How to Save U.S.-Pakistan Relations from the Brink of Disaster

[Reichsmarschall]

All this time you did dirty work for US in Afghanistan, allowed them to use Pakistani bases for attacking USSR, NA, TTP, Taliban. Allowed them to bomb Pakistanis, mistakenly PA personnel too. And then you claim that they are our daddy. Wake up and see the reality.
USA didn't change its policies, just that you are of no use to them and are discarded by them. Your relationship was not of father son but of a....you did dirty work, were pounded and not useful now. That is why you are not getting any money for using your base or free planes.
That's why you are asking China for alms in return of using Pakistani port, bases, roads.

what you call dirty work we call it self-interest,

 

[LeGenD]

All this time you did dirty work for US in Afghanistan, allowed them to use Pakistani bases for attacking USSR, NA, TTP, Taliban. Allowed them to bomb Pakistanis, mistakenly PA personnel too. And then you claim that they are our daddy. Wake up and see the reality.
USA didn't change its policies, just that you are of no use to them and are discarded by them. Your relationship was not of father son but of a....you did dirty work, were pounded and not useful now. That is why you are not getting any money for using your base or free planes.
That's why you are asking China for alms in return of using Pakistani port, bases, roads.

Actually this matter is not so black and white.

Both countries benefited from this relationship one way or the other. Pakistan benefited in the context of its national security (i.e. arms purchases and nuclear program) and US benefited in the context of checkmating expansion of communism in the region. Pakistan also brought US and China to the negotiation table; and these two became largest trading partners of each other later.

The ongoing War on Terror is in the interests of both countries as well.

The purpose of this thread is to highlight the need to redefine terms of engagement with the US, in a positive way. The scope of this relationship should extend beyond the arms purchases.

 

[tarrar]

Pakistan & US relation should be a controlled one. US should not be given unlimited access to anything, because so called US Embassy in Pakistan itself is a major threat to Pakistan & is filled with CIA & Black water operatives. We have seem with the passage of time. Efforts should be made to convert the so called US Embassy which in reality is a fort for CIA & Black water & turn it into ONLY US Embassy & nothing else.

US has always back stabbed Pakistan & have always left Pakistan in the moment of crisis. They cannot be trusted one bit, US & India new relation against Pakistan & China is a proof of it.

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

I am not sure about that.

The US:

1. Checkmated the monopoly of OPEC recently. Assault on Iraq and Libya and focus on domestic oil production were all steps towards this end.
2. Is moving towards energy self-sufficiency with focus on domestic oil and shale gas production, and promotion of electric automobiles. In a span of 20 years, this shift will be almost complete.
3. Took advantage of unrest in Syria and checkmated Russian designs there. For now.
4. Is looking for ways to reduce its dependence on China for economic matters. India is perceived as a viable alternative for this purpose.
5. China-containment initiative in effect via renewed terms of engagement with India and Vietnam. Signals are positive for the US so far.
6. Stopped Iran from going nuclear.
7. Friendly regime in Afghanistan.

Contrary to the popular belief in some circles, US is doing very well in the geopolitical arena.

Anti-American sentiments - within some states - are toothless affairs and largely restricted to discussions only. They do not translate to real-time impact anywhere. Americans understand a fact - control over the governments across the world. That is what matters in the end. The art of imperialism.

---

Mahmoud Ahmedinejad used to shout against the US day and night. But what happened in the end? A compromise was reached with the US on nuclear front. And Ahmedinejad left the office with dignity.

Now, Tayyip Erdogan is shouting against the US day and night. This is also a political stunt to look strong and give the impression that Turkey has an independent foreign policy. In reality, Erdogan wants to consolidate his power in the country. Nothing else will change.

I wish the USA were that powerful...

 

[Hamza913]

The American senate set a condition that Pakistan will have to pay full price of any weapon it purchases from the US. No more concessions.


That was not the case, my friend.

A member here got it right. US looked the other way.

@The_Sidewinder

Do not turn this thread into another pointless Pakistan versus India debate. This thread is about Pak-US relations only. Thank you.

The US was obviously against it, why else would they place sanctions?

We can spare this debate. You or I was not present to confirm either of the theories. Any ways, dig was aimed at that hypocrite, not you.



yeah, we didnt broke pakistan into two. East Pakistan was not freed. Since when casuality of 2500 on Indian side is lower than Pakistani casuality of 9000 killed 25000 injured. Not to mention 90,000 POWs. Spare me the bias, if Indian forces were not involved, war wouldnt have gotten oven soon.



India just countered Pakistani plans, were one step ahead all the time, beaten back all Pakistani attempt to recapture Siachen. So we are proud of our forces.



India is in far advantageous position now then when we fought you guys previously. Its high time, you stop downplaying Indian victories & living of distraughted history fed to you. Your leaders always aspired to capture Kashmir from Indian graps, tried to instigate rebelion in Kashmir in 1965 but India did better and broken Pakistan into two in 1971.

My advice, learn lessons from history, move on. Learn from Your two eastern neighbours, and focus on the path of development.

You and I were not present, but it doesn't take a genius to realise forcibly converting hundred of millions of people is impossible unless you outnumber them heavily, which the Arabs didn't.

India didn't have 2,500 casualties, India had 4,000 deaths. As for Pakistan, those 9,000 deaths were over the entire 8 months. In the last 2 weeks of the war when India entered, we lost 3,000 men. If you want to say our casualties were 9,000, then you have to include all those Bangaldeshi militants as part of your casualties. And as I said, you didn't do it alone. You joined in after Bangladesh did most of the work.

As for the Siachen, yes well done you guys did good, but it's not some victory of great magnitude, you didn't crippled Pakistan or even make us feel vulnerable. It's nothing that is really worth gloating about decades later.

No, India is not in a higher position now. We have nuclear weapons now, so if you start something, we are more than capable of putting India back into the Stone Age. We are in a MAD situation, nobody has an edge over anyone. It's high time you stop acting like India is so much more powerful or better than Pakistan because it's not.

My advice, give 60% of your nation their well deserved toilets.

 

[Sergi]

The US was obviously against it, why else would they place sanctions?



You and I were not present, but it doesn't take a genius to realise forcibly converting hundred of millions of people is impossible unless you outnumber them heavily, which the Arabs didn't.

India didn't have 2,500 casualties, India had 4,000 deaths. As for Pakistan, those 9,000 deaths were over the entire 8 months. In the last 2 weeks of the war when India entered, we lost 3,000 men. If you want to say our casualties were 9,000, then you have to include all those Bangaldeshi militants as part of your casualties. And as I said, you didn't do it alone. You joined in after Bangladesh did most of the work.

As for the Siachen, yes well done you guys did good, but it's not some victory of great magnitude, you didn't crippled Pakistan or even make us feel vulnerable. It's nothing that is really worth gloating about decades later.

No, India is not in a higher position now. We have nuclear weapons now, so if you start something, we are more than capable of putting India back into the Stone Age. We are in a MAD situation, nobody has an edge over anyone. It's high time you stop acting like India is so much more powerful or better than Pakistan because it's not.

My advice, give 60% of your nation their well deserved toilets.

I like the the way you think I hope rest of your countrymen also share your opinions.
Suits us well.

 

[Hamza913]

If you think US did not invade Pakistan after 9/11 because Pakistan had nukes.. I would only say let there be more people like you in Pakistan.

Do you think Islamic militants having nukes is a good thing for anyone?

I like the the way you think I hope rest of your countrymen also share your opinions.
Suits us well.

Don't worry, we do.

 

[PAKISTANFOREVER]

Lol.....let the americans give us 200 F-22s and 100 F-35s for free with TOT and then we'll be okay with them.

 

[The_Sidewinder]

The US was obviously against it, why else would they place sanctions?



You and I were not present, but it doesn't take a genius to realise forcibly converting hundred of millions of people is impossible unless you outnumber them heavily, which the Arabs didn't.

India didn't have 2,500 casualties, India had 4,000 deaths. As for Pakistan, those 9,000 deaths were over the entire 8 months. In the last 2 weeks of the war when India entered, we lost 3,000 men. If you want to say our casualties were 9,000, then you have to include all those Bangaldeshi militants as part of your casualties. And as I said, you didn't do it alone. You joined in after Bangladesh did most of the work.

As for the Siachen, yes well done you guys did good, but it's not some victory of great magnitude, you didn't crippled Pakistan or even make us feel vulnerable. It's nothing that is really worth gloating about decades later.

No, India is not in a higher position now. We have nuclear weapons now, so if you start something, we are more than capable of putting India back into the Stone Age. We are in a MAD situation, nobody has an edge over anyone. It's high time you stop acting like India is so much more powerful or better than Pakistan because it's not.

My advice, give 60% of your nation their well deserved toilets.

About the nuclear weapons, thats a game changer. Yeah we may go down to stone age, but Pakistan will too seige to exist.

About toilet part, work will be over by 2018. Keep track of swach bharat mission.

 

[aamerjamal]

Well Its Official now that We are not aligned with US any more..... eastern block is ready... for official statement check today's interior ministers speech.....(we are realigned)
Didnt realize but we are actually King maker and breaker of the world

 

[Hakikat ve Hikmet]

It did afterwards.



It's impossible to forcibly convert hundreds of millions of people, the majority of us clearly converted out of our own free will, the truth might sting but most of our ancestors embraced Islam because they liked it.

FFS I'm getting sick and tired of Indians riding on the success of 1971. You suffered higher casualties, and did not break us in two. You helped a tiny piece of us gain independence, that's incredibly different. It wasn't in 2 weeks either, Bangladesh had been fighting us for 8 months prior your involvement, India only came in near the end.

As for the Siachen, yes well done you have crippled Pakistan by taking that Glacier. We must all bow down to your great strength and cannot sleep at night knowing you took most of the Siachen. Our lives have been over ever since that day, please forgive us.

It's high time you guys stopped exaggerating and living off past victories.

If I were managing the doctrines of the Pak Ordu, I'd have been showing the above picture over and over again starting from the military academies. Let the world be destroyed but not that picture again. Fear is no policy and surrender is no option....

 

[dadeechi]

Do you think Islamic militants having nukes is a good thing for anyone?

Why do you say that? Are you saying that if someone invades Pakistan, Pakistan's army would hand over the nukes to the terrorists?

 

[Hamza913]

Why do you say that? Are you saying that if someone invades Pakistan, Pakistan's army would hand over the nukes to the terrorists?

The militants would probably want them, and I think the army would either launch them or give let them have em. If someone invades your country, you would be pissed too and make a similar decision. Even if the army says no, the militants could take a few warheads forcibly.

About the nuclear weapons, thats a game changer. Yeah we may go down to stone age, but Pakistan will too seige to exist.

About toilet part, work will be over by 2018. Keep track of swach bharat mission.

Pakistan won't cease to exist, you don't aphave enough warheads for that and neither do we. We will both just end up living like cavemen.

 

[The_Sidewinder]

Pakistan won't cease to exist, you don't aphave enough warheads for that and neither do we. We will both just end up living like cavemen.

Grim reality, but its the way things are. I hope sanity prevails. These useless wars & proxy wars only hampering our progress.

 

[dadeechi]

Grim reality, but its the way things are. I hope sanity prevails. These useless wars & proxy wars only hampering our progress.

War has never been and will never be the solution.