Can IAF afford to Cancel THE MMRCA

[Abingdonboy]

Not gonna happen, GoI/MoD is too far down the road. Not to mention the IAF is in desperate need of replacing Bisons.

 

[Storm Force]

ABINGON

MMRCA will replace the MIG27s THERE ARE 130 in service AND they are well past it

Bison will remain til 2017 AND WILL BE REPLACED BY TEJAS eventually BUT the reason for falling Squdrons is that 125 bisons will be scrapped by 2017 BUT ONLY 40 tejas will have arrived may be even less than 40


hence my predecition that by 2017 IAF could field only 490 fighters albeit high quality in

SU30MKI (270), TEJAS MK1 (40), MIRAGE2000-5, MIG29SMT, UPGRADED JAGUAR (180 COMBINED)

THROW IN AROUND 3 sqds THE MMRCA order of 50+ by then and you probably have a good dea of wat IAF WILL LOOK like by 2017

 

[Hulk]

Looks like we do not have good threads going on, hence lot of fake/hypothetical discussion going on. I hate such nonsense threads which is no where close to reality.

 

[zavis2003]

It is in great interest of india that it should buy mmrca and should not cancel the deal of 20 billions dollars ! India has so many hostile countries around itself and nepal and bhutan are prominent and srilanka is emerging too.. so to defend big gaps in airspace india needs valaity jets to counteract threats!! if india will spend money on mmrca i think it would make all of us happy , we want india to spoil money like that........

 

[janon]

It is in great interest of india that it should buy mmrca and should not cancel the deal of 20 billions dollars ! India has so many hostile countries around itself and nepal and bhutan are prominent and srilanka is emerging too.. so to defend big gaps in airspace india needs valaity jets to counteract threats!! if india will spend money on mmrca i think it would make all of us happy , we want india to spoil money like that........

None of those countries are going to threaten India militarily in our lifetimes, and none of them are hostile to India in any sense of the word. Each squadron of the IAF has more combat aircrafts than Sri Lanka's air force, to give an example. We have apprehensions only about two countries in the neighbourhood. And in a more realistic sense, only one country.

But yes, we need these planes to match our aspirations. The IAF of yesterday was interested in ensuring that pakistan can never have an upper hand against us. The IAF of today is aspiring to be more of a regional power, with (modest) power projection capabilities in the south Asian region, in keeping with the giant strides that the country is making in other fields. Larger players have larger interests.

Before you worry too much about India spoiling its money, think about how much money pakistan has in comparison, and how much it spends on its defence. Or any other country, for that matter.

 

[Chinese-Dragon]

if people think the meduim to long term answer to PLAAF is over priced euro canards that we will need SERIOUS money and we will learn nothing ourselves.

HOW EVER painful or slow for ME both the LCA & AM,CA are or should be india,s no1 priority. SPEND the money here, buy the technology or steal it.

IT works for china and for PAF why not india

WE are too big a nation to be BUYING LOCK STOCK AND BARREL from overseas still.

Hmm... a clever Indian.

If your politicians thought this way, then today you might have already been producing indigenious alternatives to the MMRCA and keeping the money inside your own country, rather than sending it overseas.

 

[janon]

Hmm... a clever Indian.

If your politicians thought this way, then today you might have already been producing indigenious alternatives to the MMRCA and keeping the money inside your own country, rather than sending it overseas.

Well I wish India was in a position to mass produce MRCA equivalents. However, it is not. The LCA will be a fine aircraft when it arrives, and the MkII would be a formidable platform in its category. However the IAF has bigger aspirations, and it needs state of the art heavy and medium class fighters in addition to the light category. There is no alternative for that. The IAF of the 80s or 90s would have been satisfied with that, but today the IAF is looking to transform into a much more offensive force.

By the way, a lot of that money would be spent in the country, because of the 50 percent offset clause. And remember, only 18 of these planes would be bought off the shelf, the rest would be manufactured in India, giving a quantum jump to our manufacturing capabilities. That is the best we can do at this stage, to be realistic. The idea is that this would be the last time India is purchasing ready made foreign fighters. Not many countries in the world can boast that. (I know China can.)

 

[Storm Force]

Too chinease dragon.

The indian Navy is producing destroyers and frigates and nuclear subs already. THEY took the atitude which i advocate GO indengious back in the 1980s

And today we see this INS Arihant - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Shivalik class frigate - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I thibnk the indian air force needs to follow this example too

 

[Emmie]

Now this is very much a hypothetical equation..

Another 4 to 5 years are required for MKI to reach to the 270/280 mark.... Upgradation of the entire fleet of Mirage-2000 would take a time period of nine years.... Mig-29s upgradation to be completed by 2013...Tejas requires another 2 to 3 years for complete maturation...

Your figures don not match with the ground realities...

And yeah, MRCA is too expensive and too late.. US$ 158.7 ml per unit (flyaway cost/weapon system cost).Original Post By Emmie

Those dates of 2017 ARE FINE

IAF will have 270 su30mki by 2017 AS THEY have 150+ ALREADY & HAL has is assemblying 14 per year at present withy 42 SU30MK MK3 coming from russia between 2014-2017

The Jaguar & mig29 upg will be dobe by 2014 NOT 2017 and the mirage2000 upgrade runs at 6 planes per year started NOW so by 2017 36 of the 51 will be upgraded

TEJAS mk1 FOC is slated for this NEXT year AND EVEN AT ONLY 8 PLANES per year IAF will be at 40 planes by 2017

HECK 2017 is 6 years away (i know IAF is slow but surely i have been very pessimistic with my nos)

This is what I said " Another 4 to 5 years are required for MKI to reach to the 270/280 mark"

Current numbers of MKI operational with IAF are 150+..... Number of units assembled by HAL each year 14, 14×5 = 70.... 42 to arrive from Russia between 2014-17...... 150(+)+70+42= 262+..... Now where was I wrong with my scenario?

The Jaguar & mig29 upg will be dobe by 2014 NOT 2017

Where did I mention 2017? I mentioned 2013, a year earlier than you're expecting.

and the mirage2000 upgrade runs at 6 planes per year started NOW so by 2017 36 of the 51 will be upgraded

I was strictly referring to the statement of Antony " Mirage-2000 upgrade to be completed in 10 years".. And it was about entire fleet not just 36 aircrafts.

TEJAS mk1 FOC is slated for this NEXT year AND EVEN AT ONLY 8 PLANES per year IAF will be at 40 planes by 2017

No, its the IOC-2 which is expected by mid-2012 and the final operational clearance (FOC) could be scheduled two years after that... One can't be sure of FOC, IAF can't operate Tejas until Tejas is awarded with FOC. Now what did I mention "Tejas requires another 2 to 3 years for complete maturation".

Tejas induction only by mid-2014

HECK 2017 is 6 years away

This is exactly what I tried to imply, IAF got to fill this gap by inducting MRCA.... 6-7 years gap is big for IAF especially when it has PLAAF to deter..

 

[BATMAN]

F-35 would come with lot of riders and constraints and on later stages of maintenance it will pinch us.Our fighters should operate to suit our requirements as long as they are not free of cost.

You are thinking way too advance!

I seriously doubt that US would ever agree to sell 126 F-35 for $8 billion.

As i know bhartis are asking for ToT, local production unit, technical & operational training in US and life time maintenance, in the same price.

 

[kaykay]

You are thinking way too advance!

I seriously doubt that US would ever agree to sell 126 F-35 for $8 billion.

As i know bhartis are asking for ToT, local production unit, technical & operational training in US and life time maintenance, in the same price.

and from where the hell you got this figure of $8 billion.......MoD is all set to spend more if required.....

 

[tamygu]

Kyo akya hua super duper indian economy ko about which indians shout 24/7 on this board.if that supposed to be super duper economy cant even buy you a small plane then its a waste economy of chana zor garam babu.

 

[kaykay]

Kyo akya hua super duper indian economy ko about which indians shout 24/7 on this board.if that supposed to be super duper economy cant even buy you a small plane then its a waste economy of chana zor garam babu.

super duper economy ko kuch nahi hua....someone asked a question on a forum and you start jumping with joy.....and drawn all the conclusions!!!...great.

 

[Hello_10]

I don't think it is too late by any stretch of imagination...As far as costly is concerned then talk in real terms...Compare the inflation in India vs Inflation in Europe and then get to the real number...

you are correct. if you add the difference of inflation of US with that of India in between 2007 till now, 1US$ = 53rupee is still less..........

 

[Hello_10]

and from where the hell you got this figure of $8 billion.......MoD is all set to spend more if required.....

JSF/ F35 will cost at least $200mil each and its also not as much capable as to that of twin engine PAK FA of $100mil each only with full tech transfer to India. and with delays in F-35 programs, F35 and PAK FA both will come in production more or less at the same time.