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Why India is a Nation

Jamwal's

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I did read this, and it seems strange.

The author mentions that most major civilizations formed along the banks of a great river... Yangtze for China (wrong... it was actually the Yellow River in Northern China)... and the Indus River for India. Giving India claim as a civilization state.

Which would make sense if we were talking about British India. But not the Republic of India, since the vast majority of the Indus River exists in modern day Pakistan.

And from what the Pakistani members have been saying, they fully oppose Indian claims over this river or any history related to it.

So when the author talks about "India" they seem to be talking about the entire South Asia, which the Pakistani and Bangladeshi members here strongly oppose.

It's like when we mention that the Buddha was from Nepal, the Indian members here say "it's the same thing as India". But it's not? India is not the same thing as South Asia, just like China is not the same thing as East Asia.
Siddhartha belonged to the Shakya's Kshatriya clan and tarai region of Nepal.The region is still populated by Indian origin (Madhesi People).

Other important sites of Shakya Confederacy like Gorakhpur belt,Pava,Shravasti,Kushinagar etc (Buddha circuit) is in modern day India not Nepal.


In any case it was India which made Siddhartha as Gautam Buddha when he attain "enlightenment" at Gaya again in modern day India.All his former Gurus like Alar Kalam,Mogiliputttissa etc belonged to India.


China itself is made of several non Han ethnicity.
 
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navtrek

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I did read this, and it seems strange.

The author mentions that most major civilizations formed along the banks of a great river... Yangtze for China (wrong... it was actually the Yellow River in Northern China)... and the Indus River for India. Giving India claim as a civilization state.

Which would make sense if we were talking about British India. But not the Republic of India, since the vast majority of the Indus River exists in modern day Pakistan.

And from what the Pakistani members have been saying, they fully oppose Indian claims over this river or any history related to it.

So when the author talks about "India" they seem to be talking about the entire South Asia, which the Pakistani and Bangladeshi members here strongly oppose.

It's like when we mention that the Buddha was from Nepal, the Indian members here say "it's the same thing as India". But it's not? India is not the same thing as South Asia, just like China is not the same thing as East Asia.
Man i don't know why you still did not get the point. Its such a beautifully written article complete with facts and figures and showing the continuity of the idea of India or Bharatha that binds us all.

Yes what you are saying is correct Pakistan and Bangladesh or Nepal would deny that we all share common roots because the very acceptance of that truth would destroy their legitimacy of being separate and provide more legitimacy to India and the concept of reunion.

Again your understanding of India is different from, Pakistanis, Sri Lankan, Bangladeshis, Nepalese.. you look at it as one single entity while we see it as a continent or subcontinent.. and we have proofs to back it up..

for example even during British rule there were more then 500 princely states with own rulers what you called now one entity..

before British India there was Sikh empire in Punjab. Talpur Dynasty in Sindh, Durrani in KPK, Khanate in Baluchistan? where was Republic of India or India as one entity?

Even during Mughal rule, there were maratha state along with many rajput kingdom, most of them were allies of mughals while rest were fighting against Mughals..

India, Indian subcontinent stand for a geographical region not for a country or single entity, Just like Asia, Europe, Just bcoz India adopted British name for its country does not make it owner of word India and its history,


History belongs to the people of particular land.. Land of Indus and its all achievements belongs to Pakistan..

Land of Ganga. or Ganga valley and its achievement belongs to India..
How about going a few years back before the moguls and the British era. Why is it that we selectively see only what we want to see and hear.

Come on my friend just delete all that you have learnt and start reading from the beginning from a neutral source and you will just realize the unity of this civilization.
 

Max

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Man i don't know why you still did not get the point. Its such a beautifully written article complete with facts and figures and showing the continuity of the idea of India or Bharatha that binds us all.

Yes what you are saying is correct Pakistan and Bangladesh or Nepal would deny that we all share common roots because the very acceptance of that truth would destroy their legitimacy of being separate and provide more legitimacy to India and the concept of reunion.



How about going a few years back before the moguls and the British era. Why is it that we selectively see only what we want to see and hear.

Come on my friend just delete all that you have learnt and start reading from the beginning from a neutral source and you will just realize the unity of this civilization.

i dont buy shit, u plz continue and sell this choran to Afghanis, may be they will buy this shit..

Indian subcontinent was never a single entity, whoever say otherwise is either a patshala student or RSS shakha member..

India as country come into being in 1947, there was no republic of India before 1947.

Yes what you are saying is correct Pakistan and Bangladesh or Nepal would deny that we all share common roots because the very acceptance of that truth would destroy their legitimacy of being separate and provide more legitimacy to India and the concept of reunion.
and India would deny our reasoning because of same reason even if we have more proofs then them... while Hindutva fanatics only have shitty logic, nothing to back their agenda. just spreading shit bcoz of huge numbers..

How about going a few years back before the moguls and the British era.
Dehli Sultanate was ruler of Present day Pakistan and some part of northern India, while south, east Indian subcontinent had their own empires and rulers..

Wanna go more back?

When Muhammad Bin Qasim Attacked sindh and south Punjab Raja Dahir was ruler of those lands .. no Indian king ruling whole subcontinent from Dehli :D

the rajput who stop Arab expansion was not from Dehli either but a ruler of western and central India , map of rajput empire



Want to go more back? Raja Porus was king of Punjab when Alexander invaded Indus valley..

Come on my friend just delete all that you have learnt and start reading from the beginning from a neutral source

RSS is neutral enough for you :D just asking..
 
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Jamwal's

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No one wants akhand bharat.

Apart from some crazy loons of RSS no one would ever want the BS going on on BD or Pakistan to have fallouts also in India. Pakistan serves as a buffer zone for India for middle east bullshit and we are pretty comfortable with that. No one wants pakistan to be part of India
Akhand Bharat means "demographic disaster" Indians would've have revolved against it after beating the Hindutva loonies with our Bare hands.

Moreover, we are thankful to Mr Jinnah and Pandit Nehru for the Partition.
 

SrNair

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Earlier Vedas claimed indra as supreme god, the later mahabharatha and Ramayana claimed vishnu as supreme and said indra is also an avatar/part of vishnu. Comfortably annexed indra into vishnu to promote your superlative theories. This is how everyone in india worshipped the same god and bluffed that as hinduism.

Another bluff is, sanskrit an indian language, while sanskrit names were recorded much earlier by the syrian mitanni kingdom than the indian sanskrit manuscripts. Mitanni's worshipped/recorded indra, varuna,etc much earlier than the indian vedic manuscripts. When the god's language itself not originated in India, how the god could have originated in india? Or syria was anytime part of Indian kingdoms despite worshipping the same gods? Nope... So your theory of india united bcoz of hinduism is nothing more than another bluff..

Our lord muruga's all six houses(arupadai veedu) are located only in tamil nadu and he is also said to be a hindu god. This is how everyone in the world was hindus once, according to your RSS/BJP/hindutvadis.
Really ??
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Namakkal_Anjaneyar_Temple
Agreed Mr Obvious .
Did I mentioned about Sanskrit language in my post?
Bhakti movement was propogated through native languages not through Sanskrit .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mattur

Perhaps you may have some retarded kumarikandam ideas .But donot force that stupidity on other South Indians .

I did read this, and it seems strange.

The author mentions that most major civilizations formed along the banks of a great river... Yangtze for China (wrong... it was actually the Yellow River in Northern China)... and the Indus River for India. Giving India claim as a civilization state.

Which would make sense if we were talking about British India. But not the Republic of India, since the vast majority of the Indus River exists in modern day Pakistan.

And from what the Pakistani members have been saying, they fully oppose Indian claims over this river or any history related to it.

So when the author talks about "India" they seem to be talking about the entire South Asia, which the Pakistani and Bangladeshi members here strongly oppose.

It's like when we mention that the Buddha was from Nepal, the Indian members here say "it's the same thing as India". But it's not? India is not the same thing as South Asia, just like China is not the same thing as East Asia.
And GoI can decide whether Indus want to flow through Pakistan .What about that ?
Civilization's main factors are humans .Without humans there wouldnt any civilizations in this earth .
And now it is Indians that follow that same age old tradition .
Perhaps our Thar was once a fertile land with extension of this civilization ,Does it matter now.
You can say whatever you want about the origins of Buddhism .But Buddhism was a direct spin off of Hinduism ,that is why Nepalis and Indians visits each other during festival days .
It was Hinduism that maintained a strong linkage in India.
 

Nilgiri

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Great post @Samudra Manthan . I am reminded of the stories of Adi Shankaracharya my late grandfather would tell me as a kid. Then I read about him myself in later years, truly phenomenal visionary. It is the philosophical revolution he brought in that united our Dharmic culture like no other before and since that guarantees our nationhood from within.

You are very right in exploring the nuance between a "nation" and a relatively more temporary "country". India will always be a nation for many reasons....ever since the Mahabharat epic and Maurya empires. This is what some people will never understand....they can never understand the meaning behind the name Bharat....and how the story of his descendants shaped India into a nation by exploring ethics, philosophies, human nature and passion that are the root of all civilisation.
 

Majet Raha

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Everything including Mars is Indian. chal ab bacha kush?
No, actually everything is this world has a connection with one single civilization, i dont want to get into same child game of which civilization it was.
Your and mine ancestors were doing rituals for Nava Graha (which incidenty includes Mars or we call it as "Mangal").


You need to read history of Islam and Christianity and also learn what it is called "Peganism" in todays world.

Once you do that you will be qualified to contribute to this thread.

thanks for your time.
 

911

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I did read this, and it seems strange.

The author mentions that most major civilizations formed along the banks of a great river... Yangtze for China (wrong... it was actually the Yellow River in Northern China)... and the Indus River for India. Giving India claim as a civilization state.

Which would make sense if we were talking about British India. But not the Republic of India, since the vast majority of the Indus River exists in modern day Pakistan.

And from what the Pakistani members have been saying, they fully oppose Indian claims over this river or any history related to it.

So when the author talks about "India" they seem to be talking about the entire South Asia, which the Pakistani and Bangladeshi members here strongly oppose.

It's like when we mention that the Buddha was from Nepal, the Indian members here say "it's the same thing as India". But it's not? India is not the same thing as South Asia, just like China is not the same thing as East Asia.
Civilization is formed by people not land. Indus valley civilization was ~5000 ago, it was abandoned and people moved from there for unkown reasons. Those people may have died out, may be present or maybe be mixed with some other people, but certainly no one today is exactly same as them. After its downfall there have been many many Islamic invasions and mass movements into that region from middle east and central asia time to time. :-) This is not the right place to learn history, you can try search internet.
 

Maravan

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Really ??
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Namakkal_Anjaneyar_Temple
Agreed Mr Obvious .
Did I mentioned about Sanskrit language in my post?
Bhakti movement was propogated through native languages not through Sanskrit .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mattur

Perhaps you may have some retarded kumarikandam ideas .But donot force that stupidity on other South Indians .
An anjaneyar temple with dravidian architecture which is believed to be from 5th century proves tamils worshipped anjenayar and he is native to this land? LOL, what about the mosque that was built with dravidian architecture dated back to 6th century shows you, that also native to this land? :lol: that's the time almost every religion and their gods entered our lands and your anjenaya is one in that.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palaiya_Jumma_Palli


Your false pride of shielding indian culture from islam/middle easterners were a myth, already they invaded you with their indra, varuna,etc who are ruling your culture/literature for 1000s of years.

Who denied bhakti movement wasn't in native language? All the 63 nayanmaars are only from Tamil nadu, not a surprise they used tamil. Our literature claims lord shiva and muruga were present in the first tamil sangam while introducing the first tamil grammar agathiyam, we never claimed lord siva isn't ours. Siva is part of our culture for a long time like jallikattu from IVC times.

Still the Dravidian bruhai speakers in pakistan prove there was an overlap in the past with indo-european culture and native dravidian culture in this land. Its the reality Mr.Retards and fools of indian govt aren't ready to accept and hiding behind genetics... Are we following african culture then, since the gene dated back to 60000years during the first migration was matching with people near madurai?

Did I mention kumari kandam here? If sanskrit is not yours, ultimately all your history and pride is nothing more than an empty rhetoric since you don't have anything(works)in your native language, your ramayan mahabharatha is just like an urdu book written by a person who knows urdu in india.
 

jamahir

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In the end cry me a river fill the Indus I AM A MUSLIM and I AM PROUD TO BE INDIAN
i am socialist, muslim, indian... describe to me the paradise that is india.

Agreed to the most of it.

Same goes for India where every individual have their own identities where in when you in Rajasthan you will have history of rajputs belonging to the clans of rajputs with their unique history of their own kingdoms.

At the same time if you go towards Maharastra it will be marathas
only marathas??

in what is now maharashtra state, history has also had the bahmani kingdom, the nizam shahi kingdom and the janjira state established by habshi muslims ( abyssinians ).

of course, being a socialist i don't support the concept of kingdom/empire/monarchy and what i wrote the previous paragraph in a historic sense.

Classic case of sach sunne par "Mirch Lagna"

if any of the above have been false let me know. World works on numbers and numbers are in favor of India not in favor of faltu ka randirona.
randirona??

your use of that phrase as a mocking slur suggests that you are a female who doesn't like other females, meaning misogyny... or am i wrong??
 
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posedion

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Earlier Vedas claimed indra as supreme god, the later mahabharatha and Ramayana claimed vishnu as supreme and said indra is also an avatar/part of vishnu. Comfortably annexed indra into vishnu to promote your superlative theories. This is how everyone in india worshipped the same god and bluffed that as hinduism.

Another bluff is, sanskrit an indian language, while sanskrit names were recorded much earlier by the syrian mitanni kingdom than the indian sanskrit manuscripts. Mitanni's worshipped/recorded indra, varuna,etc much earlier than the indian vedic manuscripts. When the god's language itself not originated in India, how the god could have originated in india? Or syria was anytime part of Indian kingdoms despite worshipping the same gods? Nope... So your theory of india united bcoz of hinduism is nothing more than another bluff..

Our lord muruga's all six houses(arupadai veedu) are located only in tamil nadu and he is also said to be a hindu god. This is how everyone in the world was hindus once, according to your RSS/BJP/hindutvadis.
If you wakeup from the dream of this robotic living you will understand your own divinity

Why indra chandra and others

The self is so subtle this robotic living eat drink sleep think work worry the actual presence is missed everytime

In such presence is your divinity and your eternal nature, duality doesn't help
 

SrNair

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An anjaneyar temple with dravidian architecture which is believed to be from 5th century proves tamils worshipped anjenayar and he is native to this land? LOL, what about the mosque that was built with dravidian architecture dated back to 6th century shows you, that also native to this land? :lol: that's the time almost every religion and their gods entered our lands and your anjenaya is one in that.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palaiya_Jumma_Palli


Your false pride of shielding indian culture from islam/middle easterners were a myth, already they invaded you with their indra, varuna,etc who are ruling your culture/literature for 1000s of years.

Who denied bhakti movement wasn't in native language? All the 63 nayanmaars are only from Tamil nadu, not a surprise they used tamil. Our literature claims lord shiva and muruga were present in the first tamil sangam while introducing the first tamil grammar agathiyam, we never claimed lord siva isn't ours. Siva is part of our culture for a long time like jallikattu from IVC times.

Still the Dravidian bruhai speakers in pakistan prove there was an overlap in the past with indo-european culture and native dravidian culture in this land. Its the reality Mr.Retards and fools of indian govt aren't ready to accept and hiding behind genetics... Are we following african culture then, since the gene dated back to 60000years during the first migration was matching with people near madurai?

Did I mention kumari kandam here? If sanskrit is not yours, ultimately all your history and pride is nothing more than an empty rhetoric since you don't have anything(works)in your native language, your ramayan mahabharatha is just like an urdu book written by a person who knows urdu in india.
Anjaneya is the major character of Ramayana .Again Ramayana and its story is almost connected with North Indians .
Then why should you worship a sanskrit God in your land ?
Noone invaded us and those who tried for it was eventually absorbed by us .Why those 63 couldnt stay inside TN ?Instead all of them visited various place of India why ?
Well .Do you want to see Pakistanis comments about Tamils ?:D

May be .But then again a lots of adivasis in other parts of India also have african gene in their blood .But who the F cares? :D


My native language is good enough for us and rest of our 3.3 crore people.
And we are not that type of stupid for constructing (dravidian) temples for actors and actresses :sarcastic:
 

Brahmaputra Mail

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Buddha was from Nepal
Technically that's wrong. Siddartha Gautam was born in Lumbini which is in present day Nepal, but Gautam Buddha was born in Gaya. Gautam Buddha and Siddartha Gautam were ideologically different people, although they shared the same body. :P The day of enlightenment below the Bodhi tree is what shaped the birth of a new enlightened one.
 

Star Wars

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Anjaneya is the major character of Ramayana .Again Ramayana and its story is almost connected with North Indians .
Then why should you worship a sanskrit God in your land ?
Noone invaded us and those who tried for it was eventually absorbed by us .Why those 63 couldnt stay inside TN ?Instead all of them visited various place of India why ?
Well .Do you want to see Pakistanis comments about Tamils ?:D

May be .But then again a lots of adivasis in other parts of India also have african gene in their blood .But who the F cares? :D


My native language is good enough for us and rest of our 3.3 crore people.
And we are not that type of stupid for constructing (dravidian) temples for actors and actresses :sarcastic:

You might want to pipe down with the whole " South Indian Pride" thing. Stop trying to desperatly seperate North India from South India. I have seen you repeatadly try to seperate North India and South India some way or the other on this forum ,to the extant of debating the very seperation of South India. I am from Kerala , if you are wondering...
 

Armstrong

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You might want to pipe down with the whole " South Indian Pride" thing. Stop trying to desperatly seperate North India from South India. I have seen you repeatadly try to seperate North India and South India some way or the other on this forum. I am from Kerala , if you are wondering...
BS....Veradun was too bad at maths to be from Kerala ! :tsk:
 

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