China unveils latest H6-K bomber prototype.

[Nishan_101]

I think it was for India to scare them along with NATO>>>>>

 

[Oldman1]

Same back to you, hundreds of fighters and at least 100 upgraded H-6 bombers + 34 SSK + 5-6 SSN + about 20 frigates + 14-15 destroyers, since all Chinese assets are at only one coast and not spread throughout the world + all the missiles. We are on a roll here,

You got almost empty of Tomahawks after raping defenseless Iraq in 2003 and many were used against Libya in 2011; so you had shortage in 2011 too. The U.S. had to order 400 new Tomahawks to make up for those used in 2011. You don't have no where near many enough for China; China on the other hand have enough for your terrorist bases nearby

LOL you think we ran out of Tomahawks? Not to mention you forgot about JASSMERs. You should look more.

 

[Oldman1]

If you want to see more than a billion Chinese people killed and thousands of years of Chinese history wiped out for a couple of rocks. Be my guess. You shut down islands, but remember what happened to Japan when it thought U.S. could not hit its main islands during WW2. Doolittle Raid. And this was WW2. Just recently North Korea freaked out when a pair of B2s came from the U.S. mainland and dropped a couple of bombs in the Korean peninsula and returned home.

Thanks for proving my point. I know that the U.S. are massmurderers and you are threatening to nuke and wipe out China because of Diayou and bases on Okinawa where native people HATE you being there anyway.

Second of all, China is not scared of your mass murdering threats. China has every right to attack a threat right in front of it's coast.

Thirdly, same goes back to you, if the U.S. wants to die for the country that attacked Pearl Harbour, then right back at you; "be my guest".

There were no nukes in 1941. Neither does China plan on attacking Hawaii. However, anything between Diayou and Okinawa and even Guam is acceptable target.

I really don't know why you are babbling about North Korea and giving me links to reaction from the North Korea. We are not interested in a war with South Korea.

I gave you link to what China is capable of according to your report.

However, terrorist murderers in Japan and the U.S. is another matter. This one will be to the last breath, OLD man.

I know your government is used to raping weak countries, and since China is denying you the rape, your terrorist government kind of find that "exciting" You want what you can't have

You suggested using nukes if we use conventional methods of attack on Chinese mainland. Should I quote you? You suggested mass murdering.

Not too mention thousand of CJ-10 cruise missile and thousand of guided Ballistic missile that will launch and wipe off the enemy. Nothing special from the enemy.

Not to mention thousands of missiles and ballistic missiles that would wipe out the billions Chinese people and pretty much nothing left to mention the existence of Chinese culture. Even though Mao claims otherwise if he sacrifice millions of Chinese to achieve his aims.

 

[Oldman1]

So can we wipe out 200 millions of American with our DF-31A. What is so special? You want to play armageddon? We grant your wish send you American to hell.

DF-31A with MRV warhead plus decoy is enough penetrate US missile shield. How many can you intercept? All it takes is a dozen warhead reach US continent is enough to send USA into history. China too possess hydrogen warhead...

We can wipe out over a billion Chinese even if you have more people because your cities are more dense. So instead of killing a million its tens of millions.

 

[Genesis]

We can wipe out over a billion Chinese even if you have more people because your cities are more dense. So instead of killing a million its tens of millions.

let me ask you something then, if somehow, forget how, China manage to attack US mainland and say there isn't a way to stop it, at least not immediately. Would the US use Nukes?

The US used Nukes just to save lives in WW2, you think you wouldn't use if US itself is in danger?

 

[Oldman1]

Yahoo! News Canada - Latest News & Headlines

BEIJING (Reuters) - China's state media warned on Saturday that a "counterstrike" against the Philippines was inevitable if it continues to provoke Beijing in the South China Sea, potentially Asia's biggest military troublespot.

The warning comes as ministers from both countries attend an Association of Southeast Asian Nations meeting in Brunei, starting Saturday, which hopes to reach a legally binding code of conduct to manage maritime conduct in disputed areas.

At stake are potentially massive offshore oil reserves. The seas also lie on shipping lanes and fishing grounds.

Both China and the Philippines have been locked in a decades-old territorial squabble over the South China Sea, with tensions flaring after the Philippines moved new soldiers and supplies last week to a disputed coral reef, prompting Beijing to condemn Manila's "illegal occupation".

The overseas edition of the People's Daily, the official newspaper of the Chinese Communist Party, said in a front-page commentary that the Philippines had committed "seven sins" in the South China Sea.

These include the "illegal occupation" of the Spratly Islands, inviting foreign capital to engage in oil and gas development in the disputed waters and promoting the "internationalization" of the waters, said the commentary.

The Philippines has called on the United States to act as a "patron", while ASEAN has become an "accomplice," said the commentary, which does not amount to official policy but can reflect the government's thinking.

"The Philippines, knowing that it's weak, believes that 'a crying child will have milk to drink'," the People's Daily said, accusing Manila of resorting to many "unscrupulous" tricks in the disputed waters.

Beijing's assertion of sovereignty over a vast stretch of the South China Sea has set it directly against Vietnam and the Philippines, while Brunei, Taiwan and Malaysia also lay claim to other parts of the sea.

The 10-member ASEAN hopes to reach a legally binding Code of Conduct to manage maritime conduct in disputed areas. For now a watered-down "Declaration of Conduct" is in place.

On Thursday, China's Foreign Minister Wang Yi warned that countries with territorial claims in the South China Sea that look for help from third parties will find their efforts "futile", adding that the path of confrontation would be "doomed".

Last week, China vowed to protect its sovereignty over the Second Thomas Shoal, known in China as the Ren'ai reef. The Philippines is accusing China of encroachment after three Chinese ships, including a naval frigate, converged just five nautical miles (nine km) from an old transport ship that Manila ran aground on a reef in 1999 to mark its territory.

Last year, China and the Philippines were locked in a tense two-month standoff at the Scarborough Shoal, which is only about 124 nautical miles off the Philippine coast. Chinese ships now control the shoal, often chasing away Filipino fishermen.

China is backing off. Guess they ain't confident after all.

Yahoo! News Canada - Latest News & Headlines

BANDAR SERI BEGAWAN (Reuters) - China agreed to hold formal talks with Southeast Asian nations on a plan to ease maritime tensions on Sunday as the Philippines accused it of causing "increasing militarization" of the South China Sea, one of Asia's naval flashpoints.

The rebuke by Philippine Foreign Minister Albert del Rosario at a regional summit in Brunei came a day after China's state media warned of an inevitable "counterstrike" against the Philippines if it continued to provoke Beijing.

Friction between China and the Philippines over disputed territories has surged since last year due to several naval stand-offs as China asserts its vast claims over the oil and gas rich sea.

The heated rhetoric came as both China and the 10-member Association of Southeast Asian Nations (ASEAN) claimed progress in efforts to agree a mechanism aimed at defusing naval tensions.

China agreed to hold "official consultations" on a proposed Code of Conduct (CoC) governing naval actions at a meeting with ASEAN in China in September, a step that Thailand's foreign minister hailed as "very significant".

The two sides had already agreed to hold the foreign ministers' meeting, which will follow a special ASEAN ministers' gathering on the South China Sea issue in Thailand in August.

"We agreed to maritime cooperation to make our surrounding sea a sea of peace, friendship and cooperation," Chinese Foreign Minister Wang Yi told reporters in Brunei.

But Wang stressed that any progress on agreeing the new framework would be dependent on countries following a confidence-building "declaration of conduct" agreed in 2002 which it accuses the Philippines of violating.

"Both China and other coastal states in the South China Sea are making efforts for a stable South China Sea. I believe any activity taken by individual claimant countries to go against the trend will not enjoy the support of the majority of countries and will not succeed either."

"MASSIVE" PRESENCE CONDEMNED

In the latest stand-off, the Philippines accused China of encroaching on its territory after three Chinese ships converged just 5 nautical miles from a small reef where the Philippines maintains a small military force.

This month the Philippines moved more troops and supplies to the reef, which is within its 200-nautical mile economic exclusion zone. China, which does not recognize the zone, condemned it as an "illegal occupation".

Del Rosario said the "massive" presence of Chinese military and paramilitary ships at the Second Thomas shoal and at another reef called the Scarborough Shoal - the site of a tense standoff last year - was a threat to regional peace.

"The statement on counterstrike is an irresponsible one. We condemn any threats of use of force," Del Rosario told reporters following a meeting of ASEAN foreign ministers.

He said the ministers had discussed China's ongoing "illegal" occupation of the Scarborough Shoal, which is just 124 nautical miles of the Philippine coast.

The worsening dispute comes as Philippine-ally the United States, which says it has a national interest in freedom of navigation in the South China Sea, shifts its military attention back to Asia. Secretary of State John Kerry is due to arrive in Brunei on Monday to join the regional summit.

Critics say China is intent on cementing its claims over the sea through its superior and growing naval might, and has little interest in rushing to agree a code of conduct with ASEAN nations, four of which have competing claims.

Divisions among ASEAN over the maritime dispute burst into the open a year ago when a summit chaired by Chinese ally Cambodia failed to issue a closing communiqué for the first time in the group's 45-year history.

Enough said.

Actions speak louder than words.

let me ask you something then, if somehow, forget how, China manage to attack US mainland and say there isn't a way to stop it, at least not immediately. Would the US use Nukes?

The US used Nukes just to save lives in WW2, you think you wouldn't use if US itself is in danger?

Are you saying you have no confidence in your conventional forces to stop a U.S. conventional attack on Chinese mainland?

 

[Genesis]

Are you saying you have no confidence in your conventional forces to stop a U.S. conventional attack on Chinese mainland?

In the case of a attack by US, I'm sure Shanghai, and Beijing will be targets. While your DC and New york is east coast, all of our major cities are in range of a US attack.

We can stop a US attack on China, but by then maybe our cities would have been destroyed.

IF someone is within striking distance of DC, would US use?

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

USA doesn't need to use nukes at all,infact it needs little military force.
All they will do-
Cancel trillions of dollars of debt to china,
Embargo chinese goods and withdraw all investors and manufactureres from china along with european alliance.Chinese economy is export based.
USN cuts off all oil imports and essential goods supplies to china.Especially through malacca.

Chinese economy collapses in weeks.
There is nothing china can do to stop this till it fields a navy that can challenge USN on any ocean in the world,unlike USSR who had massive energy and oil reserves and was not tied to exports,china is not self sufficient in resources and especially oil and energy without which modern states can't survive.

 

[American spying]

USA doesn't need to use nukes at all,infact it needs little military force.
All they will do-
Cancel trillions of dollars of debt to china,
Embargo chinese goods and withdraw all investors and manufactureres from china along with european alliance.Chinese economy is export based.
USN cuts off all oil imports and essential goods supplies to china.Especially through malacca.

Chinese economy collapses in weeks.
There is nothing china can do to stop this till it fields a navy that can challenge USN on any ocean in the world,unlike USSR who had massive energy and oil reserves and was not tied to exports,china is not self sufficient in resources and especially oil and energy without which modern states can't survive.

It's impossible for the US to cancel its debt to us because then no one will lend America money in the future. We certainly won't buy their debt to continue their QE policies and fund their $1 trillion budget deficits. Without us, the entire American economy collapses.

Our exports to the US is an insignificant 17% of our total exports. Net exports account for a tiny part of our GDP growth. China is now an investment and consumption based economy. Last year net exports contributed negatively to GDP growth. Over 50% of GROWTH was from consumption. You're confusing future growth with past stock of growth. Consumption as a % of GDP is low but all new growth comes from private consumption.

Chinese manufacturing industry is dominated by Chinese manufacturers and most of the foreign manufacturers are Taiwanese, Japanese and South Korean. American manufacturers make up only 16% of total Chinese manufacturing.

China has alternative energy sources through Central Asia and cutting off energy supplies to Malacca means cutting off all of East Asia (the engine for the global economy). That means the entire global economy collapses because Chinese economy contributed the most to global growth over the past 5 years. If China sneezes, the world gets pneumonia.

The US is not as stupid as Indians. They know China runs the global economy. The global supply chains runs through China, Chinese consumption is the driving force for corporate earnings worldwide and Chinese lending is vital for the survival of the American economy as China absorbs most of the printed dollars from the Fed to keep inflation in the US down. Since China is the largest manufacturer, we can afford to print money and buy those excessive dollars off the market and keep our inflation down since our goods production can keep up with RMB money creation. No other economy can absorb those excessive dollars like the Chinese economy.

Your suggestions are cute but impossible to work in reality. The global economy is connected like never before, any harm to the Chinese economy and the Americans will be shooting themselves in the foot. They know this.

 

[Genesis]

USA doesn't need to use nukes at all,infact it needs little military force.
All they will do-
Cancel trillions of dollars of debt to china,
Embargo chinese goods and withdraw all investors and manufactureres from china along with european alliance.Chinese economy is export based.
USN cuts off all oil imports and essential goods supplies to china.Especially through malacca.

Chinese economy collapses in weeks.
There is nothing china can do to stop this till it fields a navy that can challenge USN on any ocean in the world,unlike USSR who had massive energy and oil reserves and was not tied to exports,china is not self sufficient in resources and especially oil and energy without which modern states can't survive.

i'm not sure if you know how economy works, but to make it simple for you.

let's say you invested a million dollars in China, and you bought another million in goods to sell in your store.

Now your country tells you that million you spent, you either need to sell on the cheap or lose it, and the goods you just ordered can't be delivered so whatever payment you just made is gone.

So you be losing half that, if lucky, your store is doomed cause you don't got the goods, your employees fired cause you got no money. Your customers can't buy so there is inflation, the country gets screwed cause there is no tax.

So tell me, does that sounds like just China losing to you?

We are doing business with each other, not playing house. No one party is pitying the other by giving free stuff or money. You think you can do all of those things and not harm your own country just as much.

China second largest GDP, think your body, you think you can just keep your heart and pull out your lung and nothing will happen...

It's comments like these.......

 

[AUSTERLITZ]

It's impossible for the US to cancel its debt to us because then no one will lend America money in the future. We certainly won't buy their debt to continue their QE policies and fund their $1 trillion budget deficits. Without us, the entire American economy collapses.

Our exports to the US is an insignificant 17% of our total exports. Net exports account for a tiny part of our GDP growth. China is now an investment and consumption based economy. Last year net exports contributed negatively to GDP growth. Over 50% of GROWTH was from consumption. You're confusing future growth with past stock of growth. Consumption as a % of GDP is low but all new growth comes from private consumption.

Chinese manufacturing industry is dominated by Chinese manufacturers and most of the foreign manufacturers are Taiwanese, Japanese and South Korean. American manufacturers make up only 16% of total Chinese manufacturing.

China has alternative energy sources through Central Asia and cutting off energy supplies to Malacca means cutting off all of East Asia (the engine for the global economy). That means the entire global economy collapses because Chinese economy contributed the most to global growth over the past 5 years. If China sneezes, the world gets pneumonia.

The US is not as stupid as Indians. They know China runs the global economy. The global supply chains runs through China, Chinese consumption is the driving force for corporate earnings worldwide and Chinese lending is vital for the survival of the American economy as China absorbs most of the printed dollars from the Fed to keep inflation in the US down. Since China is the largest manufacturer, we can afford to print money and buy those excessive dollars off the market and keep our inflation down since our goods production can keep up with RMB money creation. No other economy can absorb those excessive dollars like the Chinese economy.

Your suggestions are cute but impossible to work in reality. The global economy is connected like never before, any harm to the Chinese economy and the Americans will be shooting themselves in the foot. They know this.

In war,there is no ethics.You really expect a nation ur at war with to pay debts?LOL.Of course they will cancel debt,and others won't mind because they aren't going to war with USA anytime soon.
U are only factoring in exports to usa,now fcator in exports to all us allies and freinds including europe and gulf,they have to make a choice between usa and china they will choose usa.Whole chinese xport economy collapses.Korean,japanese are all american allies.Of course they will back usa.U counting on them,lol.
Bulk of chinese energy sources come through malacca,and cutting off malacca doesn't mean cutting of east asia at all.Simply put no ships will go to chinese harbours due to USN blockade.Why would USN bloackade japnese and other east asian ships...another false assumption.Without oil u got nothing.Also gulf is totally owned by USA.
Yes collapse of chinese economy will hurt the world and US economy a lot too,but u are assuming usa is not willing to pay the price.Thye are willing to take the damage if it means knocking china out completely.Japan thought in ww2 if they took the island chains,usa wouldn't risk casualities..they found out otherwise when usa took them despite terrible casualities in iwo jima,okinawa,etc.You are assuming chinese are the only ones to act decisively willing to take losses and others are soft..a cute but impossible dream.
Sure they don't want to go to war with china because damage will be substantial,but that doesn't mean they can put china down easily by these means if it does break out.Once war it is,gloves are off.

 

[Fsjal]

We can wipe out over a billion Chinese even if you have more people because your cities are more dense. So instead of killing a million its tens of millions.

Wouldn't that make America look bad?
Anyway, that sounds a bit harsh.

USA doesn't need to use nukes at all,infact it needs little military force.
All they will do-
Cancel trillions of dollars of debt to china,
Embargo chinese goods and withdraw all investors and manufactureres from china along with european alliance.Chinese economy is export based.
USN cuts off all oil imports and essential goods supplies to china.Especially through malacca.

Chinese economy collapses in weeks.
There is nothing china can do to stop this till it fields a navy that can challenge USN on any ocean in the world,unlike USSR who had massive energy and oil reserves and was not tied to exports,china is not self sufficient in resources and especially oil and energy without which modern states can't survive.

If US did cancel debt to China, then China would be in chaos, and possibly turn back into a Maoist dictatorship. In fact, China might become a supersize North Korea.

And if oil runs out in China, they will use force against neighboring nations.

 

[jhungary]

See carefully who start talking of MAD first. Chinese never strike unprovoked.

It's a Chinese Member started it at Post 34

First of all, any Tomahawk striking the mainland, means you get your behind nuked. Attacking your terrorist forces right ahead of our nose in Diayou and Okinawa is perfectly acceptable in a case of war.

Source: http://www.defence.pk/forums/chines...st-h6-k-bomber-prototype-3.html#ixzz2XkzNIEvO

Before that, only discussion of Missile, Cruise Missile, Bomber are involved.

What if China manages to achieve Air-Superiority along the Indo-China Border perhaps up to 50 kms into Indian Air Space & then uses these Bombers to attack Indian Immobile Targets from stand-off ranges right on the edge of the Indo-China border ? Perhaps Air Superiority over whole swathes of Indian Air Space is neither required nor practically achievable ?

Would that sound plausible ?

No, if War did indeed start between China and India, China probably would be ended up ahead with using tactical bomber but not Strategic Bomber.

Strategic bomber is very much susceptible to any kind of Air Defence, not only aerial defence, but all kind of defences. In Vietnam war, US lost 30 B-52 to Vietnam Air Defence, and you are talking about a country as big as US with TOTAL air dominance in the air, still loses 30 B-52 to Vietnam forces. If you would imagine a war between India and China, even if Chinese are getting the local air superiority as you said, their loses of any type of Strategic bomber will be significant.

Beside, unless China is bombing coastal city in India, their target should be considered tactical target and their target proximity should be close, there will not be any benefit to China if they are to use any Strategic bomber instead of a shotgun strike with Tactical bomber or even fighter bomber riding with escort.

let me ask you something then, if somehow, forget how, China manage to attack US mainland and say there isn't a way to stop it, at least not immediately. Would the US use Nukes?

The US used Nukes just to save lives in WW2, you think you wouldn't use if US itself is in danger?

US have a doctrine of using Nuclear or Mass Destruction weapon when their own land is overwhelms.

In the event of a Chinese overwhelm attack on United States mainland, we will use our nuke on our own soil to stop limit the overwhelm attacks. but there are no rules as to fire or not fire nuke to China.

However, I should say the chances of any concentrated strike is unlikely. If a strike is warranted a nuclear response, the concentration of force must be tight (Ie numerous attacker in close proximity) and hence using a nuclear device is effective. Otherwise, if the attacking force is large but disperse, nuclear response is not warranted as the strike will not be effective. There are probably better chance to defeat such enemy in detail, rather than using a mass destruction weapon.

But then I have to say, if any country stack their force and attack us in one point with the intention of overwhelm us? Such attack are consider stupid as

A.) Not one in this world can support this kind of strike in the US, not even United States itself. To achieve this, you have to had almost 100% of your army air mobile (At least 80% I reckon). and you have to concentrate on a spot that our defence is the weakest.

B.) Unless you are going for a 1 off attack, then expect your large bulk of your attacking would never return.

In war,there is no ethics.You really expect a nation ur at war with to pay debts?LOL.Of course they will cancel debt,and others won't mind because they aren't going to war with USA anytime soon.
U are only factoring in exports to usa,now fcator in exports to all us allies and freinds including europe and gulf,they have to make a choice between usa and china they will choose usa.Whole chinese xport economy collapses.Korean,japanese are all american allies.Of course they will back usa.U counting on them,lol.
Bulk of chinese energy sources come through malacca,and cutting off malacca doesn't mean cutting of east asia at all.Simply put no ships will go to chinese harbours due to USN blockade.Why would USN bloackade japnese and other east asian ships...another false assumption.Without oil u got nothing.Also gulf is totally owned by USA.
Yes collapse of chinese economy will hurt the world and US economy a lot too,but u are assuming usa is not willing to pay the price.Thye are willing to take the damage if it means knocking china out completely.Japan thought in ww2 if they took the island chains,usa wouldn't risk casualities..they found out otherwise when usa took them despite terrible casualities in iwo jima,okinawa,etc.You are assuming chinese are the only ones to act decisively willing to take losses and others are soft..a cute but impossible dream.
Sure they don't want to go to war with china because damage will be substantial,but that doesn't mean they can put china down easily by these means if it does break out.Once war it is,gloves are off.

I almost always wonder how is the education level of some of the member here.

TRADE IS BILATERAL it does not matter if you are talking about commodity or bond. All trade are bilateral. If one side cut the cable then both side will go to hell.

It's simply like this, without China, US will be in Trouble, but without US, the WORLD will be in trouble.

 

[jhungary]

And again, as I said this some post before. I can never understand why China develop any Strategic bomber now, Stealth or otherwise.

If you want to launch bomber from the US and support your troop fighting in Iraq, Vietnam or Afghanistan, yeah, then a strategic bomber will make sense.

if you want to launch a bomber form the US and strike Canada, launch a strategic bomber do not make sense.

You have to have ground support to use those bomber, simply aerial escort is not enough, you also need to supress SAM/AAA on the ground. The main objective for Strategic Bomber is to support your OFFSHORE fighting force. China have NO OFFSHORE FIGHTING FORCE anywhere in the world, no transport capability, nor logistic capability to support an offshore campaign. Why would you need Strategic Bomber??

If you really want to launch them against target in like Senkaku, the Japanese Patriot Missile crew will point and laugh at you while shooting your Bomber down. And your escort can do nothing about it....

I would understand if China are to develop these type in maybe 10 or 15 years, but now? it seems only like an item that sitting pretty inside your hanger...

 

[lmjiao]

And again, as I said this some post before. I can never understand why China develop any Strategic bomber now, Stealth or otherwise.

If you want to launch bomber from the US and support your troop fighting in Iraq, Vietnam or Afghanistan, yeah, then a strategic bomber will make sense.

if you want to launch a bomber form the US and strike Canada, launch a strategic bomber do not make sense.

You have to have ground support to use those bomber, simply aerial escort is not enough, you also need to supress SAM/AAA on the ground. The main objective for Strategic Bomber is to support your OFFSHORE fighting force. China have NO OFFSHORE FIGHTING FORCE anywhere in the world, no transport capability, nor logistic capability to support an offshore campaign. Why would you need Strategic Bomber??

If you really want to launch them against target in like Senkaku, the Japanese Patriot Missile crew will point and laugh at you while shooting your Bomber down. And your escort can do nothing about it....

I would understand if China are to develop these type in maybe 10 or 15 years, but now? it seems only like an item that sitting pretty inside your hanger...

First of all, China will have offshore force in the near future.
However, the most important task for Strategic Bombers is NUCLEAR attack.
China needs red B-2 and even more advanced bombers to achieve the ability to wipe US out from earth, which is important for the re-balance of the world.

Now Chinese nuclear force is not the strongest, at least the US people are not scared enough, so the development of Chinese strategic force is not strange at all.