Armata - universal attacking machine

[Serpentine]

T-14 tank:

Armata looks great, what's your thoughts on this tank? Can it beat its western counterparts?

 

[500]

Armata looks great, what's your thoughts on this tank? Can it beat its western counterparts?

Its very good in tank-tank combat. In Armata u can stand in hull down position and shoot safely, since turret in unmanned. Front hull is virtually impenetrable. Crew is separated from the ammo.

Whats bad. It lacks commanders cupola, what is important especially in urban combat. Main gun ammo is limited to 32 rounds. U cant reload the machine gun and fix its problems, change barrel. Crew is cramped in front of the tank, hard to spend much time there (in Israel sometimes we spend days inside tanks). No backup sights if electronics stops working. Turret armor looks weak and its easily to damage. Its APS does not protect against top attack threats and rear and top armor is not enough (and most of modern threats are top attack). Of course its much more complex and expensive than T-90.

 

[flamer84]

Looking at the Bumerang APC we can see a full blown Western design and a departure from Soviet models.I wouldn't be surprised if Western tech (Italian,German,Swiss or French) was supplied prior to the Ukraine fiasco. Oh well....

 

[Matrixx]

T14 is the best in world

 

[United]

 

[MICA]

 

[SOHEIL]

Nice tank...

 

[500]

APS:

Panorama and smoke:

 

[ptldM3]

Its very good in tank-tank combat. In Armata u can stand in hull down position and shoot safely, since turret in unmanned. Front hull is virtually impenetrable. Crew is separated from the ammo.

Whats bad. It lacks commanders cupola, what is important especially in urban combat. Main gun ammo is limited to 32 rounds. U cant reload the machine gun and fix its problems, change barrel. Crew is cramped in front of the tank, hard to spend much time there (in Israel sometimes we spend days inside tanks). No backup sights if electronics stops working. Turret armor looks weak and its easily to damage. Its APS does not protect against top attack threats

You have no way of knowing that.

and rear and top armor is not enough (and most of modern threats are top attack). Of course its much more complex and expensive than T-90.

Look at the Armata's hatches, the hatches are indicative of how thick the top armor is. Most western tanks have a hatch/roof thickness of only about 1"-2" inches, the armata's hatches look to be around 5"-6" thick.

Looking at the Bumerang APC we can see a full blown Western design and a departure from Soviet models.I wouldn't be surprised if Western tech (Italian,German,Swiss or French) was supplied prior to the Ukraine fiasco. Oh well....

The BTR-60 was one of the first 8 wheeled APCs, the Boomerang is just the next leap in the design. This is typical mentality though, the Russians are always accused of copying something that they originally pioneered. The Boomerang size wise is similar to "western" designs but something being a similar size does not mean anything other then the fact that the vehicle can hold more troops, other then that the Boomerang and "western" designs will always looks similar seeing as to they are all 8 wheeled platforms and modern so looks wise they will have similarities.

 

[500]

You have no way of knowing that.

Well:

Look at the Armata's hatches, the hatches are indicative of how thick the top armor is. Most western tanks have a hatch/roof thickness of only about 1"-2" inches, the armata's hatches look to be around 5"-6" thick.

Not enough vs anything serious like TOW or Javelin.

 

[ptldM3]

Well:

Not enough vs anything serious like TOW or Javelin.

look closely at the roof we don't even know which are smoke dispensers and which are APS countermeasures. Besides which the old Arena system had a directional charge. The other option is the APS may change course if it has a seeker or is slaved to the tanks onboard APS's radar.

 

[500]

View attachment 218627

look closely at the roof we don't even know which are smoke dispensers and which are APS countermeasures.

These are smokes. Too small for APS launchers.

Besides which the old Arena system had a directional charge.

Arena charges were directed towards fixed spot.

The other option is the APS may change course if it has a seeker or is slaved to the tanks onboard APS's radar.

Too expensive and complicated and I dont see big radars.

 

[ptldM3]

These are smokes. Too small for APS launchers.

Have you seen how small the Arena APS charges are? Also take a look at the size of smoke grenade launchers, they are big:

Simply put no one knows what which systems are the smoke grenades and which are not. I find it strange that T-14 designers went through all the trouble of mounting smoke grenades on a rotating base.

Arena charges were directed towards fixed spot.

That is not relevant, the T-14 does not use the Arena, it uses something newer and better. To sum it up know one knows anything about the T-14s APS, or how it works. For all we know the APS may intercept threats by correcting its flight path.

Too expensive and complicated and I dont see big radars.

How do you think systems like Arena work? Something has to detect a threat. Radars don't needs to be big either, air-to-air missiles have radar...

 

[kilremgor]

These are smokes. Too small for APS launchers.


Arena charges were directed towards fixed spot.


Too expensive and complicated and I dont see big radars.

500> it's actually a different thing

niistali[.]ru/products/nauka/protection/uplook_protection/

The up-facing grenade launchers that can be seen on both T-14 and T-15's rear are parts of this system, containing lots of IR-masking aerosol, flares and chaff (and reportedly EMP charges). That's basically Shtora on steroids, though only up-facing. That's why there are both "regular" smoke grenade launchers on rotary platforms and 24 launchers in the separate block facing up.

That would likely defeat Javelin since it would break IIR lock. Even regular Shtora grenades create very thick and big puff of smoke, firing several of those at once would completely mask the vehicle. At least if it is on the move, it would probably be safe.

And there are radars facing up and towards the rear, easily seen on high-res photos.

So basically that "top attack Shtora" is probably auto-triggered whenever something approaches from the above, and then deploys smoke & chaff.

So, it seems that Armata has dual APS, soft-kill being primarily oriented against top-attack threats (but it would likely work against regular threats as well - smoke launchers are rotary) and the bulky Drozd-like hard-kill APS is probably there to deal with unguided attacks, attacks that are manually-guided, or likely intercepting tank shells (if it really uses EFP, it should be able to intercept HE and HEAT with no problem, and degrade performance of APFSDS shell).

 

[500]

Have you seen how small the Arena APS charges are? Also take a look at the size of smoke grenade launchers, they are big:

Arena charges are not small:

How do you think systems like Arena work? Something has to detect a threat. Radars don't needs to be big either, air-to-air missiles have radar...

For accurate trajectory calculation u need a big radar. Drozd was very crude system thats why it had small radar. Arena was more accurate and thats why big radar.