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Featured Turkey Widens War Tech Hunt by Tapping Pakistan’s China Ties

T-SaGe

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Turkey is ahead in some basic domains and a couple advanced domains, Pakistan is miles ahead in more advanced and extremely sensitive domains. If u do not have adequate information, please refrain from bieng an insufferable "know nothing at all".
I would like to correct an inaccurate information by apologizing: Turkish defense industry that you underestimate as claiming to having expertise in a few fields, It's been a long time since moved beyond this claim.

Today, number of ongoing projects, carried out within the Defense Industry Presidency has exceeded 700. Among these projects, the final product or main system ratio is below 10%. The number of countries in the world working so intensely on the basis of subsystems, production technologies and design capabilities is just as the fingers of two hands. System engineering and integration activities, which started in the late 80s and 1990s, have now turned into vertical specializied sectors, with progress on the basis of design and subsystems. Today, total contract size of current projects is approaching $ 100 billion. With its ecosystem of more than 3500 companies and the defense industry giants, which are among the 100 defense companies in the world, it is the country that increases its global competitiveness fastest. You can easily see this with the increase in the armed forces' indigenous rate and export figures of the last 10 years. However, what I need to draw attention to here is that the 2020-2033 interval represents a transition to a new paradigm for the Turkish defense industry. Those who want to get detailed information on this subject can search the 2033 vision document of the Turkish army on the internet. These stages are not being considered from yesterday to today, there are decades of detailed planning, labor and resource transfers exceeding billions of dollars.

The stereotypes written here about the Turkish defense industry are mostly focused on the main systems of the process that started after the 2004-2011 Defense Industry Executive Board decisions. However, there is hardly any up-to-date information flow. When I made several searches on the forum, I saw incredibly incorrect informations about that. I think this situation causes a misunderstanding for you.
 

graphican

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Both Pakistan and Turkey lack certain capabilities in fighter development. I personally believe that we open our eyes and bot countries go for F 31 from China. with TOT particularly in case of engine.

Both can keep their own programs running parallel with acquisition J31.
There is a Chinese proverb that says "walk on two legs". That's a beautiful strategy that Pakistan should adopt towards its next-gen fighter program. Let there be a partnership with Turkey on TFX and another partnership with China on FC-31. We might only induct one of the two planes but our exposure to two independent projects will benefit the one we procure.

Besides, JF-17 will not end at block-III. To create the next blocks you need to step out of what you currently have.
 

Awan68

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I would like to correct an inaccurate information by apologizing: Turkish defense industry that you underestimate as claiming to having expertise in a few fields, It's been a long time since moved beyond this claim.

Today, number of ongoing projects, carried out within the Defense Industry Presidency has exceeded 700. Among these projects, the final product or main system ratio is below 10%. The number of countries in the world working so intensely on the basis of subsystems, production technologies and design capabilities is just as the fingers of two hands. System engineering and integration activities, which started in the late 80s and 1990s, have now turned into vertical specializied sectors, with progress on the basis of design and subsystems. Today, total contract size of current projects is approaching $ 100 billion. With its ecosystem of more than 3500 companies and the defense industry giants, which are among the 100 defense companies in the world, it is the country that increases its global competitiveness fastest. You can easily see this with the increase in the armed forces' indigenous rate and export figures of the last 10 years. However, what I need to draw attention to here is that the 2020-2033 interval represents a transition to a new paradigm for the Turkish defense industry. Those who want to get detailed information on this subject can search the 2033 vision document of the Turkish army on the internet. These stages are not being considered from yesterday to today, there are decades of detailed planning, labor and resource transfers exceeding billions of dollars.

The stereotypes written here about the Turkish defense industry are mostly focused on the main systems of the process that started after the 2004-2011 Defense Industry Executive Board decisions. However, there is hardly any up-to-date information flow. When I made several searches on the forum, I saw incredibly incorrect informations about that. I think this situation causes a misunderstanding for you.
I hold no stereotypes against Turkish industry nor will i ever undermine it as i cheer every Turkish accomplishment as much as i cheer a Pakistani one, Turkey has propelled itself as a major defence player in the last decade, no one can deny that, i was merely pointing out to the other member that some extremely sensitive domains like BM's and CM's is where Turkey lags behind Pakistan and the reply was in context to what he had posted, cheers.
 

Falcon26

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WOW first it was an Islamic bomb now a new term "MUSLIM FIGHTER JET"

I think by this term author is expecting that such technology will be used by both countries that this jet would announce Shahada first and then Takbeer before to initiate flight every time ....

well below is the "Author" of article

View attachment 721873

........... :angel::angel::angel::angel::angel:
So Justin Paul George is just an Indian with a Caucasian name?
 

SpaceMan18

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Where did you get this information? It is higly speculative, or possibly deliberate-false claim.

The MMU roll out ceremony will be held on March 18, 2023.[1] The aircraft will exit the hangar with GE engines in the first place.[2] Engine sets planned to be used in prototypes have already been purchased.[3] The date of 2029-2030 represents the beginning of Phase-2 / IOC in the project schedule.[4]
So they can export it by 2023 ?
 

khansaheeb

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It is imperative that collaboration becomes institutionalized above the fray of politics.
It is a military initiative not a political one, could be influenced by the politicians but not significantly.
Bad turkey. No F-35 for you!
You know where this leading to Turkey and Iran tearing up the NPT . NPT is a tool to keep Israel on top but it seems Israel is about to be toppled from that position.
 

T-SaGe

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So they can export it by 2023 ?
I do not think that what is being expressed here is 'sales'. The head of the defense industry (SSB) Demir saying that the negotiations on possible cooperation and partnerships continue with some of close ally countries. Moreover, this is not a new statement. Negotiations have been going on for two years, if you search net archives, you can find similar statements from last 2 years. Or, the following question may be asked: When was Indonesia partnered with the Korean project, what phase was the KFX project? You can extend the examples from the Russian-Indian Pak-Fa experience to the partner countries participation dates of the US JSF project or some other past european projects.

The start of the MMU project officially dates back to 2011. However, after the PDR phase, later major changes cannot be achieved in the project requirements and in the work shares in case of new participations. For the MMU project, the PDR deadline has been scheduled to 2022. The period from 2022 to 2029 targets prototypes and Qualification processes of MMU. The target range for the IOC is 2029-2030. What I meant to say that, While these systems coming together, millions of lines of codes are written, millions of hours of engineering work takes place. After not being a partner in these processes, what could be the meaning of the partnership other than incurring the development costs?

Of course, there are advantages to buying a ready-made aircraft. Engineering processes are completed, all of the problems encountered in these development processes are solved, and you even get a platform that has proven itself in operational terms. However, you also buy another logistics infrastructure with the plane. You do not have access to most avionics may be except for depot level maintenance. When purchasing aircraft, you also have to bear some of the development costs of the developer country.

Participating in a development program also poses much greater risk and of course other difficulties. However, at the end of the day, you will have the opportunity to have indipendent platform which could be backed by your domestic aerospace industry. Pakistan's glorious JF-17 was the result of such determination.
 

eagleeye

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So they can export it by 2023 ?
No 2023 is Rollout date with installed engine then the ground test will begin .it takes 2-3 years. 2026 will the first flight after then the flight test will start. Tfx and indigenious engine should be ready for serial production by 2030
 

Indos

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I do not think that what is being expressed here is 'sales'. The head of the defense industry (SSB) Demir saying that the negotiations on possible cooperation and partnerships continue with some of close ally countries. Moreover, this is not a new statement. Negotiations have been going on for two years, if you search net archives, you can find similar statements from last 2 years. Or, the following question may be asked: When was Indonesia partnered with the Korean project, what phase was the KFX project? You can extend the examples from the Russian-Indian Pak-Fa experience to the partner countries participation dates of the US JSF project or some other past european projects.

The start of the MMU project officially dates back to 2011. However, after the PDR phase, later major changes cannot be achieved in the project requirements and in the work shares in case of new participations. For the MMU project, the PDR deadline has been scheduled to 2022. The period from 2022 to 2029 targets prototypes and Qualification processes of MMU. The target range for the IOC is 2029-2030. What I meant to say that, While these systems coming together, millions of lines of codes are written, millions of hours of engineering work takes place. After not being a partner in these processes, what could be the meaning of the partnership other than incurring the development costs?

Of course, there are advantages to buying a ready-made aircraft. Engineering processes are completed, all of the problems encountered in these development processes are solved, and you even get a platform that has proven itself in operational terms. However, you also buy another logistics infrastructure with the plane. You do not have access to most avionics may be except for depot level maintenance. When purchasing aircraft, you also have to bear some of the development costs of the developer country.

Participating in a development program also poses much greater risk and of course other difficulties. However, at the end of the day, you will have the opportunity to have indipendent platform which could be backed by your domestic aerospace industry. Pakistan's glorious JF-17 was the result of such determination.
KFX/IFX project is started in 2009 with LOI, 2010 with MOU between Korea and Indonesia but the start of the joint R&D phase was at 2011 which is also the time where the contract is signed.

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mdmm

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I have confirmed it with Turkish , European etc etc sources that .
Yes, both Turkey and Pakistan are working,together hiddenly to manufacture a joint jet fighter TF-X . Like Pakistani Army ,who keeps all projects hidden, TF-X project will remain hidden until jet fly .
I donot agree with any stupid words against this joint venture in this forum.
Most of members are wrong, false , ignorant without any knowledge and news. .Please keep your dirty moth closed..
 

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