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Featured Turkey Widens War Tech Hunt by Tapping Pakistan’s China Ties

Ali_Baba

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J31 is not ready for anyone to realistically get it. It would require further investment to convert prototype to a functioning platform.. PAF has been playing the waiting game with the Chinese to let them invest the money before it will say YES or NO. The Chinese till now have not blinked which is the reason why there has been no progress beyond the 2(possibly 3) prototypes.
The problem is estimating what the sunk costs are likely to be and how it would impact on the prospective local programmes. The other issue is the engine for a fifth generation platform. There is no engine in China yet which would power this platform. So we may have a platform but no engine. So how does one run with such a platform. RD93s which are currently being use for the prototypes are not suitable for such a venture.
A
PAF is in no rush with new unproven platforms from China right now. China will have to create a full weapons system and platform and the full eco-system around the J-35 before PAF will consider it. Pakistan wants a "mature and debugged platform", it does not want to spend billions of dollars in getting the chinese to develop the IP and tech for the J-35 and have nothing left to buy the damn thing if that is what PAF intends.

Pakistan can look to TFX, and maybe even KFX Block II as options for an off-the-shelf product while it attempts to progress Azm...

PAF has learnt alot with the JF17 programme where it was left holding the baby (ie funding the full development of JF17 itself, after PLAAF walked away) and it won't make the same mistake again with any chinese platform. It takes serious amounts of time and money to develop these platforms into something useable.

VT4 is a mature platform. Type 54 is a mature platform .. etc..
 

Mohamed Bin Tughlaq

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I am talking about the US origin engine
Turkey successfully tests 2nd prototype of indigenous helicopter engine
Prototype of Turkey's 1st indigenous helicopter engine passes ignition test, says manufacturing company


The second prototype of Turkey's first indigenous helicopter engine successfully ignited on Tuesday, the producing company announced.

"The first ignition and operation of the TS4 turboshaft engine were successfully carried out on Jan. 6, 2021," said a statement by Turkish Engine Industries (TEI) following tests of the TEI-TS1400 engine's prototype.




This came after its predecessor, the TS3, also successfully passed similar tests for turboshaft engine that, once complete, will be integrated into the country's first indigenous multirole helicopter Gokbey.

The TS4 engine was brought to the ground idle power level, TEI said, adding that the tests were designed and developed entirely by TEI engineers and technicians.

The company noted that a total of four engine test units would be used in the project to quickly complete the necessary certification efforts.


It is only dwellers of the past who would think engines are a chellenge in 2020s. Times change
 
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PakAlp

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It would be ideal situation for Pakistan to collaborate with China and Turkey for its defence needs. Usa and France is a dead end for us. Turkey biggest challenge is to build or gain export license for the 5th generation and T129 helicopter, if they can overcome this obstacle then Pakistan/Turkish defence ties can reach a new level within the next decade or so.
Turkey successfully tests 2nd prototype of indigenous helicopter engine
Prototype of Turkey's 1st indigenous helicopter engine passes ignition test, says manufacturing company


The second prototype of Turkey's first indigenous helicopter engine successfully ignited on Tuesday, the producing company announced.

"The first ignition and operation of the TS4 turboshaft engine were successfully carried out on Jan. 6, 2021," said a statement by Turkish Engine Industries (TEI) following tests of the TEI-TS1400 engine's prototype.




This came after its predecessor, the TS3, also successfully passed similar tests for turboshaft engine that, once complete, will be integrated into the country's first indigenous multirole helicopter Gokbey.

The TS4 engine was brought to the ground idle power level, TEI said, adding that the tests were designed and developed entirely by TEI engineers and technicians.

The company noted that a total of four engine test units would be used in the project to quickly complete the necessary certification efforts.


It is only dwellers of the past who would think engines are a chellenge in 2020s. Times change
Is this engine for the t129 attack helicopter which Pakistan ordered?
 
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imranyounus

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Turkey successfully tests 2nd prototype of indigenous helicopter engine
Prototype of Turkey's 1st indigenous helicopter engine passes ignition test, says manufacturing company


The second prototype of Turkey's first indigenous helicopter engine successfully ignited on Tuesday, the producing company announced.

"The first ignition and operation of the TS4 turboshaft engine were successfully carried out on Jan. 6, 2021," said a statement by Turkish Engine Industries (TEI) following tests of the TEI-TS1400 engine's prototype.




This came after its predecessor, the TS3, also successfully passed similar tests for turboshaft engine that, once complete, will be integrated into the country's first indigenous multirole helicopter Gokbey.

The TS4 engine was brought to the ground idle power level, TEI said, adding that the tests were designed and developed entirely by TEI engineers and technicians.

The company noted that a total of four engine test units would be used in the project to quickly complete the necessary certification efforts.


It is only dwellers of the past who would think engines are a chellenge in 2020s. Times change
best of luck to Turkey hope they develop a full-fledged engine pretty soon and develop a fighter better than F 22. and all our worries are over now. Now I can sleep without worries.
 

araz

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Turkey successfully tests 2nd prototype of indigenous helicopter engine
Prototype of Turkey's 1st indigenous helicopter engine passes ignition test, says manufacturing company


The second prototype of Turkey's first indigenous helicopter engine successfully ignited on Tuesday, the producing company announced.

"The first ignition and operation of the TS4 turboshaft engine were successfully carried out on Jan. 6, 2021," said a statement by Turkish Engine Industries (TEI) following tests of the TEI-TS1400 engine's prototype.




This came after its predecessor, the TS3, also successfully passed similar tests for turboshaft engine that, once complete, will be integrated into the country's first indigenous multirole helicopter Gokbey.

The TS4 engine was brought to the ground idle power level, TEI said, adding that the tests were designed and developed entirely by TEI engineers and technicians.

The company noted that a total of four engine test units would be used in the project to quickly complete the necessary certification efforts.


It is only dwellers of the past who would think engines are a chellenge in 2020s. Times change
Wait and watch when this engine comes on to actual platform integration stage followed by retrials in Pakistan and then we will talk. You cannot hurry this stage of development. So your last statement is a bit ambitious.
A
best of luck to Turkey hope they develop a full-fledged engine pretty soon and develop a fighter better than F 22. and all our worries are over now. Now I can sleep without worries.
Sitaron sai aagay jehan aur bhi hain.
Abhi ishq kay imtehan aur bhi hain.
Do not count your chickens-before they hatch. We are all rooting for Turkey but we need to be patient.
A
 

imranyounus

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Wait and watch when this engine comes on to actual platform integration stage followed by retrials in Pakistan and then we will talk. You cannot hurry this stage of development. So your last statement is a bit ambitious.
A

Sitaron sai aagay jehan aur bhi hain.
Abhi ishq kay imtehan aur bhi hain.
Do not count your chickens-before they hatch. We are all rooting for Turkey but we need to be patient.
A
fully agreed but it will take time and no harm in learning form some one who already has knowledge.
 

araz

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fully agreed but it will take time and no harm in learning form some one who already has knowledge.
Couldn't agree more. This is why I am talking of a natural alliance and collaborative approach. We both have things the other can learn and production prices can be brought down while improving quality.
A
 

SABRE

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Can you guys imagine if AZM turns out being the TFX with WS-10? @JamD @SQ8 and -- so we have someone throwing cold water -- @Deino Maybe we should move this to the Pakistan Navy forum and see if the wishing well can do its magic...
One hitch, though I don't know if it still exists. The Chinese were not all too happy with Turkish stance on the East Turkistan aka Uyghur issue. From what it seems, Erdogan has taken up a silence on the issue in recent years. However, there is still domestic support for the Uyghur cause in Turkey, which also tends to put pressure on Erdogan.

Also, even if China is sensitised towards cooperating with Turkey there still would be a question of whether China would let Pakistan go for Turkish TFX powered by its WS-10 or if would pressurise Pakistan to go for J-31 instead?
 
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Trango Towers

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Both Pakistan and Turkey lack certain capabilities in fighter development. I personally believe that we open our eyes and bot countries go for F 31 from China. with TOT particularly in case of engine.

Both can keep their own programs running parallel with acquisition J31.
Some guy are born to lose. Your attitude suck.
 

The Eagle

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Can you guys imagine if AZM turns out being the TFX with WS-10? @JamD @SQ8 and -- so we have someone throwing cold water -- @Deino Maybe we should move this to the Pakistan Navy forum and see if the wishing well can do its magic...
Ny the way, on totally different note, Pakistan has successfully demonstrated to bring together the rival's of past. Anything can happen in this case.
 

Shahzaz ud din

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Bloomberg Report: Turkey Wants To Produce Missiles And Fighter Jets With Pakistan
By Omair Kamran On Mar 2, 2021
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A Pakistan Air Force (PAF) CAC/PAC JF-17 Thunder Jet.
Turkey is pushing to co-manufacture missiles and warplanes with Pakistan.

The collaboration will likely pave the way for Turkey to access prized war technology from China.


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Turkey-Pakistan friendship: From past to present | Daily Sabah

According to a Bloomberg report, Turkish defense and government officials have held meetings with their Pakistani counterparts on the prospects of developing and manufacturing military hardware together.
People from both countries have confirmed the development, adding that the last meeting took place in January.
Nevertheless, they did not disclose how far the two countries are to reach a deal or when such a meeting will occur again.
A deal would get NATO-member Turkey closer to some of China’s military technology.
A PAF JF-17 Thunder jet, manufactured by Chengdu Aircraft Corp. of China. (Jason Alden/Bloomberg)
Pakistan builds its JF-17 fighter jets with China and has adapted Chinese designs for its Shaheen ballistic missile.
Turkish officials familiar with the matter spoke to Bloomberg on the condition of anonymity to say that Ankara sees Islamabad as a strategic ally and a potential partner in developing its super long-range missile-defense project and TF-X fighter jets.
The Turkish President, Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, has hailed “very serious potential” for collaboration with Pakistan on defense projects, and top defense officials have met in recent months.



Turkey, Pakistan mulling dual nationality agreement.
How to get a visa for Turkey? A quick guide to business and tourist visas for Turkey – ALinks

Pakistan and Turkey have warmed up to each other over the past few months, with the latter even suggesting a dual national agreement with Pakistan.
The offer was made by the Turkish Ambassador to Pakistan, İhsan Mustafa Yurdakul, in a meeting with the then Interior Minister, Brigadier (retired) Ijaz Ahmad Shah, last year.
The Turkish envoy was informed by Ijaz Shah that the Ministry of Foreign Affairs was considering a draft and was in touch with the interior ministry. Meanwhile, the Turkish minister had assured the envoy that they would soon reach “a mutual conclusion.”
The ambassador said Turkey hopes that the process can be expedited and the final results can be achieved soon.
 

War Thunder

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Can you guys imagine if AZM turns out being the TFX with WS-10? @JamD @SQ8 and -- so we have someone throwing cold water -- @Deino Maybe we should move this to the Pakistan Navy forum and see if the wishing well can do its magic...

AZM is not going to be TFX. Pakistan will participate in TF-X for sure but AZM is a different project with different expectations. They might take some input from the Turks but there won't be a union of both projects at any stage.
Pakistan is going to need atleast three 5th gen platforms by 2030's.
 

imranyounus

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A combined project will be beneficial for both countries practical and less expense.

However combined designe parameters and capabilities may be an obstacle. It will be difficult to arrive at a design that meets requirements of both nations.

Turkey might go with SU 57 and TFX combination.
For PAF only option in that case will be to get a combination of TFX with F 20 or SU 57 but will it be possible and available.

Other option is to develop AZAM parallel to it with more focus on AG capabilities. but then participation in TFX will be limited.

best option is to either just buy TFX or J 31 ,and keep developing AZAM with interaction wit Turkey and China.
 

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