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Claims of ‘Game-Changing’ F-35 Data Fusion Debunked

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http://www.defense-aerospace.com/ar...game_changing’-f_35-data-fusion-debunked.html
An online report lauding the data fusion of the Lockheed Martin F-35 fighter, and detailing the advantages it brings by reducing pilot workload, has exposed for the first time that the F-35’s claimed “game-changing” capabilities have, in fact, been in service for over a decade in European fighters.

A website called SLDinfo on Nov. 26 posted a report titled “The F-35 and Data Fusion: A Perspective from the International Fighter Conference 2018,” based on a single interview in which an F-35 pilot describes what he thinks are the combat advantages provided by the aircraft’s data fusion.

Superior data fusion is one of the few remaining advantages claimed for the F-35, whose “stealth” capabilities are challenged by new radar technologies; whose dogfighting capabilities have been shown to be inferior to those of early F-16s; and whose limited internal payload is a major handicap.

Clearly, if the F-35’s data fusion is shown to be no better than what the Dassault Rafale, the Eurofighter Typhoon and the Saab Gripen have already achieved, albeit to different extents, the case for buying the F-35, with its unaffordable operating costs, becomes much less compelling than it is made out to be by its manufacturer.

We have long suspected that pilots transitioning to the F-35 are only impressed by its data fusion capabilities because, coming from 1980s-vintage fighters like F-16, F-15 or Tornado, they were a decade or two behind the state of the art.

We have not been able to confirm this suspicion because F-35 pilots never engage in factual debate, but now SLDinfo’s report provides a useful benchmark for comparisons.

Touting the F-35’s Data Fusion

Interestingly, we found that some of the capabilities described by an F-35 to SLDinfo are very similar to those described by French Air Force Rafale pilots back in May 2011, when we reported from Solenzara air base, in Corsica, during the allied air strikes in Libya.

To compare the capabilities claimed for both aircraft by their pilots, we have reproduced below selected capabilities described by the F-35 pilot and, immediately below (in italics), corresponding statements made by Rafale pilots seven years ago.

In the interest of fairness, it must be noted that the F-35 was designed in the mid-1990s but only completed its development phase earlier this year, so while its data fusion may have appeared very advanced at a quarter century ago, it has become more common.

At the time our report was posted, we had also asked the Italian and German air forces, which took part in the operations against Libya, to visit their fighter units and interview the Typhoon pilots involved in the strikes. Both declined, which explains why Typhoon’s capabilities, extensive though they may be, are not mentioned here, while Sweden’s Gripen E is not yet operational.

Direct comparison of data fusion capabilities

-- F-35: “with the integrated sensor system built into the F-35, the role of data fusion is to provide situational awareness as a service to the pilot and the MADL linked combat force.”

Rafale: “if you receive a track from an AWACS, from your SPECTRA self-protection suite, or from your ‘winger’ at the same time, the system will analyze all the inputs and show you only one track…..Rafales work in a truly networked environment, and are fed targeting and other tactical data from a wide range of coalition sources through the Link 16 datalink.”


-- On an F-16, “The radar will be on one display; the targeting data on another. Perhaps a picture generated from the Link-16 network on another. The human brain is where the information on those separate displays are being fused and translated so that pilot is able to execute the mission.”

On Rafale, “Data from all on-board and off-board sensors are combined into a single tactical picture presented to the pilot on the cockpit’s central color display or, if desired, on one of the lateral displays.


-- The F-16 pilot “might also be working his radio to coordinate the mission as well…. A lot of what’s done in side a fourth-generation aircraft is done over the radio.”

The Rafale pilot “can select the data he wants, combine it with other data, and pass it on to his wingman or to other allied aircraft, ships or ground troops through the Link 16, without speaking a single word on the radio and, if not using the radar, without any transmission whatsoever.”


-- “With the F-35 you have automation via fusion going on….. almost all of a notional ten-minute engagement time to build a good picture, is being done automatically for the pilot in F-35 fusion.”

“To avoid overloading the pilot, the [Rafale’s] central computer prioritizes targets according to the threat they represent, and there are also modes to de-clutter the radar scope. The pilot can also decide to concentrate on a given aspect of the mission, and come back to others aspects.


-- With the F-35, “we have the capacity to third-party target and to distribute the effects desired in the battlespace.”

Rafale’s “Link 16 can also be used to de-conflict assignments with other aircraft without using radios…..The idea that a single aircraft can be re-tasked in flight from reconnaissance to strike to interception during the same sortie is truly revolutionary.


Having read the words of its pilot, the F-35 is far from the extraordinary and futuristic “5th-Generation Fighter” that Lockheed claims it is, and instead looks little more a bunch of middling data-fusion capabilities enclosed in a heavy and bulky airframe covered with low-observable coatings.

 
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http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articles-view/feature/5/197892/claims-of-‘game_changing’-f_35-data-fusion-debunked.html
An online report lauding the data fusion of the Lockheed Martin F-35 fighter, and detailing the advantages it brings by reducing pilot workload, has exposed for the first time that the F-35’s claimed “game-changing” capabilities have, in fact, been in service for over a decade in European fighters.

A website called SLDinfo on Nov. 26 posted a report titled “The F-35 and Data Fusion: A Perspective from the International Fighter Conference 2018,” based on a single interview in which an F-35 pilot describes what he thinks are the combat advantages provided by the aircraft’s data fusion.

Superior data fusion is one of the few remaining advantages claimed for the F-35, whose “stealth” capabilities are challenged by new radar technologies; whose dogfighting capabilities have been shown to be inferior to those of early F-16s; and whose limited internal payload is a major handicap.

Clearly, if the F-35’s data fusion is shown to be no better than what the Dassault Rafale, the Eurofighter Typhoon and the Saab Gripen have already achieved, albeit to different extents, the case for buying the F-35, with its unaffordable operating costs, becomes much less compelling than it is made out to be by its manufacturer.

We have long suspected that pilots transitioning to the F-35 are only impressed by its data fusion capabilities because, coming from 1980s-vintage fighters like F-16, F-15 or Tornado, they were a decade or two behind the state of the art.

We have not been able to confirm this suspicion because F-35 pilots never engage in factual debate, but now SLDinfo’s report provides a useful benchmark for comparisons.

Touting the F-35’s Data Fusion

Interestingly, we found that some of the capabilities described by an F-35 to SLDinfo are very similar to those described by French Air Force Rafale pilots back in May 2011, when we reported from Solenzara air base, in Corsica, during the allied air strikes in Libya.

To compare the capabilities claimed for both aircraft by their pilots, we have reproduced below selected capabilities described by the F-35 pilot and, immediately below (in italics), corresponding statements made by Rafale pilots seven years ago.

In the interest of fairness, it must be noted that the F-35 was designed in the mid-1990s but only completed its development phase earlier this year, so while its data fusion may have appeared very advanced at a quarter century ago, it has become more common.

At the time our report was posted, we had also asked the Italian and German air forces, which took part in the operations against Libya, to visit their fighter units and interview the Typhoon pilots involved in the strikes. Both declined, which explains why Typhoon’s capabilities, extensive though they may be, are not mentioned here, while Sweden’s Gripen E is not yet operational.

Direct comparison of data fusion capabilities

-- F-35: “with the integrated sensor system built into the F-35, the role of data fusion is to provide situational awareness as a service to the pilot and the MADL linked combat force.”

Rafale: “if you receive a track from an AWACS, from your SPECTRA self-protection suite, or from your ‘winger’ at the same time, the system will analyze all the inputs and show you only one track…..Rafales work in a truly networked environment, and are fed targeting and other tactical data from a wide range of coalition sources through the Link 16 datalink.”


-- On an F-16, “The radar will be on one display; the targeting data on another. Perhaps a picture generated from the Link-16 network on another. The human brain is where the information on those separate displays are being fused and translated so that pilot is able to execute the mission.”

On Rafale, “Data from all on-board and off-board sensors are combined into a single tactical picture presented to the pilot on the cockpit’s central color display or, if desired, on one of the lateral displays.


-- The F-16 pilot “might also be working his radio to coordinate the mission as well…. A lot of what’s done in side a fourth-generation aircraft is done over the radio.”

The Rafale pilot “can select the data he wants, combine it with other data, and pass it on to his wingman or to other allied aircraft, ships or ground troops through the Link 16, without speaking a single word on the radio and, if not using the radar, without any transmission whatsoever.”


-- “With the F-35 you have automation via fusion going on….. almost all of a notional ten-minute engagement time to build a good picture, is being done automatically for the pilot in F-35 fusion.”

“To avoid overloading the pilot, the [Rafale’s] central computer prioritizes targets according to the threat they represent, and there are also modes to de-clutter the radar scope. The pilot can also decide to concentrate on a given aspect of the mission, and come back to others aspects.


-- With the F-35, “we have the capacity to third-party target and to distribute the effects desired in the battlespace.”

Rafale’s “Link 16 can also be used to de-conflict assignments with other aircraft without using radios…..The idea that a single aircraft can be re-tasked in flight from reconnaissance to strike to interception during the same sortie is truly revolutionary.


Having read the words of its pilot, the F-35 is far from the extraordinary and futuristic “5th-Generation Fighter” that Lockheed claims it is, and instead looks little more a bunch of middling data-fusion capabilities enclosed in a heavy and bulky airframe covered with low-observable coatings.



But F-35 has stealth while Rafale does not.

Also, F-35 costs only 65% of Rafale
 
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A very cherry-picked analysis; just because X and Y have a mutual Z does not mean X and Y are suddenly toe-to-toe with each other, especially when the author overlooks the additional sensors aboard the F-35 that provides additional situational awareness such as DAS.
 
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Old news. I let it go a long time ago. Essentially, this is a salvage piece for the Raffle in light of pilots' opinions. The criticism is that the pilots' impression about the F-35 should be discounted because they came from platforms that are older than the Raffle.

We have long suspected that pilots transitioning to the F-35 are only impressed by its data fusion capabilities because, coming from 1980s-vintage fighters like F-16, F-15 or Tornado, they were a decade or two behind the state of the art.

The demand is that we should liken the transition as that from the WW II era to the F-35, whereas the Raffle is only a few yrs behind the F-35. It is essentially nonsensical.
 
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Old news. I let it go a long time ago. Essentially, this is a salvage piece for the Raffle in light of pilots' opinions. The criticism is that the pilots' impression about the F-35 should be discounted because they came from platforms that are older than the Raffle.

We have long suspected that pilots transitioning to the F-35 are only impressed by its data fusion capabilities because, coming from 1980s-vintage fighters like F-16, F-15 or Tornado, they were a decade or two behind the state of the art.

The demand is that we should liken the transition as that from the WW II era to the F-35, whereas the Raffle is only a few yrs behind the F-35. It is essentially nonsensical.

They have given parallel accounts of capabilities. And they stack up.
 
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Old news. I let it go a long time ago. Essentially, this is a salvage piece for the Raffle in light of pilots' opinions. The criticism is that the pilots' impression about the F-35 should be discounted because they came from platforms that are older than the Raffle.

We have long suspected that pilots transitioning to the F-35 are only impressed by its data fusion capabilities because, coming from 1980s-vintage fighters like F-16, F-15 or Tornado, they were a decade or two behind the state of the art.

The demand is that we should liken the transition as that from the WW II era to the F-35, whereas the Raffle is only a few yrs behind the F-35. It is essentially nonsensical.

Although the author says 2011, this is something the Rafale's had since 2006, when the F3 upgrade actually became operational. The F-35 will achieve this capability in operational aircraft only in 2023 with the completion of the Block 4 upgrade. As of today, the F-35's data fusion is still WIP.

https://breakingdefense.com/2015/03/threat-data-biggest-worry-for-f-35as-ioc-but-it-will-be-on-time/
In his 2014 annual report, the director of Operational Test and Evaluation described the sensors this way: “fusion of information from own-ship sensors, as well as fusion of information from off-board sensors is still deficient. The Distributed Aperture System continues to exhibit high false-alarm rates and false target tracks, and poor stability performance, even in later versions of software.”

Full integration of the threats and the aircraft software won’t occur until close to Full Operational Capability, in part because it takes time for pilots, intelligence analysts and the plane’s builder — Lockheed Martin — to figure out exactly what the sensors are capable of and how the software should be redesigned to do the best job of taking the sensors information and the threat information and helping them work together.
 
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Although the author says 2011, this is something the Rafale's had since 2006, when the F3 upgrade actually became operational. The F-35 will achieve this capability in operational aircraft only in 2023 with the completion of the Block 4 upgrade. As of today, the F-35's data fusion is still WIP.

https://breakingdefense.com/2015/03/threat-data-biggest-worry-for-f-35as-ioc-but-it-will-be-on-time/
In his 2014 annual report, the director of Operational Test and Evaluation described the sensors this way: “fusion of information from own-ship sensors, as well as fusion of information from off-board sensors is still deficient. The Distributed Aperture System continues to exhibit high false-alarm rates and false target tracks, and poor stability performance, even in later versions of software.”

Full integration of the threats and the aircraft software won’t occur until close to Full Operational Capability, in part because it takes time for pilots, intelligence analysts and the plane’s builder — Lockheed Martin — to figure out exactly what the sensors are capable of and how the software should be redesigned to do the best job of taking the sensors information and the threat information and helping them work together.
When you brought on 'quantization errors' to explain how SPECTRA defeats 'stealth', I stopped taking you seriously. That is why I left that debate. You did not understand what kind of sampling I was referring to. Quantization errors pretty much went out with the vinyl to CD conversion controversy. Not really applicable to SPECTRA. So I will leave this issue about the Raffle's supposedly 'superiority' over the F-35 for you to enjoy by yourself.
 
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When you brought on 'quantization errors' to explain how SPECTRA defeats 'stealth', I stopped taking you seriously. That is why I left that debate. You did not understand what kind of sampling I was referring to. Quantization errors pretty much went out with the vinyl to CD conversion controversy. Not really applicable to SPECTRA. So I will leave this issue about the Raffle's supposedly 'superiority' over the F-35 for you to enjoy by yourself.

*yawn*

https://www.tek.com/support/faqs/what-quantization-error-and-how-does-signal-noise-relate
Quantization error is the difference between the analog signal and the closest available digital value at each sampling instant from the A/D converter. Quantization error also introduces noise, called quantization noise, to the sample signal.

When you sample a signal, you end up introducing quantization errors. It's one of the most basic errors known. However when you digitize a signal, you can no longer perform AC. For AC, the threat signal never goes through the ADC in the first place making your entire argument against AC moot.

The fact that you didn't get such a simple concept is why you are unable to understand ACT.

Anyway, I always knew you will happily dismiss this thread due to your own ignorance, regardless of the fact that the Rafale has been doing what the F-35 is still trying to do since 2006.

Here's something interesting about the Rafale. I would recommend giving it a read, even the F-35 doesn't have most of these features.
https://www.dassault-aviation.com/en/defense/rafale/mission-ready-with-low-operating-costs/

As for the thread topic at hand, read this.
https://www.dassault-aviation.com/en/defense/rafale/the-sheer-power-of-multisensor-data-fusion/

Any average joe who knows the subject knows that for F-35-equivalent data fusion you need to have a single computer processing raw data from radar and other sensors, which the Rafale has through the MDPU.
 
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*yawn*

https://www.tek.com/support/faqs/what-quantization-error-and-how-does-signal-noise-relate
Quantization error is the difference between the analog signal and the closest available digital value at each sampling instant from the A/D converter. Quantization error also introduces noise, called quantization noise, to the sample signal.

When you sample a signal, you end up introducing quantization errors. It's one of the most basic errors known. However when you digitize a signal, you can no longer perform AC. For AC, the threat signal never goes through the ADC in the first place making your entire argument against AC moot.
Yawn is correct -- to your argument.

The kind of sampling I was talking about that SPECTRA must do have nothing to do with A/D conversion. So when you brought on quantization errors, I thought: 'WTF does vinyl to CD conversion have to do with aviation?' :lol:

If you cannot figure out what and why, then there is no hope for you.
 
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