INS Vishal: Will India go Nuclear?

[anant_s]

India cannot build nuclear carriers right now.

Well we do have experience of making a 40,000 on AC and this should help in extrapolating the design to a heavier class of vessel in future. On the issue of propulsion, marine application N reactor design exists (INS Arihant) and that tells, there is a capability to adapt (& increase power output) to suit for AC as well. Other systems are either designed and manufactured ingeniously or co-operation is available for such a project execution.
Nimitz class AC (weighing 100,000 Tons) use 2*100 MW reactors, by applying same rule a 65,000 Ton vessel would need about 140 MW (meaning each reactor rated at ~80 MW, taking 15% margin on 70 MW). This is similar to 88 MW reactor available on Arihant, so a doable job.
Work would required to be done on secondary Steam and Turbine cycle.
I assume in next 10 years or so an AC with N propulsion is within our capability and grasp.

 

[Indian Patriot]

Well we do have experience of making a 40,000 on AC

Is the 40,000 ton AC deployed? Building a 65,000 ton carrier is a big challenge in itself; building a 65,000 ton carrier which will be nuclear propelled is a greater challenge. And we are not even counting the cost of building, maintaining and operating a nuclear carrier.

India is still learning to build an AC else India would not have to pay a king's ransom for a virtual junk like Gorshkov which had to be refitted from scratch.

 

[Optimos Prime IA]

Going for Nuclear propulsion might be costlier initially but for non nuclear AC fuel costs should also be considered.

And range should also be considered ! And space saved should also be considered for going nuclear and EMALS system . If we opt for steam propulsion is also fine with me . We steam catapult system will be too large for 65000T medium carriers

 

[Indian Patriot]

Carriers don't float on the sea for 12 months a year, they need repair and maintenance. How many months per year do you think a N powered carrier will have to stay at port?

 

[Optimos Prime IA]

Yes you keyboard warrior. India cannot build nuclear carriers right now. India has a 46 billion dollar budget, not 460 billion dollars and how much of the 46 billion dollars go to navy? How much do you think it costs to build and maintain a nuclear carrier?

Don't come with your bullsh1t nationalist jingoism which has no connection to reality.

Be my guest you moron .Its not 46 billion below 40 billion that too India built SSBN and 40000 T A/C when her budget was below 30 billion . And money don't matter for us after all we give more than 1 billion as aid u crazy wanka

Then

Carriers don't float on the sea for 12 months a year, they need repair and maintenance. How many months per year do you think a N powered carrier will have to stay at port?

Then Why the hell US operating 10 Nuclear powered carriers ? Ok got you point .They are fools

 

[Indian Patriot]

Be my guest you moron .Its not 46 billion below 40 billion that too India built SSBN and 40000 T A/C when her budget was below 30 billion . And money don't matter for us after all we give more than 1 billion as aid u crazy wanka

Listen here you punk a$$ sucker, if you cannot post anything sensible then don't bother quoting me. I don't have any patience for keyboard warriors who post their jingoistic cr@p online and believe in their own fantasies.

Then Why the hell US operating 10 Nuclear powered carriers ? Ok got you point .They are fools

And what is the defence budget of USA you uneducated retard? Were you born this stupid or is it your diet?

Comparing India with a 46 billion dollar budget and comparing USA who has a defence budget more than the next 10 countries combined. USA has decades of experience building and operating SSN, SSBN, Aircraft carriers and all. What is the infrastructure, budget and experience of India?

Punks like you are fit for watching transformers and living in your fantasy world. Don't quote me again you born loser.

 

[Archie]

Carriers don't float on the sea for 12 months a year, they need repair and maintenance. How many months per year do you think a N powered carrier will have to stay at port?

USN has 10 CVNs
6 are operational at any point of time

French CVN is only available for 6 months in a year

so in my opinion
60% availability is what we should be looking at

Indian navy is targeting a 66% availability rate for its planned 3 carrier fleet
so that at least 2 remain operational at all time

 

[Srinivas]

First India needs to finalize the tonnage and other key aspects of AC so that future carriers needs less time for evaluation and training. INS Vishal should be the base design on which the future carriers will be built.

I think before the carrier, we need to ensure that a Proper CBG is in place

a decent Indian CBG will include 2 Kolkata class Destroyers, 2 Talwar/Shivalik class Frigates , 1 Kamorta class Corvette, 1 SSN, 1 Fleet Tanker

at present we can comfortably deploy 1 CBG, without hindering other operational requirements

2 CBGs will require at least a principle surface combatant fleet of 30 warships and 18 SSK/SSN
at present we are at 24 Surface combatants and 14 SSK/SSN

We also need nuke powered cruisers with massive air defence and attack capability.

USN has 10 CVNs
6 are operational at any point of time

French CVN is only available for 6 months in a year

so in my opinion
60% availability is what we should be looking at

Indian navy is targeting a 66% availability rate for its planned 3 carrier fleet
so that at least 2 remain operational at all time

It is not 3 AC's for sure, India needs atleast 4 to 5 ACs. I guess they will go for more in the coming decades as the strategic interests set to increase.

 

[Indian Patriot]

USN has 10 CVNs
6 are operational at any point of time

French CVN is only available for 6 months in a year

so in my opinion
60% availability is what we should be looking at

Indian navy is targeting a 66% availability rate for its planned 3 carrier fleet
so that at least 2 remain operational at all time

Having 2 conventional carriers is better than having a single nuclear powered carrier which will be available for only six months a year.

USN has 6 operational carriers at any point of time because they have the largest carrier force on the planet. India cannot match that. Operating a single nuclear carrier itself would put a lot of stress on their budget, the navy is better off operating diesel carriers at the moment. Nuclear carriers will have to wait for another 2 decades in the least.

 

[anant_s]

Having 2 conventional carriers is better than having a single nuclear powered carrier which will be available for only six months a year.

I don't get that.
What makes you believe the availability of 6 months per year.
Yes like any other AC, it requires maintenance and other Preventive maintenance checks, but it is no more than a conventional one.

 

[Indian Patriot]

What makes you believe the availability of 6 months per year.

French nuclear powered AC. What makes you believe India can build one so soon in the first place? How many AC have India built so far?

 

[migflug]

uk didnt went for nuclear as its too costly. Even they were pribably offered emal and nuke tech froM usa But they choose the conventional carrier . It show how costly nuke can be. I think we should go for nuke after 2025. vishal can be built in line with elizabeth

 

[Prajapati]

uk didnt went for nuclear as its too costly. Even they were pribably offered emal and nuke tech froM usa But they choose the conventional carrier . It show how costly nuke can be. I think we should go for nuke after 2025. vishal can be built in line with elizabeth

UK did not go for nuclear AC, since they did not want EMALS. They chose CATOBAR and an expensive and inefficient F-35 B which has vertical take off and landing.

Needless to say, they are regretting that now.

INS Vishal will take at least 2025-30 to become operational. EMALS need huge electric power which can only be provided by a Nuclear Reactor.

So if IN is going for EMALS as it plans too, Nuclear power is the only practical option. Advantage is that it provides more operational flexibility and range. Disadvantage is that its expensive.

 

[anant_s]

How many AC have India built so far?

There is always a first time and a starting point for everybody.
Remember even China hasn't had any experience of operating let alone building an AC, but it is now working on 4 (2 conventional and 2 nuclear) almost simultaneously.
Shipyards, do progress from one capability to another as far as tonnage of ships is concerned and i don't have a doubt on capability of Indian Shipyards in this context. Even Gas turbine AC that you are advocating (for initial ships) won't be much different from nuclear ships.

What makes you believe India can build one so soon in the first place?

INS Vikrant was laid down in 2009 and even with all the delays it is scheduled for trials in 2017-18. this experience makes me believe the next bigger ship can be completed in its manufacturing schedule of 8 years. Our industry has matured and learnt from this project and it certainly will help.

On your objections to N propulsion, do remember that IN has openly acknowledged use of N power for IAC 2 and in its position and requirement of ACs soon, i'm sure unless they are convinced about capabilities of our shipyards to manufacture an N powered ship, they'll never accept such a proposal. It is their capital budget for the project and hence hey are reasonably satisfied with industry capability to take up a project of this magnitude and complexity.

 

[Srinivas]

UK did not go for nuclear AC, since they did not want EMALS. They chose CATOBAR and an expensive and inefficient F-35 B which has vertical take off and landing.

Needless to say, they are regretting that now.

INS Vishal will take at least 2025-30 to become operational. EMALS need huge electric power which can only be provided by a Nuclear Reactor.

So if IN is going for EMALS as it plans too, Nuclear power is the only practical option. Advantage is that it provides more operational flexibility and range. Disadvantage is that its expensive.

I think INS Vishal will be ready by 2025 !

Most of the technologies are already there like IAC 1 once the carrier is laid it will take 2 to 3 years to go for sea trials at best considering cochin shipyard had already built a carrier and has experience.