Ancient Harappan-era skeletons found in Haryana

[Hindustani78]

The first non-Dravidian people to have migrated to the Indian peninsula, most likely coming from Central Asia.

I think it was by King Alexander in 326 BC.

 

[Maira La]

I think it was by King Alexander in 326 BC.

No, Vedic people arrived way before 326 B.C.

 

[ArsalanKhan21]

The Indus valley civilization map and the DNA Haplogroup L do match the map of modern Pakistan. Clearly shows genetic continuity of ancient and modern Pakistanis.

Haplogroup L-M20 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[MarkovChain]

The Indus valley civilization map and the DNA Haplogroup L do match the map of modern Pakistan. Clearly shows genetic continuity of ancient and modern Pakistanis.

Are you definitely looking at the same graph as me? I see this being spread about whole of India as well - with Kerala having just as much a chance as Pakistan.

Not sure where you guys got the idea that Indus valley people remained somehow completely different to and independent of aryan people and later converted to islam and became Pakistanis - thus drawing a straight line relationship.

 

[Hindustani78]

No, Vedic people arrived way before 326 B.C.

Vedic people are those who are aware of Vedas and those are Indian people.

 

[Maira La]

Vedic people are those who are aware of Vedas and those are Indian people.

Call them whatever you want. I was explaining who the IVC people were to some other guy and how they are different from the Vedic people who arrived later, because many tend to confuse the two.

 

[Hindustani78]

Call them whatever you want. I was explaining who the IVC were to some other guy and how they are different from the Vedic people who arrived later, because many tend to confuse the two.

Vedic people are Indian people. Why to call them whatever anyone wants ?

 

[MarkovChain]

Vedic people are those who are aware of Vedas and those are Indian people.

Not sure I follow this. The Indo-Aryan migration and the rig veda have their roots in modern day Turkmenistan and a proto Indo-Iranian religion. The Avesta, which is the religious book of the Parsis, has several phrases which sound similar to those in the vedas.

Old Iranian/Avestan: aevo pantao yo ashahe, vispe anyaesham apantam (Yasna 72.11)
Old Indian/Rig Vedic: abade pantha he ashae, visha anyaesham apantham

Aryans and Zoroastrianism

 

[Maira La]

Vedic people are Indian people. Why to call them whatever anyone wants ?

I want to avoid this argument. I am talking from a historical point of view - I have no interest in the politics of names.

 

[Hindustani78]

Not sure I follow this. The Indo-Aryan migration and the rig veda have their roots in modern day Turkmenistan and a proto Indo-Iranian religion. The Avesta, which is the religious book of the Parsis, has several phrases which sound similar to those in the vedas.

The hymns of Rig Veda talks on Lord RAMA, Ayodhya is in India and the 14 years which He spend in exile was in India and all those ancient historical places are still existed in India.

Avesta and Rig Vedas do have similarity and that similarity we can further see in Abrahamic religion. I think the Oldest known religious book are Rig Vedas

I want to avoid this argument. I am talking from a historical point of view - I have no interest in the politics of names.

Vedas are still seen in Indian culture and traditions.

 

[MarkovChain]

The hymns of Rig Veda talks on Lord RAMA, Ayodhya is in India and the 14 years which He spend in exile was in India.

Avesta and Rig Vedas do have similarity and that similarity we can further see in Abrahamic religion. I think the Oldest known religious book are Rig Vedas

Where does the rig veda talk about rama? The meaning of Rama means pleasing - any potential source where vedas mention rama is an indication that it's talking about a god who is pleasing - not rama from ramayana. I'd like to hear more on this though since I could be wrong.

 

[Maira La]

Vedas are still seen in Indian culture and traditions.

It's just that we have chosen to call these early migrants "Vedic people" because they brought the Vedic culture to this region. Over the next few thousand years, this culture absorbed elements from the local Dravidian people to become the culture you are so familiar with, the one you call "Indian culture." Off-topic, but interesting to note: the Islamic culture too underwent similar changes in India and transformed into local variants of Islam.

 

[MarkovChain]

It's just that we have chosen to call these early migrants "Vedic people" because they brought the Vedic culture to this region. Over the next few thousand years, this culture absorbed elements from the local Dravidian people to become the culture you are so familiar with, the one you call "Indian culture." Off-topic, but interesting to note: the Islamic culture too underwent similar changes in India and transformed into local variants of Islam.

This. It always surprises me when people view their identity to be uniquely and perfectly traceable back 5000 years.

 

[Maira La]

Avesta and Rig Vedas do have similarity and that similarity we can further see in Abrahamic religion. I think the Oldest known religious book are Rig Vedas

You mean oldest existing. Wouldn't it be interesting if we discovered a common precursor to the Vedas and the Zorostrian scriptures? One that both borrow ideas from? As for Abrahamic religions, I heard, and not sure how authentic the source is, the Jewish people borrowed tons of ideas from neighboring, now extinct, civilizations.

 

[MarkovChain]

You mean oldest existing. Wouldn't it be interesting if we discovered a common precursor to the Vedas and the Zorostrian scriptures? One that both borrow ideas from? As for Abrahamic religions, I heard, and not sure how authentic the source is, the Jewish people borrowed tons of ideas from neighboring, now extinct, civilizations.

I need to buy you a beer! Exactly, to be claiming the vedas have existed eternally implies the vedas were brought to India when people migrated from east africa - or when homo habilis turned into homo erectus - or that dinosaurs followed the vedas.