in its current form blk2 how effective is the JF17 against the bulk of IAF

[DJ_Viper]

If we get the planned induction of 150-300 fighters with the majority upgraded with Aesa etc all data linked with Awacs and each other

They will form a formidable force against any other aircraft

Absolutely, any jet with net-centric capability, high off boresight missiles and advance BVR's with an AESA would provide a serious force to challenge in 300-400 numbers.

I would even suggest that Pakistan should modify 40-60 K-8's with the JFT's block I's pulse Doppler radar and arm them with two SD-10's also. That can form a nice, sub-sonic point defense system able to shoot out to 50 miles if some attackers break first two defensive tiers.

 

[C130]

Hilarious counter post. I would've given you a positive rating if I could, due to the perfect, yet comic come back. A smile even with sarcasm is much better than some crazy member here threatening each other with nukes. Good post



Bro, which block are you comparing it to? I can write about "the F-16", but I would be super off as each bought additional capability and some, an entirely new plane. Is the above limited to the JF-17 block I? Because in block II, some of these issues are going to be negated as the AESA is going to get block II and III's upgraded with it, add conformal fuel tanks and HMD / IRST too. So your comparison is with the basic block I essentially.

I was talking blk II and III. I was going to add that each blk add improvement like AESA and HMD.

but you can only do so much with the airframe you got. Mig-29/35 is just better IMHO.

to add JF17 BLOCK-II has Spanish EW suit with better capabilities.


In short radius involved between India and Pak the long range of non stealthy Su30 plays no role further Russian AAms are not reliable along with other tech problems in SU30 MKIs.

Mirage 2000 is good for ground attack but in A to A warfare not bettter than F16. Mig29s are also not that good, their IRST is useless.

the more fuel you got the better, long time in the air for CAP. I guess if you are talking about scrambles, but CAP is important for AIR SUPERIORITY.

it's true JF-17 has a smaller RCS than the Su-30 but it's not a game changer. the Su-30 large radar and supermaneuverability more than makes up for it's large size.

 

[Trango Towers]

JF-17 was only meant to replace our old Aircraft such as Sabres and Mirages - I don't get why people think it's some kind of a cutting edge miracle plane.

What a stupid comment. Sabres?? Please employ your brain before your keyboard.
Jf17 is a very capable aircraft that now has the ability to not only replace aircraft like the mig 21 or its variants, mirages and others like the F5. It can fight and beat the f16 and mig 29 and many others. Then put in the pilot training and you have a mean machine. So either do your research or just stay quiet

 

[Talwar e Pakistan]

ok then what exactly is it?

Sabres were our backbone; so now JF-17s will replace it.

 

[Path-Finder]

Sabres were our backbone; so now JF-17s will replace it.

Sabres were of a bygone era which cannot even compare to JF17!! more importantly does the backbone not engage in combat?

 

[DJ_Viper]

I was talking blk II and III. I was going to add that each blk add improvement like AESA and HMD.

but you can only do so much with the airframe you got. Mig-29/35 is just better IMHO..

I don't know about Mig-29 (older models), but the SU-35 is of-course much better (there is no Mig-35, I assume you were referring to the SU-35). They compare the SU-35 directly with F-15SA, and in the same class as the EFT and Rafale. In fact, they say that the maneuverability and speed are beyond F-15SA. So that speaks volumes. While the Mig-29 was designed to dogfight the 80's F-16's. Can you upgrade it? Yes, many have. But at the end of the day, it is a much older platform with limitations inside the air frame due to space not allocated properly and heavier metals used, plus heavy maintenance too.

Also, with respect to the JFT, these are entirely different class of jets and there shouldn't be a comparison to be frank. Both Mig-29 and SU-35 are twin engine, heavy jets with more payload. The SU-35 costs like a Rafale too. So for 40% of the cost of SU-35, if you can lift half the weapons, have similar tech and weapons, build numbers and locally manufacture them (for a poor country like Pakistan), the JFT makes all the sense. With good sensors, AESA and good BVR missiles and 300-400 of these puppies flying over the Pakistani airspace in case of a war, who would want to go in, knowing they can lock and fire at you from 50-60 miles away. So for the cost of 150 SU-35, a country with less financial power like Pakistan can in house build and deploy 350-400 JFT's with similar tech that of the SU-35. That's pretty damn impressive and cost effective, and with huge numbers.

 

[BRAVO_]

i dont wanna go in details of previous blocks nor i will compare it with any other since the role of them was to replace the aggaing PAF fleet, but JF-17 Block-3 will not be jsut a continuation of earlier blocks, it would be a new fighter designed to accomodate AESA and IRST. for this purpose they need to enlarge the airframe as well as use a higher proportion of composite materials and a more powerful engine i.e. RD-93MA further they can increase the cockpit visibility and optical awareness as well and this block would be able to take down any aircraft

 

[Sully3]

all of the above not good.

Mirage 2000 upgraded with RDY-2,MICA, HMD
Mig-29 upgraded before upgrade could handle F-16's
Su-30MKI is leagues above the JF-17 and F-16

Pakistan needs something better and in numbers.

didn't the Turks shoot down the su 30 near their border.

 

[DJ_Viper]

In short radius involved between India and Pak the long range of non stealthy Su30 plays no role further Russian AAms are not reliable along with other tech problems in SU30 MKIs.

Mirage 2000 is good for ground attack but in A to A warfare not bettter than F16. Mig29s are also not that good, their IRST is useless.

These are not accurate statements. Specially for the Mirage. Mica, Meteor are some of the best missiles out there. A Meteor chasing you pretty much means put your finger right next to the eject button for quick exist as you might need it.

didn't the Turks shoot down the su 30 near their border.

No, it was an older SU-34 sort of the Jaguar of Russia, a strike air craft without missiles. Shortly after that, the Russians did deploy SU-30's with their BVR weapons. The Russians locked onto Turk F-16's the second they took off from their airfields. The Turks remained about 30-50 miles inside their borders the entire time .

I read a post elsewhere by a Russian pilot that for 5 days after that incident and when these guys were deployed, he flew every mission with a constant lock onto 2-4 Turkish F-16's. That has to be a crazy feeling on the Turkish pilot's end who knows he's flying with a constant lock beep in his ears the whole time he's airborne.