Featured In Pakistan, Paris attacker's family praise his actions

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

what i don`t get is why would anyone want to do that? what kind of freedom of speech is that?

Don't reply to the Eurofascist Islamophobe.

Report.

I don't understand why you have quoted me when clearly you have your own innovated version of Islam. The door to redemption remains open till the very end. By ending someone's life you take away that chance of the creation to link up with the Creator. This is nothing to gloat over you have chosen a side against Allah.

That is a fiqh issue, look above at the Indian trolling gang. In India, human beings are killed for eating beef or belonging to the wrong caste, but these people in glass houses are abusing Pakistan and Islam here in this thread.

I am so glad our UAE brothers and sisters are taking action against Indian Hindu expats for their blasphemous, racist, Islamophobic, and sexist social media posts.

I will repeat all dear Pakistanis and allies, do not feed the Indian Hindu trolls. Do not reply to them. Do not give them any ammunition against you. Most of all do not belittle your fellow Pakistanis for their sake. We need to stand united. Our enemy is looking for any excuse to tarnish our nation and engaging in cultural theft of our IVC culture, ancient sites, scientists, history, and our produce/food even (Pink Salt and Biryani for example.)

Look here also a TTA playing dumb about the absolutely obscene and abusive Nazi-esque racist cartoons pushed by Hebdo.

@PAKISTANFOREVER @Musings @Verve @PakFactor @masterchief_mirza @Dalit @TNT @Mamluk @Areesh @Morpheus @waz @AgNoStiC MuSliM @The Accountant @The Eagle

 

[PDF]

Which part is blasphemous though?
I don't think Charlie Hebgo denied the existence of god/prophet of islam.... They drew a cartoon of the prophet of islam. Does that constitute as blasphemy per Quran or is it just forbidden?

Sheikh Yasir Qadhi, a Muslim scholar who lives in Tennessee, said Islamic law draws a distinction between making graven images, a statute that is not binding on non-Muslims, and portraying Mohammed in a vulgar or disrespectful manner, which is considered blasphemy.

Why images of Mohammed offend Muslims | CNN

Prohibitions against depicting the Prophet Mohammed may mystify many non-Muslims, but it speaks to a central tenet of Islam: the worship of God alone.

edition.cnn.com

For you, religion might just be a simple matter, but for me, my religion Islam is my identity.
Now before you comment further, Please research about Aqidah, Fiqh. Also read about the sources of Sharia, Quran > Hadith > IJtehad/Ijma > Qiyas

Which part is blasphemous though?

In September 2012, the newspaper published a series of satirical cartoons of Muhammad[PBUH], some of which feature nude caricatures of him.

Depictions of Muhammad - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I see that you did not get adequately informed about the matter and jumped to opine.

For Muslims , drawing living creatures generally such as humans e.t.c is forbidden. While for blasphemy, certain conditions must be matched. And it is not just limited to Prophet Muhammad (S.A.W). For us, All Prophets are beloved. Blasphemy also involves Burning of Quran and other disgusting acts.

I will advise you to please study adequately first before comenting on sensitive matters and on religion which you have ill-resourced knowledge and neither a follower of it.

Belief in Quran is must but so is belief in Hadiths. Now Hadiths also have different levels (Sahih, Zaeef etc) but I hope that you rather then commenting further on Islam without proper knowledge, will rather spend the time and energy to understand and research all these parts of Islam.

If it is forbidden per Quran then doesn't it only applies to Muslims? Like drinking alcohol is prohibited in islam, but that doesn't mean you would go around knifing everyone else for drinking a beer?

Let me also give you an example. Suppose, you hate Muslims alot. You want to kill all Muslims etc. That won't allow me to act against you in anyway. But suppose you destroy a Mosque and burn it down. Now, that is something I will act against.
Merely, not following my religious teachings or Islam or believing in Allah, Quran e.t.c is fine. You have every right to believe in your own ideology and principles/religion. But, you (Nauzubillah ) peeing on Quran or creating nudes or making mockery of the person who is someone we cherish more than ourselves, our money, our parents, our children... sorry, for us, that is unbearable. Call it Terrorism, Extremism, but for us, it is rather you who is terrorizing, acting extremely hurtful.

Note: here 'you' is used generally.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

but if otherwise, I stand by him

Then you're standing by a murderer and criminal.

Even if the laws call for the death penalty in the case of blasphemy, there is a reason 'due process' is necessary. The accused (of blasphemy) should be treated as innocent until guilt is proven in a court of law and the entire appeals process is exhausted.

There is absolutely NO justification for what this particular individual did, whether those he attacked were guilty of blasphemy or not.

He is a criminal and murderer - period.

 

[PDF]

Then you're standing by a murderer and criminal.

Even if the laws call for the death penalty in the case of blasphemy, there is a reason 'due process' is necessary. The accused (of blasphemy) should be treated as innocent until guilt is proved in a court of law and the entire appeals process is exhausted.

There is absolutely NO justification for what this particular individual did, whether those he attacked were guilty of blasphemy or not.

He is a criminal and murderer - period.

Due process where blasphemy is not a crime legally? The accused will never be a criminal there because the state does not recognize it as a crime.

I am standing by my beliefs and as long as they are coherent with Islam, I will proudly stand by it. And if they are not, I will correct myself and reject those beliefs.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Furthermore, if you reside in a country where there are no laws against blasphemy but you feel strongly about blasphemy, then the correct approaches are:

1. Petition, peacefully protest, lobby etc. for changes in the laws that make Blasphemy a criminal offense

2. Understand that the majority of the people in the country you live in do not care about making Blasphemy a criminal offense and respect the choice of the majority

3. Leave said country if Blasphemy is too much to bear for you

Please note that none of the above options include taking the law into your own hands and murdering or attempting to murder people you suspect of having committed blasphemy.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

Due process where blasphemy is not a crime legally? The accused will never be a criminal there because the state does not recognize it as a crime.

I am standing my my beliefs and as long as they are coherent with Islam, I will proudly stand by it. And if they are not, I will correct myself and reject those beliefs.

See my post above for residents in countries that do not have laws against blasphemy.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Sheikh Yasir Qadhi, a Muslim scholar who lives in Tennessee, said Islamic law draws a distinction between making graven images, a statute that is not binding on non-Muslims, and portraying Mohammed in a vulgar or disrespectful manner, which is considered blasphemy.

He knows all of this, but he is engaged in a disinformation campaign against Muslims and Pakistanis.

How did PDF make him a TTA in the first place?

I have seen some strange new additions as well who have insulted Islam, Pakistanis, or Muslims in the past.

We have to be careful, because who we promote to titles, they become a voice of this forum and it has a major effect on the image of this forum as a whole.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Then you're standing by a murderer and criminal.

Even if the laws call for the death penalty in the case of blasphemy, there is a reason 'due process' is necessary. The accused (of blasphemy) should be treated as innocent until guilt is proven in a court of law and the entire appeals process is exhausted.

There is absolutely NO justification for what this particular individual did, whether those he attacked were guilty of blasphemy or not.

He is a criminal and murderer - period.

I would love to delve into this topic with you and @PDF . Unfortunately we do have many spoilers here who are waiting for any chance to derail the thread and create drama throughout the forum.

This is why a Pakistani-only subforum (and if possible Muslim-only subforum) are needed to discuss these issues in detail.

 

[MilSpec]

Sheikh Yasir Qadhi, a Muslim scholar who lives in Tennessee, said Islamic law draws a distinction between making graven images, a statute that is not binding on non-Muslims, and portraying Mohammed in a vulgar or disrespectful manner, which is considered blasphemy.

Why images of Mohammed offend Muslims | CNN

Prohibitions against depicting the Prophet Mohammed may mystify many non-Muslims, but it speaks to a central tenet of Islam: the worship of God alone.

edition.cnn.com

For you, religion might just be a simple matter, but for me, my religion Islam is my identity.
Now before you comment further, Please research about Aqidah, Fiqh. Also read about the sources of Sharia, Quran > Hadith > IJtehad/Ijma > Qiyas



In September 2012, the newspaper published a series of satirical cartoons of Muhammad[PBUH], some of which feature nude caricatures of him.

Depictions of Muhammad - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I see that you did not get adequately informed about the matter and jumped to opine.

For Muslims , drawing living creatures generally such as humans e.t.c is forbidden. While for blasphemy, certain conditions must be matched. And it is not just limited to Prophet Muhammad (S.A.W). For us, All Prophets are beloved. Blasphemy also involves Burning of Quran and other disgusting acts.

I will advise you to please study adequately first before comenting on sensitive matters and on religion which you have ill-resourced knowledge and neither a follower of it.

Belief in Quran is must but so is belief in Hadiths. Now Hadiths also have different levels (Sahih, Zaeef etc) but I hope that you rather then commenting further on Islam without proper knowledge, will rather spend the time and energy to understand and research all these parts of Islam.



Let me also give you an example. Suppose, you hate Muslims alot. You want to kill all Muslims etc. That won't allow me to act against you in anyway. But suppose you destroy a Mosque and burn it down. Now, that is something I will act against.
Merely, not following my religious teachings or Islam or believing in Allah, Quran e.t.c is fine. You have every right to believe in your own ideology and principles/religion. But, you (Nauzubillah ) peeing on Quran or creating nudes or making mockery of the person who is someone we cherish more than ourselves, our money, our parents, our children... sorry, for us, that is unbearable. Call it Terrorism, Extremism, but for us, it is rather you who is terrorizing, acting extremely hurtful.

Note: here 'you' is used generally.

First off, I apologize for not knowing much about any religion. So I will tread lightly.

I will cede, that is Blasphemy per Islam as you say.

Merely, not following my religious teachings or Islam or believing in Allah, Quran e.t.c is fine. You have every right to believe in your own ideology and principles/religion.

I am not trying to cherry pick from your post and have read it in it's entirety, and let me know if comes around that way.
What happens when someone else's ideology/religion just by it's fundamental nature is blasphemous to islam?
Every atheist in the world completely denies the existence of god as a concept including the Islamic version... Would you go around knifing all of them? Similarly, other Abrahamic religions are not that accepting of the Islamic prophet, as Islam is of them. What do you do when you come across beliefs and religion that just by thier mere existence and practice - Deny the legitimacy of Islamic teachings?

And the irony is, the most hated religion on "this" forum, actually has no such traits of denying anyone of the right to believe what they want to.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

This is my last post in relation to the topic of the OP.

 

[PDF]

First off, I apologize for not knowing much about any religion. So I will tread lightly.

I will cede, that is Blasphemy per Islam as you say.


I am not trying to cherry pick from your post and have read it in it's entirety, and let me know if comes around that way.
What happens when someone else's ideology/religion just by it's fundamental nature is blasphemous to islam?
Every atheist in the world completely denies the existence of god as a concept including the Islamic version... Would you go around knifing all of them? Similarly, other Abrahamic religions are not that accepting of the Islamic prophet, as Islam is of them. What do you do when you come across beliefs and religion that just by thier mere existence and practice - Deny the legitimacy of Islamic teachings?

And the irony is, the most hated religion on "this" forum, actually has no such traits of denying anyone of the right to believe what they want to.

Every Muslim is bound to respect other religions as it is something Islam obligates us. We don't have problem if you want to follow your religion even if it is against Islam. For example, For a Muslim, the biggest sin undisputedly is Kufr & Shirk, yet in most of religions including Christianity, Hinduism etc, it is part of their religion. We never go around a killing spree based for that and if we would, we will be going against our religious teachings and should be given death.
But, I hope you understand that no religion has its fundamental teachings to create nudes of religious individuals or of most beloved Prophet or promotes burning of Quran or other religious scriptures.
I mean, even for athiests, it is only natural to find all such acts intrinstically wrong.
I might be biased but is it only me who finds this wrong?

Anyways, I would like to not participate further in this thread because I will confess, I myself have limited knowledge and I am not a learnt Islamic Scholar. To have better authority on this subject, kindly approach a credible Islamic Scholar ( I am sure, you can findly plenty in India). I have expressed myself fairly much and also tried to speak to all in a good manner and with proper ettiquettes.

Have a good day/night!

 

[Trango Towers]

This is great! We just need to keep sharing these videos/evidences with the world. This is the same as when millions of Pakistanis rejoiced for Osama Bin Laden for the 9/11 attacks. Nothing has changed in their mentality since then...nothing will in my opinion. Western countries will be safer by denying Pakistanis visas based on its tacit/idealogical support of terrorism.

When was the last time you got raped. We can share that with the world too.

 

[Pan-Islamic-Pakistan]

Anyways, I would like to not participate further in this thread because I will confess, I myself have limited knowledge and I am not a learnt Islamic Scholar. To have better authority on this subject, kindly approach a credible Islamic Scholar ( I am sure, you can findly plenty in India). I have expressed myself fairly much and also tried to speak to all in a good manner and with proper ettiquettes.

Have a good day/night!

You are too nice and humble of a person my brother. I know that it is very difficult in Pakistani nature to think ill of someone, esp those of different religion or race. This is one of our best characteristics.

These Indian trolls do not have our mannerisms, no, actually they know full well what they are doing.

They know that abuse of Prophet hurts us deeply, and they willfully spread this all over social media they insult Umme ul Mu'mineen, they mock Shariah/Fiqh, they try to discredit the Quran w lies, and the try to harrass Muslim females.

These are not people who we can reason with.

Look here, what do these Indian trolls gain here? It is just another arrow they can use to try to tarnish Pakistan's image.

We don't go around saying every Hindu is a cow vigilante, but they do go around saying every Muslim is a killer, terrorist, etc.

Our mindsets are totally different. We must understand that we are speaking to adherents of a fascist ideology (not only RSS either.)

How long will Kashmiris suffer due to our lack of resolve in dealing with this menace? How long will Indian Muslims live in fear for their fathers, mothers, and children?

@xeuss @Mad Scientist 2.0

 

[Mutakalim]

no it does Not fall under the category of Blasphemy, falls under innovation

And how is that innovation?

 

[Mutakalim]

Religion is made up as they go along. Prophet pbuh was forgiving. He broke the walls of the hearts not heads

He P.BU.H also fought battles for His cause. Why you people forgot that?