Gunmen kill retired general in Rawalpindi shooting

[Solomon2]

I accept the correction. I did not read the article carefully enough. I'll try not to let that happen again.

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

My one concern here is the link being created, IMO prematurely and without any major evidence, between whatever alleged dirt Gen. Alvi had on these generals to some sort of plot with the Taliban.

This alleged 'plot' especially doesn't make sense if it is along the lines of what has been suggested so far - of the general or generals paying Mehsud off to not attack PA troops.

It doesn't make sense because one view of the Tribes has always been that 'they cannot be bought, but they can be rented'. Reports suggested that even under the current GoP, pro-Government militant commanders like the late Haji Namdar were paid off to ensure continued loyalty to the GoP and fight against the TTP.

As such, combined with the GoP's preference for 'peace deals' with the militants under Gen. Musharraf, attempts to 'buy' peace would not have been anything extraordinary, and in line with policies since the Afghan jihad, when some of the Mujahideen commanders were also essentially 'bought off' to ensure some modicum of obedience.

 

[rangerssg]

I am not in Pakistan.
I dont think Mumbai attacks have anything to do with my fathers death. The problem is which no one realizes is too much fanaticism has really invaded our country.
This war is not about US or foreign masters or whatever you call them i think we need to straighten things out for our own self . We cant let people terrorize other countries and drag our countrys name into every episode of terrorism that takes place in the world. Most of the militants who get caught in NORThern waziristan are not Pakistanis . They are foreign fighters . Why are they using our land to spread violence . IN the end every incident of terrorism that takes place gets blamed on Pakistan .
I dont think if we fight against people bringing a bad name to our country is an isult to brother hood or unity i think its time to unite against the bad elements in our country

 

[blain2]

RangerSSG,

My own advice to you would be that discussing your father's murder on a public forum like this would get you nowhere. If anything, every Tom, Dick or Harry gets to comment on your late father and you have already seen some of the misinformed and outright disrespectful comments made. This happens all the while others are busy trying to tarnish the very reputation of the institute (Pakistan Army) that your father cherished.

You will not get any answers here from any of the armchair experts. Your father's murder should be pursued by the Pakistani authorities and by you and your family writing to the Army and other concerned authorities in Pakistan.

Anybody else trying to help you out is doing so out of sheer ulterior motives as they neither understand the issues your father had nor are they aware of the nature of his disagreement with his peers. Also since nobody really knows who is behind the murder of your father, all this forum is doing is giving some individuals a chance to sling dirt on the Pakistan Army. Your father did not give in to the inducement of bribes by the politicians only to safeguard the reputation of the Pakistan Army. I salute him for that but would also ask you to hold back on offering any other information that would harm you, your family or the reputation of the Pakistan Army.

I personally think that your father's retirement from the Army and his murder are both immense losses for the Pakistan Army. In his death, what he cherished (I.E. Pakistan Army) must be preserved. If I were you, I would be personally writing to the CoAS and other concerned authorities about this.

The family of Gen Asif Nawaz (Late CoAS) went about the investigation of his death through proper channels by writing to his successor and other law enforcement authorities. I suggest you try to approach this issue in a similar manner.

 

[Prodigy17]

The answer to your question EPOOL is already on the thread. She published it as soon as she got out of the country after the killing. She describes where she was in the article which was with the Pakistan Army, so your suggestion no-one knows who she is is rubbish. If she had attempted to publish the letter while she was still in the country and they had found out she had it, with the two generals names on it, she would also have been dead.

.

The answer is hillarious and so is the logic construed by you. The discerning will be clearly able to see the joke here. The writer receives the letter while she was with PA????? Oh really, so did the general send the letter to her address in UK but the letter was redirected by UK post to her unknown location with PA in the midst of battle. Or, the general sent the letter on the address of PA units fighting in that area with carefully written instruction that the letter must be opened and published by Ms Schofield??????? Can this logic be termed anything more than ludicrous eyewash????????
I mean, i don't know whether the letter was sent by the general or not but the timing of publication for this alleged letter is really amusing in the current scenario. The logic for late publication or more specifically in the aftermath of mumbai incident while the general was killed a month ago is hillarious and dubious to say the least.

 

[heathcliff_45]

Its regretfull that some members made you feel harsh but i Doubt anyone meant offence to the spirited soldier General Alvi Was , Collegues Have Differences ,He Must Have His Share With Seniors He Disagreed With


All I May Is That I Feel Ashamed To Watch Fellow Bretherns Wash Dirty Lenin In Public I Am Our Matter Should Not Be A Talk Of The Town THousands Of Miles Abroad !

Kindly clarify

 

[oneman]

The answer is hillarious and so is the logic construed by you. The discerning will be clearly able to see the joke here. The writer receives the letter while she was with PA????? Oh really, so did the general send the letter to her address in UK but the letter was redirected by UK post to her unknown location with PA in the midst of battle. Or, the general sent the letter on the address of PA units fighting in that area with carefully written instruction that the letter must be opened and published by Ms Schofield??????? Can this logic be termed anything more than ludicrous eyewash????????
I mean, i don't know whether the letter was sent by the general or not but the timing of publication for this alleged letter is really amusing in the current scenario. The logic for late publication or more specifically in the aftermath of mumbai incident while the general was killed a month ago is hillarious and dubious to say the least.

PRODIGY17 you are a complete idiot. You havent even read the article where she says the general gave her the letter over dinner in the Talking Fish restaurant in Islamabad. So all of your hogwash above just demonstrates how stupid you are to comment on something when you know nothing about it. She also says she was with the Pakistan Army when she heard of his death. It was not until she got back to London that she could do anything about the letter. Go read the article and then read the letter and then you might have something worthwhile talking about.

Frankly I agree with Blain2 in that there has to be a proper investigation and that has to involve not just the Pakistan Army but the police investigating the general's murder. Until that inquiry investigates and makes a ruling there is nothing worthwhile saying other than to offer condolences and and press for a thorough and proper investigation. My only interventions here have been to correct errors in the known facts but until now they were all errors from people who had read the article and just drawn false conclusions. You havent even bothered to read the article.

 

[ghazi]

General Alvi's murder shows who is running the country- ISI.
Democratically elected leaders are just puppets & afraid of ISI.
A.Q. Khan's restrictions - to block information on ISI involvement in nuclear trade
BB's murder- smells ISI ***
Mumbai attack - Totally ISI plan,blocking UK enquiry of suspects
Taliban & Al qaeda leaders- protected by ISI

Transparency, honesty and truth essential ingredients for democracy lacking in the country.

 

[Kharian_Beast]

^ another armchair general with s*** for brains...

 

[AgNoStiC MuSliM]

General Alvi's murder shows who is running the country- ISI.
Democratically elected leaders are just puppets & afraid of ISI.
A.Q. Khan's restrictions - to block information on ISI involvement in nuclear trade
BB's murder- smells ISI ***
Mumbai attack - Totally ISI plan,blocking UK enquiry of suspects
Taliban & Al qaeda leaders- protected by ISI

Transparency, honesty and truth essential ingredients for democracy lacking in the country.

Yes, and the frequent reports of extraterrestrials have also been linked to a high ranking ISI official according to 'unnamed intelligence sources' who stated it was an 'Aha moment' when they discovered that the ISI general's calling card had been used to make several calls to Mars.

In fact, the cut pattern on various crop circles found around the world has been traced to certain Al-Ghazi Tractors purchased by the ISI on a company card.

 

[pkpatriotic]

Write-up on Alavi murder termed slander
Tuesday, December 16, 2008
By Shakil Shaikh

ISLAMABAD: The Pakistan Army has denied any involvement of some military officers in the murder of former SSG commander Maj-Gen (retd) Amir Faisal Alavi, who was gunned down last month.

“It is a baseless and unfounded allegation, as it’s mala fide of the author of the report and apparently part of a propaganda campaign to malign Pakistan and its institutions,” a senior security official told The News on Monday.

A British paper carried a sensational write-up by Carey Schofield, claiming that Alavi knew he would be killed by his own comrades, because he “threatened to expose Pakistani generals who made deals with Taliban militants.”

Alavi was gunned down last month. However, the British writer gave a new twist to the murder by saying that Alavi was murdered after he threatened to “furnish all relevant proof” about two Pakistan Army generals.

Carey Schofield has been collecting material on the Pakistan Army for last two years and visiting various garrisons and military installations on the pretext of writing a book “Inside the Pakistan Army”, which she intends to get published next year by Soap Box Books. In this process, she had met many military officers and often prolonged her stay at different locations to get maximum material.

A senior security source said the investigation into Maj-Gen Alavi’s murder was currently under way and was being conducted by a joint investigation team led by a police officer. ìObviously, there will be institutional input in this case by the concerned people,î the source said.

Alavi, who held both Pakistani and British nationalities, was retired prematurely by the then Army chief General Pervez Musharraf three years earlier on account of “conduct unbecoming.”He was sacked much before the Lal Masjid Operation in Islamabad and was heading an organisation — the REDtone Telecommunications Pakistan Pvt Ltd — at the time of his murder.

The source confirmed that the Army high command had restored Alavi’s plots and benefits on his request made to Chief of Army Staff General Ashfaq Parvez Kayani some months back.

“Alavi was interviewed by senior officials at the GHQ on his request,” said the source, adding the subject of any deal with militants, as alleged in the said report, was never raised or indicated by him in his interactions. “His last application was received only days prior to his unfortunate death and was under process for decision,” said the source.

Many military officers, who were contacted on this issue by The News, linked Alavi’s murder with his domestic issues. Many see some sectarian element behind his killing as well, a probability which investigators are not ruling out. Alavi’s affair with an Islamabad-based woman is also being quoted as another area of conflict resulting in his assassination.

 

[XYON]

Here is a link to the alleged letter:http://extras.timesonline.co.uk/letters.pdf

Strangely, the letter is not dated (typical way of dating an official letter written by the Army folks) nor is it signed by the late General (in order to verify authenticity of signatures). To make the case more plausible, how was it sent? by Courier (receipt copy would have been good), faxed (land-line records can be traced) or hand-delivered (where is the receipt of delivery)?

 

[bhishmar]

[size=-1]... I dont think Mumbai attacks have anything to do with my fathers death. The problem is which no one realizes is too much fanaticism has really invaded our country.
This war is not about US or foreign masters or whatever you call them i think we need to straighten things out for our own self . We cant let people terrorize other countries and drag our countrys name into every episode of terrorism that takes place in the world. Most of the militants who get caught in NORThern waziristan are not Pakistanis . They are foreign fighters . Why are they using our land to spread violence . IN the end every incident of terrorism that takes place gets blamed on Pakistan .
I dont think if we fight against people bringing a bad name to our country is an isult to brother hood or unity i think its time to unite against the bad elements in our country[/size]

mam
I understand from posts here that your dad was a honest, straightforward & no-nonsense person, a professional and brave soldier who led from the front, and above all a loving human being. He has also renounced his British nationality, to serve in the army of the country he loved.
His death in such a manner is indeed a tragic waste of human life, & a great loss to YOU & your country. Please accept my hearfelt condolences, may his soul rest in peace.

I do agree with your observations above, as I am sure a major segment of the moderate & rational segment in the Pakistani polity will. But it is also true that a significant (& vocal) portion will be in disagreement of these views, at least some of it. I am also aware that, the currently charged atmosphere between our nations, has put pressure on the moderate segment and influenced in hardening their views.

Without going to much details of these, which obviously will be controversial territory, I can state some facts which I feel falls in common ground.
I definitely feel that this personal tragedy in your life & its aftermath has indeed occurred (OR rather coincided) at a very inopportune moment. Even though the Mumbai terror incidents have nothing to do with your fathers death, there is a rather unfortunate coincidence in the timing of these events. I do not think this coincidence is by design, but quite accidental, but it will certainly complicate matters regarding any investigation (if any) in to his gruesome murder. It will be very unfortunate if the killers go scott free, since the officials feel that any investigation will be bad publicity to the army & Pakistan in general at this juncture, and I fear that mostly it will be the case.

So you have become an unfortunate victim of circumstances, and I can only sympathize with that, though i reckon u must be intelligent enough to infer this without any help.

Let me conclude by stating that, this event should prompt to increase the resolve of all moderate Pakistanis, into setting your house in order, without any body else asking for that, as rightly pointed out by you. Let it be the greatest tribute you can pay for such a great & courageous soldier. Let his death do not go waste.

 

[must7]

RangerSSG,

My own advice to you would be that discussing your father's murder on a public forum like this would get you nowhere. If anything, every Tom, Dick or Harry gets to comment on your late father and you have already seen some of the misinformed and outright disrespectful comments made. This happens all the while others are busy trying to tarnish the very reputation of the institute (Pakistan Army) that your father cherished.

You will not get any answers here from any of the armchair experts. Your father's murder should be pursued by the Pakistani authorities and by you and your family writing to the Army and other concerned authorities in Pakistan.

Anybody else trying to help you out is doing so out of sheer ulterior motives as they neither understand the issues your father had nor are they aware of the nature of his disagreement with his peers. Also since nobody really knows who is behind the murder of your father, all this forum is doing is giving some individuals a chance to sling dirt on the Pakistan Army. Your father did not give in to the inducement of bribes by the politicians only to safeguard the reputation of the Pakistan Army. I salute him for that but would also ask you to hold back on offering any other information that would harm you, your family or the reputation of the Pakistan Army.

I personally think that your father's retirement from the Army and his murder are both immense losses for the Pakistan Army. In his death, what he cherished (I.E. Pakistan Army) must be preserved. If I were you, I would be personally writing to the CoAS and other concerned authorities about this.

The family of Gen Asif Nawaz (Late CoAS) went about the investigation of his death through proper channels by writing to his successor and other law enforcement authorities. I suggest you try to approach this issue in a similar manner.

Miss ... Blain2 has covered the issue like a professional, I hope you take this route which I am sure will bear fruit of your quest.

 

[Prodigy17]

PRODIGY17 you are a complete idiot. You havent even read the article where she says the general gave her the letter over dinner in the Talking Fish restaurant in Islamabad. So all of your hogwash above just demonstrates how stupid you are to comment on something when you know nothing about it. She also says she was with the Pakistan Army when she heard of his death. It was not until she got back to London that she could do anything about the letter. Go read the article and then read the letter and then you might have something worthwhile talking about.

And so is your imbecilic and churlish argument......... Infact, all your contribution in this forum (6 posts) have been based on the same topic which indicates your intention and interest very clearly. Your defence of Ms Schofield infact evinces that you may be the publicity agent for her upcoming book or his defence attorney even worse, the lady herself. Your indubitable support for this late publication in the name of foregone conclusion regarding her safety is superflous to say the least because as ignorant as your community is, they may not know that journalists in Pakistan have been constructing and writing even bigger machinations than your beloved Schofield. Oh by the way, since you seem to know so much about the author, why don't you tell us the exact date when she left Pakistan after the death?????. It will make it abundantly clear to everyone here as to how much time it took for the lady journalist to publish the story..... to me it was more than a fortnight or 20 days. Stop regurgitating the same old story of safety and security and let us know how much time it took her in UK to publish her story.... enough of your innuendo, lets talk facts, shall we??????