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Bride dies on wedding night because of inhumane treatment by groom

I have never seen even a Pakistani male doctor use that kind of foul language on a public forum. God knows who this "doctor" is and what is her agenda.

I see a new wave of attack on our cultural values by these desi slaves of the west in the guise of social justice for women and "sex education". Even that CNN bitch Christian fair was arguing that sex education might have saved that 7-year old girl from the rapist, like rapists just abandon the idea as soon as they find out that their victim is "sex educated" or that sex education to a seven-year-old kid would make them physically invincible.

Where is the proof that sex education eliminates rape? Let's see in the west where they have been proudly providing sex eduatin to their kids, today more than 50% of women in the west are victims of sexual abuse now compare that with the muslim world. just a few freak cases do not describe our society that we should change our values and systems. We need to make our justice system better and make penalty even more sever. On one hand these westerns tell us to be "humane" and not punish criminals on the other they want us to spoil our kids innocense by exposing them to sex in early life. Fucking idiots.


Bride dies on wedding night because of inhumane treatment by groom
600x441xbride.png.pagespeed.ic.aX60W3P2nM.webp
 
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Not only the liberal section, the orthodox muslims too need to be re-educated ...

As per the Holy Qur'an, capital punishment is allowed only for two crimes, unjust murder and Fasad fil Arz

So is this unjust murder or fasad fil arz?
 
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I have never seen even a Pakistani male doctor use that kind of foul language on a public forum. God knows who this "doctor" is and what is her agenda.

I see a new wave of attack on our cultural values by these desi slaves of the west in the guise of social justice for women and "sex education". Even that CNN bitch Christian fair was arguing that sex education might have saved that 7-year old girl from the rapist, like rapists just abandon the idea as soon as they find out that their victim is "sex educated" or that sex education to a seven-year-old kid would make them physically invincible.

Where is the proof that sex education eliminates rape? Let's see in the west where they have been proudly providing sex eduatin to their kids, today more than 50% of women in the west are victims of sexual abuse now compare that with the muslim world. just a few freak cases do not describe our society that we should change our values and systems. We need to make our justice system better and make penalty even more sever. On one hand these westerns tell us to be "humane" and not punish criminals on the other they want us to spoil our kids innocense by exposing them to sex in early life. Fucking idiots.
Other than this punishment in pakistan for rape is death but in u.s.a or u.k it isn't death but imprisonment plus in u.s, the time period can become short too. So i don't get do they geniunely want this inhumanity to end or thaty are only good at pointing fingers at other
 
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I've seen quite people in favour of sex education in schools espacially the social workers and actors but i don't get one thing what is the content of that education going to be. It's a vague thing or statement that sex education be given in schools. What exactly would be children taught is it going to be education of proper sex i mean penetration, ejacultaion,squirting,masturbation etc. Or it is going to be about awareness for example how to protect urself like not to go with anyone stranger, if someone touches in an uncomfortable way complain about him to ur elder or scream if it is done outside the house by someone u don't know. If anyone tells u be with him alone not to do so no matter how close he is to you or how much better u know him and so on. In the first case i am against it as it takes away the innocence of children but in the second case i think it should be taught in a manner that doesn't scare children
 
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Isn't it interesting that all of a sudden we have such news coming out left, right and centre? I do not believe in coincidences. Now don't get me wrong - such incidents are heinous and inhuman and deplorable to the max. But I feel that there are some external forces purposely promoting such news to cause confusion, uncertainty and to destroy the moral and religious fabric of the Pak society where "family values" are the core of this society.

This is a part of the "Hybrid War" being waged against Pakistan. I have said this multiple times here that there is a hybrid war imposed on Pakistan.

Remember, such crimes mentioned in the news happen everywhere. US in fact leads figures of various crimes including rape and child molestation. Child molestation is wide spread in Europe.
 
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Buddy none of the " libtards" or me for that matter are arguing that the man should be spared. Trust me we all want the death penalty for him. The argument is against public execution.
Also instead of putting so much effort into the after events of the crime the attention should be preventing the crime in the first place. Comparing corruption with this is a pretty example tbh. Reporting the crime will obviously lead to punishment for the perpetrator while at the same time stop such instances from escalating into rape and then murder.

Why against public execution? These guys needs to be made example. A deterrence for future. Not saying it will prevent the crime in future completely but those who want to commit will think twice.

How many of these child murders have been send to gallows in your opinion? It is the not the first time this has happened. Zainab disappearance was reported to police and those 11 others as well before her, but its only when her case was spread through social media, the police took notice of it. What I am saying to you, the prevention will not work unless you have got a cure of the disease. We already are sick society, we need cure, not prevention. Hanging these monsters publically will be a good start.



Bro while we consider life sentence a "softer" punishment as compared to the death penalty, in cases such as these its even worse than being sentenced to death. While I do agree that its kind of stupid to let these lowlifes live for decades on tax payer money the lives they live are worse than hell. Child molestors are subject to decades worth of beatings,mental torture and rape by the prison inmates and I'd have these bastards suffer through this rather than the quick release of death.

Again, its a matter of perspective and understanding. The real pleasure or punishment starts from the time when one takes his/her last breath. That's why I said we need to send such individuals to be judged by supreme authority asap.

Death sentence is end of all sufferings. They should be Castrated and be marked visibly so that they are identified.

Not in our belief. Death is the start of real torture for eternity for those who deserve it. How long is eternity?
 
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Isn't it interesting that all of a sudden we have such news coming out left, right and centre? I do not believe in coincidences. Now don't get me wrong - such incidents are heinous and inhuman and deplorable to the max. But I feel that there are some external forces purposely promoting such news to cause confusion, uncertainty and to destroy the moral and religious fabric of the Pak society where "family values" are the core of this society.

This is a part of the "Hybrid War" being waged against Pakistan. I have said this multiple times here that there is a hybrid war imposed on Pakistan.

Remember, such crimes mentioned in the news happen everywhere. US in fact leads figures of various crimes including rape and child molestation. Child molestation is wide spread in Europe.

Not just this. When it rains more than normal and starts flooding that is is a yahoodi saazish. When you witness an earthquake its because of Amreeki saazish. When a passing bird decides to take a sh*t on your car its a bhaarti saazish and the bird is a RAAA agent.

Its a shame that there's people who simply can't take responsibility or even admit that there's massive faults in our society. Everything to them is a conspiracy because to them they're little angels not capable of the evils they see everyday.
 
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I think the only person that needs to be re-educated is you. Withholding complete information and twisting the info you got is not only unethical but strips you of any respect. I believe this is the article from where you got these terms.
https://www.thoughtco.com/capital-punishment-in-islam-2003792

If you had been completely truthful, you would have also explained that the following terms come under Fasaad Fi al-Ardh:
  • Treason/ Apostacy (when one leaves the faith and joins the enemy in fighting against the Muslim community)
  • Terrorism
  • Land, sea, or air piracy
  • Rape
  • Adultery
  • Homosexual behavior
Now as you can see that every orthodox believes that these crimes should be punishable by death and only the liberals believe otherwise. So, next time when you say something provide complete info.


No, you are wrong, I had never visited the site you "believe" I got it from ... My source of information and guidance is the Holy Qur'an and the Qur'an is clear on this matter. As stated earlier, as per the Holy Qur'an, capital punishment is allowed only for two crimes, unjust murder and Fasad fil Arz.

And let me educate you, the Holy Qur'an does not describe the crimes you listed as "Fasad fil Arz", that is just the personal opinion of some scholars which of course is not binding and differences of opinions have always existed on what is or isn't fasad fil arz. Hope that clears up your confusion. so, next time before you "assume" something, make sure you know what you are talking about

Regards

So is this unjust murder or fasad fil arz?

Well, unjust murder has to be "wilful"

And marital rape isn't considered "rape" by Mulla Tola, fasad fil arz to bahut dur ki baat hai
 
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No, you are wrong, I had never visited the site you "believe" I got it from ... My source of information and guidance is the Holy Qur'an and the Qur'an is clear on this matter. As stated earlier, as per the Holy Qur'an, capital punishment is allowed only for two crimes, unjust murder and Fasad fil Arz.

And let me educate you, the Holy Qur'an does not describe the crimes you listed as "Fasad fil Arz", that is just the personal opinion of some scholars which of course is not binding and differences of opinions have always existed on what is or isn't fasad fil arz. Hope that clears up your confusion. so, next time before you "assume" something, make sure you know what you are talking about

Regards
There also a secondary source of Islamic law and it is called the Hadiths. For starters here is a list of hudood punishments as described by Sahih bukhari.
https://sunnah.com/bukhari/86
You would find a number of instances of stoning to death the perpetrators of the crime. These crimes do not come under murder and hence, commentators and Islamic scholars have placed them in Fasad al Arz category. The Hadiths quantifies the Quran and the Prophet (P.B.U.H) even made changes to certain punishments. In the Quran the punishment for adultery is 100 lashes but the Prophet (P.B.U.H) told that a slave who committed such act will only be dealt 50 lashes. Then if committed again then 50 lashes and if again then sell the salve for a rope's length. Hence studying the Hadiths and taking guidance from it is paramount is understanding Islamic jurisprudence.

As far as you opinion goes, forgive me but I will trust the judgement of these scholars who have invested their lifetime in Islamic studies over some guy on PDF. The crimes that I mentioned before is not the personal opinion of some scholar but majority of the scholars believe in them. If you have knowledge of Islamic Jurisprudence and have published a paper on what constitutes fasad fil arz then I will be happy to read it. Otherwise, this is just your personal opinion chap which frankly would not count for much against the view of an established scholar.

Regards.
 
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There also a secondary source of Islamic law and it is called the Hadiths. For starters here is a list of hudood punishments as described by Sahih bukhari.
https://sunnah.com/bukhari/86
You would find a number of instances of stoning to death the perpetrators of the crime. These crimes do not come under murder and hence, commentators and Islamic scholars have placed them in Fasad al Arz category. The Hadiths quantifies the Quran and the Prophet (P.B.U.H) even made changes to certain punishments. In the Quran the punishment for adultery is 100 lashes but the Prophet (P.B.U.H) told that a slave who committed such act will only be dealt 50 lashes. Then if committed again then 50 lashes and if again then sell the salve for a rope's length. Hence studying the Hadiths and taking guidance from it is paramount is understanding Islamic jurisprudence.

As far as you opinion goes, forgive me but I will trust the judgement of these scholars who have invested their lifetime in Islamic studies over some guy on PDF. The crimes that I mentioned before is not the personal opinion of some scholar but majority of the scholars believe in them. If you have knowledge of Islamic Jurisprudence and have published a paper on what constitutes fasad fil arz then I will be happy to read it. Otherwise, this is just your personal opinion chap which frankly would not count for much against the view of an established scholar.

Regards.


I didn't mention commentators, scholars or Hadith, I was talking about the Holy Qur'an... You may choose to blindly follow whatever and whomever you want, for me book of Allah is enough ..



As for using Hadith as a source of law, I agree with Iqbal's views



Iqbal notes in his seminal work The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam, even Abu Hanifah, regarded as “one of the greatest exponents of Muhammedan Law in Sunni Islam … made practically no use of … traditions”, even though there were collections available at that time made by other people no less than thirty years before his death. Nor did he collect any hadith for his use, unlike his peers Malik and Ahmad Ibn Hanbal. Thus, according to Iqbal, “if modern Liberalism considers it safer not to make any indiscriminate use of them [Ahadith] as a source of law, it will be only following [the example of Abu Hanifah].”
[Iqbal, A. M., The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam, First Indian Edition 1997, p. 137.]

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/islamic-history-archaeology.294333/#post-5123445
 
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I've seen quite people in favour of sex education in schools espacially the social workers and actors but i don't get one thing what is the content of that education going to be. It's a vague thing or statement that sex education be given in schools. What exactly would be children taught is it going to be education of proper sex i mean penetration, ejacultaion,squirting,masturbation etc. Or it is going to be about awareness for example how to protect urself like not to go with anyone stranger, if someone touches in an uncomfortable way complain about him to ur elder or scream if it is done outside the house by someone u don't know. If anyone tells u be with him alone not to do so no matter how close he is to you or how much better u know him and so on. In the first case i am against it as it takes away the innocence of children but in the second case i think it should be taught in a manner that doesn't scare children


Raised a valid question... our definition would be worlds apart from the west.


However parents should teach little kids about good and bad touching... that sort of awareness is what we need.
 
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Raised a valid question... our definition would be worlds apart from the west.


However parents should teach little kids about good and bad touching... that sort of awareness is what we need.
Yeah but would it be right to call that sex education. I think it should better be called awareness
 
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I didn't mention commentators, scholars or Hadith, I was talking about the Holy Qur'an... You may choose to blindly follow whatever and whomever you want, for me book of Allah is enough ..



As for using Hadith as a source of law, I agree with Iqbal's views



Iqbal notes in his seminal work The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam, even Abu Hanifah, regarded as “one of the greatest exponents of Muhammedan Law in Sunni Islam … made practically no use of … traditions”, even though there were collections available at that time made by other people no less than thirty years before his death. Nor did he collect any hadith for his use, unlike his peers Malik and Ahmad Ibn Hanbal. Thus, according to Iqbal, “if modern Liberalism considers it safer not to make any indiscriminate use of them [Ahadith] as a source of law, it will be only following [the example of Abu Hanifah].”
[Iqbal, A. M., The Reconstruction of Religious Thought in Islam, First Indian Edition 1997, p. 137.]

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/islamic-history-archaeology.294333/#post-5123445

That is a very very interesting piece of information. I have read the thread that you have linked and it is a good place to start discussion on topics like these. There are some interesting points and counter points on the topic. However, I tend to not read the books on Islamic topics by western scholars as most of them analyze Islamic concepts from the lens of Christianity. But Allama Iqbal's book is definitely worth a read and I will do so soon. Let me read it and get back to you on the topic.
Regards.
 
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... Allama Iqbal's book is definitely worth a read and I will do so soon. Let me read it and get back to you on the topic.
Regards.


Iqbal said:

" ... I have no doubt that a deeper study of the enormous legal literature of Islam is sure to rid the modern critic of the superficial opinion that the Law of Islam is stationary and incapable of development. Unfortunately, the conservative Muslim public of this country is not yet quite ready for a critical discussion of Fiqh, which, if undertaken, is likely to displease most people, and raise sectarian controversies; yet I venture to offer a few remarks on the point before us.


1) In the first place, we should bear in mind that from the earliest times, practically up to the rise of the Abbasids, there was no written law of Islam apart from the Qur’an.

2) Secondly, it is worthy of note that from about the middle of the first century up to the beginning of the fourth not less than nineteen schools of law and legal opinion appeared in Islam. This fact alone is sufficient to show how incessantly our early doctors of law worked in order to meet the necessities of a growing civilization. With the expansion of conquest and the consequent widening of the outlook of Islam these early legists had to take a wider view of things, and to study local conditions of life and habits of new peoples that came within the fold of Islam. A careful study of the various schools of legal opinion, in the light of contemporary social and political history, reveals that they gradually passed from the deductive to the inductive attitude in their efforts at interpretation

3)Thirdly, when we study the four accepted sources of Muhammadan Law and the controversies which they invoked, the supposed rigidity of our recognized schools evaporates and the possibility of a further evolution becomes perfectly clear. Let us briefly discuss these sources.


(a) The Qur’an. The primary source of the Law of Islam is the Qur’an. The Qur’an, however, is not a legal code. Its main purpose, as I have said before, is to awaken in man the higher consciousness of his relation with God and the universe. No doubt, the Qur’an does lay down a few general principles and rules of a legal nature, especially relating to the family – the ultimate basis of social life. But why are these rules made part of a revelation the ultimate aim of which is man’s higher life? The answer to this question is furnished by the history of Christianity which appeared as a powerful reaction against the spirit of legality manifested in Judaism. By setting up an ideal of other-worldliness it no doubt did succeed in spiritualizing life, but its individualism could see no spiritual value in the complexity of human social relations. “Primitive Christianity”, says Naumann in his Briefe über Religion, “attached no value to the preservation of the State, law, organization, production. It simply does not reflect on the conditions of human society.” And Naumann concludes: “Hence we either dare to aim at being without a state, and thus throwing ourselves deliberately into the arms of anarchy, or we decide to possess, alongside of our religious creed, a political creed as well.” Thus the Qur’an considers it necessary to unite religion and state, ethics and politics in a single revelation much in the same way as Plato does in his Republic....

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(b) The Hadīth. The second great source of Muhammadan Law is the traditions of the Holy Prophet. These have been the subject of great discussion both in ancient and modern times. Among their modern critics Professor Goldziher has subjected them to a searching examination in the light of modern canons of historical criticism, and arrives at the conclusion that they are, on the whole, untrustworthy! Another European writer, after examining the Muslim methods of determining the genuineness of a tradition, and pointing out the theoretical possibilities of error, arrives at the following conclusion:

It must be said in conclusion that the preceding considerations represent only theoretical possibilities and that the question whether and how far these possibilities have become actualities is largely a matter of how far the actual circumstances offered inducements for making use of the possibilities. Doubtless, the latter, relatively speaking, were few and affected only a small proportion of the entire sunnah. It may therefore be said that . . . for the most part the collections of sunnah considered by the Moslems as canonical are genuine records of the rise and early growth of Islam (Mohammedan Theories of Finance).

For our present purposes, however, we must distinguish traditions of a purely legal import from those which are of a non-legal character. With regard to the former, there arises a very important question as to how far they embody the pre-Islamic usages of Arabia which were in some cases left intact, and in others modified by the Prophet. It is difficult to make this discovery, for our early writers do not always refer to pre-Islamic usages. Nor is it possible to discover that usages, left intact by express or tacit approval of the Prophet, were intended to be universal in their application. Shāh Wall Allāh has a very illuminating discussion on the point. I reproduce here the substance of his view. The prophetic method of teaching, according to Shāh Wall Allāh, is that, generally speaking, the law revealed by a prophet takes especial notice of the habits, ways, and peculiarities of the people to whom he is specifically sent. The prophet who aims at all-embracing principles, however, can neither reveal different principles for different peoples, nor leaves them to work out their own rules of conduct. His method is to train one particular people, and to use them as a nucleus for the building up of a universal Sharī‘ah. In doing so he accentuates the principles underlying the social life of all mankind, and applies them to concrete cases in the light of the specific habits of the people immediately before him. The Sharī‘ah values (Ahkām) resulting from this application (e.g. rules relating to penalties for crimes) are in a sense specific to that people; and since their observance is not an end in itself they cannot be strictly enforced in the case of future generations. It was perhaps in view of this that Abū Hanīfah, who had a keen insight into the universal character of Islam, made practically no use of these traditions. The fact that he introduced the principle of Istihsān, i.e. juristic preference, which necessitates a careful study of actual conditions in legal thinking, throws further light on the motives which determined his attitude towards this source of Muhammadan Law. It is said that Abū Hanīfah made no use of traditions because there were no regular collections in his day. In the first place, it is not true to say that there were no collections in his day, as the collections of ‘Abd al-Mālik and Zuhrī were made not less than thirty years before the death of Abū Hanīfah. But even if we suppose that these collections never reached him, or that they did not contain traditions of a legal import, Abū Hanīfah, like Mālik and Ahmad Ibn Hanbal after him, could have easily made his own collection if he had deemed such a thing necessary. On the whole, then, the attitude of Abū Hanīfah towards the traditions of a purely legal import is to my mind perfectly sound; and if modern Liberalism considers it safer not to make any indiscriminate use of them as a source of law, it will be only following one of the greatest exponents of Muhammadan Law in Sunnī Islam. It is, however, impossible to deny the fact that the traditionists, by insisting on the value of the concrete case as against the tendency to abstract thinking in law, have done the greatest service to the Law of Islam. And a further intelligent study of the literature of traditions, if used as indicative of the spirit in which the Prophet himself interpreted his Revelation, may still be of great help in understanding the life-value of the legal principles enunciated in the Qur’an. A complete grasp of their life-value alone can equip us in our endeavour to reinterpret the foundational principles.


http://www.allamaiqbal.com/works/prose/english/reconstruction/
 
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