire gamut..... this system is FULL STOP to any future acquisitions of Pakistan or any enemy for the matter..... say Pakistan somehow gets F22 Raptors..... BRAHMOS will either make it sure that those Raptors don't get air borne or if they do they don't land back.....

 

[GHALIB]

In air force Pakistan is currently enjoying an edge but India has successfully managed to keep its ground forces and naval forces upper hand over Pakistan..... after all Pakistan air advantage (thanks to major non NATO ally status) is not that overwhelming that it would destroy India's ground and naval offensive totally at the same time enjoying total air superiority over India.....

Apart from that BRAHMOS has now totally changed the entire gamut..... this system is FULL STOP to any future acquisitions of Pakistan or any enemy for the matter..... say Pakistan somehow gets F22 Raptors..... BRAHMOS will either make it sure that those Raptors don't get air borne or if they do they don't land back.....

Brahmos ?
They have ghori ghazni abdali ?