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Was Russia enticed to invade Ukarine?

AZADPAKISTAN2009

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Russia is winning comfortably winning

Keep watching the social media volley ball team video , there was some video circulating some Ukrainian women part of volleyball team , some sort of propaganda on social media

The video used to play every day , but once war started

But now it is very quite ...

Russia smacking Ukraine fan boy's never entered the area near Russians

* Ukraine was setup on Russia's old ancestral land there is no way Russia will let it go
 

LeGenD

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Russia is winning comfortably winning

Keep watching the social media volley ball team video , there was some video circulating some Ukrainian women part of volleyball team , some sort of propaganda on social media

The video used to play every day , but once war started

But now it is very quite ...

Russia smacking Ukraine fan boy's never entered the area near Russians

* Ukraine was setup on Russia's old ancestral land there is no way Russia will let it go
Sure.

DraftUkraineCoTMay08%2C2022.png


Blue areas = Ukrainian gains

Red areas = Under occupation of Russian forces

Russian forces have also suffered some naval losses in Black Sea. These losses have hampered efforts to secure Kherson, Mykolaiv and Odessa.


Latest:

DraftUkraineCoTMay13%2C2022_0.png


  • Ukraine has likely won the Battle of Kharkiv. Russian forces continued to withdraw from the northern settlements around Kharkiv City. Ukrainian forces will likely attempt to disrupt Russian ground lines of communication to Izyum.
  • Ukrainian forces have likely disrupted the Russian attempt to cross the Siverskyi Donets River in force, undermining Russian efforts to mass troops in northern Donbas and complete the encirclement of Severodonetsk and Lysychansk.
  • Russian forces have likely secured the highway near the western entrance to the Azovstal Steel Plant but fighting for the facility continues.
  • Russian forces in Zaporizhia Oblast are likely attempting to reach artillery range outside Zaporizhia City.
  • Ukrainian forces are reportedly attempting to regain control of Snake Island off the Romanian coast or at least disrupt Russia’s ability to use it.


Everything is under control.

aqG6KAp_700bwp.webp
 

AZADPAKISTAN2009

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russiawinning.png


Russia winning

nopeacewanted.png



Seems like Ukraine does not want peace



Mean while social media using this song with Ukraine , it's not on youtube but the viral videos are on Tiktok

 
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jhungary

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Sure.

DraftUkraineCoTMay08%2C2022.png


Blue areas = Ukrainian gains

Red areas = Under occupation of Russian forces

Russian forces have also suffered some naval losses in Black Sea. These losses have hampered efforts to secure Kherson, Mykolaiv and Odessa.


Latest:

DraftUkraineCoTMay13%2C2022_0.png


  • Ukraine has likely won the Battle of Kharkiv. Russian forces continued to withdraw from the northern settlements around Kharkiv City. Ukrainian forces will likely attempt to disrupt Russian ground lines of communication to Izyum.
  • Ukrainian forces have likely disrupted the Russian attempt to cross the Siverskyi Donets River in force, undermining Russian efforts to mass troops in northern Donbas and complete the encirclement of Severodonetsk and Lysychansk.
  • Russian forces have likely secured the highway near the western entrance to the Azovstal Steel Plant but fighting for the facility continues.
  • Russian forces in Zaporizhia Oblast are likely attempting to reach artillery range outside Zaporizhia City.
  • Ukrainian forces are reportedly attempting to regain control of Snake Island off the Romanian coast or at least disrupt Russia’s ability to use it.


Everything is under control.

aqG6KAp_700bwp.webp
It is increasingly seeming like Putin is hanging out their force in Ukraine to dry.

I was watching the TV in Ukraine when they show Putin's address on Victory day. And then ask my Ukrainian friend what he thought about it. And what he said is quite true.

"He's gone quiet about the war" That's what he said, what he meant is that he could have blown up the "Victory" on Kherson, Izyum and the general advance, albeit small, in Donbas, but he choose not to say any of those, nor does he really rally the troop. He choose to just glance over that there are still a war going on in Ukraine, and that those people will not be forgotten (which is directly contradicting his speech on victory day) which my friend see as his message to his people to forget about the war.

There are no way Russia can win a major swath of land like they said in the "change of phase" Ukraine is pushing toward Vovchansk and Kupiansk, both of which important Railway junction toward the war in the East. It is very likely the Ukrainian will be able to push into the area and when that happened, the entire Russian assault would fail, even if Ukrainian cannot push toward either or both of those city, it will bring them into Artillery range of Ukrainian Artillery, which will hamper their ability to act as logistic hub in the region.
 

AZADPAKISTAN2009

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Russia can make it very easy with nuking the Western front of Ukraine and then knocking out the resistance fast

1 good nuke by Poland and war will end in 2 days

Putin has been merciful to follow thru o ground offensive using conventional war
 

Hamartia Antidote

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Unless, they, read the Americans, foresaw all this but calculated this as a perfect opportunity to bring the European nations inline with American policy.

They have achieved their aims, because Europe is united for an anti Russia stance.

Yes, it was not long ago the US had to basically "on its own" purchase two helicopter aircraft carriers the French were selling to Russia. Seems the EU didn't think the sale of such vessels to Russia was that big of a deal.

Now I'm sure they will not be so quiet about these things. I'm sure Ukraine is thankful the sale didn't go through.

The European countries will bolster their defence spending and capabilities, meaning, for continuous economic prosperity they will find it difficult to isolate or cut-off China. They will require continuous engagement with China for economic growth.

No, the real thing is the EU doesn't trust China anymore because of its holding Russia's hand on the Ukraine. Now they aren't going to brush off security warnings like Huawei doing 5G or Chinese companies buying tech firms.

The absolute smartest thing China can do right now is to make some "Saul-to-Paul" announcement that they are outraged at what is going on in Ukraine and they are doing a 180 and sending aid to the Ukrainians. If they don't they can kiss all their inroads with the EU goodbye.
 
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PakFactor

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Yes, it was not long ago the US had to basically "on its own" purchase two helicopter aircraft carriers the French were selling to Russia. Seems the EU didn't think the sale of such vessels to Russia was that big of a deal.

Now I'm sure they will not be so quiet about these things. I'm sure Ukraine is thankful the sale didn't go through.



No, the real thing is the EU doesn't trust China anymore because of its holding Russia's hand on the Ukraine. Now they aren't going to brush off security warnings like Huawei doing 5G or Chinese companies buying tech firms.

The absolute smartest thing China can do right now is to make some "Saul-to-Paul" announcement that they are outraged at what is going on in Ukraine and they are doing a 180 and sending aid to the Ukrainians. If they don't they can kiss all their inroads with the EU goodbye.

It's a double edged sword for China to condemn Russia -- they rather have friendly relations with a big neighbor to there north who can watch there back while US is bulldozing through its Indo-Pacific policy. What the Chinese are doing is smart, any prudent individual would've done the same to force the Russians into this conflict on European soil. This will force the Russians to align there foreign policy along the Chinese agenda. You also have to understand one critical thing, Russia is a big nuclear weapons power and China doesn't have the parity with the West with Russia it does.

As the Chinese are now saying, "why stop this conflict, so they can point there gun at us?"

But its a long discussion but overall an understandable strategy from Chinese point of view.
 
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Hamartia Antidote

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What the Chinese are doing is smart, any prudent individual would've done the same to force the Russians into this conflict on European soil.

As the Chinese are now saying, "why stop this conflict, so they can point there gun at us?"

China hasn't gained anything. Trump warned the EU that Putin and Xi were already having a foreign policy bromance well before the Ukraine invasion...and the EU simply looked the other way and didn't take it seriously.

Now that Putin and Xi are out of the closet with their shared opinions of Ukraine the eyes of the EU are now wide open.
 

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China hasn't gained anything. Trump warned the EU that Putin and Xi were already having a foreign policy bromance well before the Ukraine invasion...and the EU simply looked the other way and didn't take it seriously.

Now that Putin and Xi are out of the closet with their shared opinions of Ukraine the eyes of the EU are now wide open.

Trump was probably a Putin plant and had he been in power, Ukraine would have been finished. The chinese themselves are very pragmatic. They will take full advantage of Russia's weakness. They are gobbling up or will be gobbling up Russian resources for pennies on the dollar all the while Chinese companies are scaling back operations in Russia. They will have their cake and eat it. The Chinese have already stated that they recognize the territorial integrity of Ukraine including DPR/LPR as being part of Ukraine.

This will go down in History as a gross miscalculation by Putin vs. Bad luck. They needed things to go their way, Trump as president, weakened EU, they spent years setting up internal EU divisions and playing them up, got the UK out of the EU and did arguably weaken NATO politically. If the Poles and the Baltic states not forced NATO/EU into the fight, Ukraine would not have the support it has. Keep in mind the Polish govt. is no saints either and are also populist Right wing idealogues.
 

Hamartia Antidote

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Trump was probably a Putin plant and had he been in power, Ukraine would have been finished. The chinese themselves are very pragmatic. They will take full advantage of Russia's weakness. They are gobbling up or will be gobbling up Russian resources for pennies on the dollar all the while Chinese companies are scaling back operations in Russia. They will have their cake and eat it. The Chinese have already stated that they recognize the territorial integrity of Ukraine including DPR/LPR as being part of Ukraine.

This will go down in History as a gross miscalculation by Putin vs. Bad luck. They needed things to go their way, Trump as president, weakened EU, they spent years setting up internal EU divisions and playing them up, got the UK out of the EU and did arguably weaken NATO politically. If the Poles and the Baltic states not forced NATO/EU into the fight, Ukraine would not have the support it has. Keep in mind the Polish govt. is no saints either and are also populist Right wing idealogues.

Well both Russia and China are taking a serious downgrade in the EU over Ukraine while the US comes out with an upgrade.
 

insight-out

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I wouldn't say Russia was enticed, rather they were put in a position where they had no choice. The Americans threatened to bring NATO to their doorstep.

Russia could sit back and let NATO expand into the unofficial neutral zone, or it could preempt that expansion by invading Ukraine.

The Americans played it smart by not engaging the Russians directly - the Americans rarely do. Instead, much like Afghanistan, the Russians now have to hold territory, while Ukraine can wage a much cheaper guerilla war, with US and European help, and bleed Russia.

The Americans are definitely the aggressors here. And Russia is at a disadvantage.
 

jhungary

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Trump was probably a Putin plant and had he been in power, Ukraine would have been finished. The chinese themselves are very pragmatic. They will take full advantage of Russia's weakness. They are gobbling up or will be gobbling up Russian resources for pennies on the dollar all the while Chinese companies are scaling back operations in Russia. They will have their cake and eat it. The Chinese have already stated that they recognize the territorial integrity of Ukraine including DPR/LPR as being part of Ukraine.

This will go down in History as a gross miscalculation by Putin vs. Bad luck. They needed things to go their way, Trump as president, weakened EU, they spent years setting up internal EU divisions and playing them up, got the UK out of the EU and did arguably weaken NATO politically. If the Poles and the Baltic states not forced NATO/EU into the fight, Ukraine would not have the support it has. Keep in mind the Polish govt. is no saints either and are also populist Right wing idealogues.
This was is never about Ukraine in the West. This war, for the West, is to drag Sweden and Finland into their camp.

Were Russia tempted to attack? Perhaps, but Putin would probably be either delusion or an useful idiot to attack Ukraine had this been a Western Trap. Think about it like this, for a normal person, you threaten me with violence, and I look for someone to protect me from you, then you literally attack me to try to force me not to find protection. That's not logical. And then you threaten my friends and neighbour. What would be the normal reaction? Me, my friend and my neighbour will all go and seek protection...Hence Sweden and Finland wanted to dump 130 years and 70 years of neutrality and join NATO.

There are no way Russia can come out ahead in this war had they actually attack, because as it will simply make people wanted to join NATO more, and as predicted, this shift happened in Sweden and Finland and now Moldova are also contemplating for NATO membership. This is going to back fire and everyone with a functioning brain can see it. Yet Russia still attacked.

There are numerous "Predication" on why Russia attack. From the very simple Putin saw US pull out of Afghan, he sees it as weakness and want in, or he think invading Ukraine would be like Crimea, quick and bloodless and the west cant do anything before his operation is completed, to he is terminally ill and he just don't care or were not able to make sound decision.

On the other hand, if he wanted Ukraine, what he should have done is wait for 3 years until Biden presidency is over, and see if he can get Trump back, if not one of his follower, then either subverts the Ukrainian government or waiting for a weaker NATO position to attack. But then who knows, he may not have 4 years.....


On the other hand, one wild card not too many people can see is the war bend together the entire Europe. Europe like US were divided between Left and Right, namely Nordics , Germany and Central Europe. This war bring them together and bend them toward the same man, Putin, this is unforeseen, no one would have thought the EU will give such an effort united against Putin. That I think even comrade Putin failed to see
 

Hamartia Antidote

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The Americans threatened to bring NATO to their doorstep.

LOL! What about countries like Germany who had the Eastern Bloc on their doorstep for decades. I guess they would be completely justified to invade and bomb the Eastern Bloc cities to oblivion to "head off any possible future aggression". :rolleyes1:

Same with Turkey. Damn those Russian are way too close...they deserve to be attacked.

Putin isn't helping by simply threatening to point missiles at countries like Finland instead of giving them reassurances that there is no security threat that they need to worry about.

 
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insight-out

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LOL! What about countries like Germany who had the Eastern Bloc on their doorstep for decades. I guess they would be completely justified to invade and bomb the Eastern Bloc cities to oblivion to "head off any possible future aggression". :rolleyes1:

Same with Turkey. Damn those Russian are way too close...they deserve to be attacked.

Putin isn't helping by simply threatening to point missiles at countries like Finland instead of giving them reassurances that there is no security threat that they need to worry about.

That was during the Cold War. Things were different then. After the Soviet collapse, the maps were redrawn, with Russia losing influence in Eastern Europe. NATO was created to counter the Soviet bloc. After its collapse, the expansion of NATO is nothing but provocative and aggressive.
 

AlbastiLeGrand

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In the same way the US enticed saddam to invade Kuwait, and the same way they enticed Gaddafi to invade Chad.

Putin has fallen for the same ruse, but this time the US won’t manage to take him out
 

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