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Time to Bring Presidential System in Pakistan - Gen (r) Tariq Khan

fitpOsitive

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that will take a generation safely min 30 to 40 years,

Ethos can only be inculcated with a new and uniform education system and media ... that can again be done when education is a federal matter and not provincial.

About education: This can be teamwork between provincial and federal govt. The federal govt will introduce a flexible structure with some musts, and some parts open to be filled by the provincial govt. e.g A central organization will write a syllabus and will translate and adapt it to local languages with the help of the provincial govt (yes I am in favour of educating students in their own languages ). Out of 5 subjects, 2 subjects should be a must and 2 subjects based on provincial needs.


About educating the nation: Zia ul Haq used media very effectively to condition its kinetics. Those effects we still can see in the character of our nation. If I am offered a position in Pakistani administration, I will use this tool(media) in a way that nation will start solving most of the issues on its own. This range of actions extends right from training people how to behave on a particular matter to creating a homogeneous society through the induction of PhDs in linguistics.

I mean kam kerna paryga, or yeh karyga kon? Fawad Chodhry? :lol:
 

Leviza

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So the army can appoint anyone they want
Stupid army people think only they are most intelligent beings in Pakistan

last this thinking broke Pakistan and nothing is learned
 

-blitzkrieg-

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Pakistan can now only be saved, if a sincere, benevolent and ruthless dictator takes the reins of the country, in his hands, with the full support of PA. To hell with this sham democracy. A Chinese type of political system would do.
unfortunately Imran Khan is not as ruthless as we thought he would be. part of it is becuase he doesnt have enough powers in Punjab, baluchistan and sindh

Presidential system means a system in which people directly vote for president like Iran Russia USA. Pakistan main presidential system sa milta julta system sirf Ayub Khan ka tha. Awam councillors ko elect krti thi and councillors president MNAs and MPAs ko

We need a strict two party system , two parties that work for state not like 90s. .. the smaller parties can be bought by either for support.
 

SIPRA

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We need a strict two party system , two parties that work for state not like 90s. .. the smaller parties can be bought by either for support.

Don't agree. Single party system like in China.
unfortunately Imran Khan is not as ruthless as we thought he would be. part of it is becuase he doesnt have enough powers in Punjab, baluchistan and sindh

Two factors:
1) He is powerless.
2) Yes, he is not naturally ruthless.

But, we must appreciate, that to become ruthless, one has to have necessary power. If not people, than army.
 

-blitzkrieg-

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So the army can appoint anyone they want
Stupid army people think only they are most intelligent beings in Pakistan

last this thinking broke Pakistan and nothing is learned
the allegations of army appointing PM is happening as of today under parlimentary system as well..
the only thing that broke East Pakistan was mother nature.. you had a piece of land thousands of miles away with socialist leanings and a defunct constitution.They wanted Bengali as national language..Bangladesh should have been a separate nation from day 1.
Don't agree. Single party system like in China.


Two factors:
1) He is powerless.
2) Yes, he is not naturally ruthless.

But, we must appreciate, that to become ruthless, one has to have necessary power. If not people, than army.
im all for 1 party system as well.. but it should be done based on ground realities..
A two party system which behind the scenes is one party can serve to absorb the public disgruntlement .. we need a ruthless police force either way ..
 
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-blitzkrieg-

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1970 election was the first parliamentary election of Pakistan which broke Pakistan. Ayub khans presidential system kept Pakistan united
the cracks started appearing way earlier..Ayubs 1 unit kept the country together..but it was bound to happen.. sooner or later because of 1) geography 2) geopolitics and USSR role 3)absence of a framework of confederation let alone a constituion
 

SIPRA

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the cracks started appearing way earlier..Ayubs 1 unit kept the country together..but it was bound to happen.. sooner or later because of 1) geography 2) geopolitics and USSR role 3)absence of a framework of confederation let alone a constituion

Separation, of East Pakistan from the West Pakistan, was writ in the 1940 Lahore Resolution, far before Pakistan came into being. We resisted it unnecessarily.
 

-blitzkrieg-

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About education: This can be teamwork between provincial and federal govt. The federal govt will introduce a flexible structure with some musts, and some parts open to be filled by the provincial govt. e.g A central organization will write a syllabus and will translate and adapt it to local languages with the help of the provincial govt (yes I am in favour of educating students in their own languages ). Out of 5 subjects, 2 subjects should be a must and 2 subjects based on provincial needs.


About educating the nation: Zia ul Haq used media very effectively to condition its kinetics. Those effects we still can see in the character of our nation. If I am offered a position in Pakistani administration, I will use this tool(media) in a way that nation will start solving most of the issues on its own. This range of actions extends right from training people how to behave on a particular matter to creating a homogeneous society through the induction of PhDs in linguistics.

I mean kam kerna paryga, or yeh karyga kon? Fawad Chodhry? :lol:
the problem is provincial govts are thriving on tribal fiefdoms and education of masses doesnt suit them...an educated man means he will uplift his family who may become contender for politics with new leanings... they will ask education money to be handed out to them and it will be yanked into a foreign account.. So the provinces need a direct intervention.
 

peagle

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View attachment 799081
NSC and a presidential system in Pakistan?

Lt Gen Tariq Khan (R)
December 05, 2021


In the years preceding 9/11, Pakistan witnessed two thousand sectarian killings. Religion has now become a part of politics. The sitting government of the time could not find it within itself to say a few words of prayer for the departed soul of their own Governor, Salman Taseer when he was killed by his own guard. Governments were forced to review foreign policy as well as administrative policies in keeping with the maulvis’ views. This has resulted in the ridiculous spectacle of a Mullah Aziz of the Burqa fame to openly challenge the writ of the government in the heart of the capital even today or the disgusting sight of Mullah Khadim Rizvi, sitting in his wheelchair, abusing everyone in the government publicly.


If national security must address these issues it must first examine the very ethos of the state and bring back those values that the Quaid had stipulated in his first speech as well as his vision of unity, faith and discipline. No political agenda should ever be allowed to change these principles and it must be mandatory for a political manifesto to define how best it can enhance, support and develop those defined principles first and foremost. No other course can ever serve this country better and if we follow this path, reforms are recommended, which need to be put in to place with the highest priority: Judicial reforms are needed to provide a homegrown judicial system compatible with international law, to ensure equality for all and for no one to be treated as a lesser human being by profession, belief, caste, creed or birthright. De-politicisation of the Police is also needed—to make this institution independent of politicians.






It is also important to modify or rewrite the constitution. It must be remembered that this is a document provided by the ‘people’ to the legislators to ensure that they understand the limits of their power and remain confined within stipulated parameters. Human rights and individual freedom, liberty and security to life and property must be the basis of the constitution. In Pakistan, democracy has quickly become the tyranny of the majority and the constitution must address this matter. Proportional representation must be included based on ethnicity, profession and social order. Religion must be separated from state business. It should be an individual choice and not a communal business. Maulvis have to be put out of business of politics. They should be allowed to function only after being licensed and with strict code of conduct and stipulated regulations. For provinces, Pakistan must either consider the United States of Pakistan with total autonomy to the provinces or the provinces should be further divided to create about twenty or twenty-five provinces. Provincial separatist movements that keep threatening national cohesion can be addressed by creating more provinces. The people that have robbed this country must be held accountable. No plea bargains to be allowed. Closure must be brought to these matters as quickly as possible. The government has no business participating in the corporate sector and must divest all its businesses. The government must make policy and not run businesses. The power distribution system is a good illustration, the government cannot control theft, corruption and mismanagement. If handed over to the private sector and competition is encouraged, the matter of power distribution would easily be resolved.






The question that now comes up is how can these reforms should be done. The road to hell is paved with good intentions and so intent will never be enough. The current leadership, even by any conservative measure, falls under one of the three categories: corrupt, obligated or compromised and having secured their position by deceiving the people, are now free to pursue their individual agendas. Thus there is no hope that any political party can bring about these reforms no matter what good intentions they may have. Any attempt by the army or the judiciary or a combination of both would be perceived as interference in the political order and a disruption of this so-called democracy. The theme would be exploited by the international community to impose sanctions and embargoes so as to force Pakistan into some sort of pliant posture within the frame of international political order. Taking a political initiative to right the wrong in governance as it stands today by any leader who may be in a position to deliver and has the capacity or capability to do so is a very difficult decision. Yet it is like stating the obvious; the writing is on the wall and everyone knows what this country needs. It needs someone with a stout heart, who is determined to put the country on the right track. The reluctance by the individual leader always stems from a lack of confidence in one’s own capabilities and lack of clarity related to the end state. The individual feels he is alone and is frightened of the consequences if matters go wrong. These fears are easily addressed by not going out of the ambit of the current constitution and putting together a good team—an honest team of brave people, not pliant yes men. So to conclude, In Pakistan, the immediate need is the dissolution of the parliaments at the request of the Prime Minister while the National Security Council (NSC) takes on a supra-constitutional role. The Chief Justice and the leader of the opposition must be made part of it while the service chiefs are already members of the council. The NSC should then dispense governance, do the reforms through a presidential form of government with the current PM as the President. There can be no serious objection to this process and the country would benefit in leaps and bounds by circumventing the spoilers. Somewhere, along the line, at an appropriate time in a transparent manner, a referendum should be held to secure the people’s decision to switch to a presidential system with qualified technical expertise in the cabinet to assist the President to govern the country through selected Governors.






This article was first published in


Reporter’s Diary, and excerpts have been reproduced here with permission.

I respect this General, intelligent guy.
But this constant yearning for change is weakening Pakistan, because change is one of the main sources of instability. It is a childish demand.

You will have the same people in governance, but a person in charge with dictatorial powers, to abuse as he/she wishes.

If you introduce too much checks/balances, then imagine the deadlock with president from one party and another party has a majority in parliament, you'll get nothing done.

You also open yourself to a populous surge, imagine a TLP type surge and one of their idiots being elected president in a emotional landslide. Just imagine.

The stupidities are endless, these people do not think properly, just create emotional conclusions, nothing more.


Pakistan has a good system, look around the world, systems are always evolving, they are constantly changed. But, only slightly, little by little, that creates a strong system and continuous stability.

Keep the system we have, but, be open to change, and keep changing it little by little when the need arises, that is how we will improve, that's the only way.
 

Imran Khan

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So the army can appoint anyone they want
Stupid army people think only they are most intelligent beings in Pakistan

last this thinking broke Pakistan and nothing is learned
the parlimanry system is the one uniting us because everyone getting shear in power . we must say thank god this general was not promoted to COAS otherwise he must try his luck like mushrraf and zia .
 

waqasmwi

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View attachment 799081
NSC and a presidential system in Pakistan?

Lt Gen Tariq Khan (R)
December 05, 2021


In the years preceding 9/11, Pakistan witnessed two thousand sectarian killings. Religion has now become a part of politics. The sitting government of the time could not find it within itself to say a few words of prayer for the departed soul of their own Governor, Salman Taseer when he was killed by his own guard. Governments were forced to review foreign policy as well as administrative policies in keeping with the maulvis’ views. This has resulted in the ridiculous spectacle of a Mullah Aziz of the Burqa fame to openly challenge the writ of the government in the heart of the capital even today or the disgusting sight of Mullah Khadim Rizvi, sitting in his wheelchair, abusing everyone in the government publicly.


If national security must address these issues it must first examine the very ethos of the state and bring back those values that the Quaid had stipulated in his first speech as well as his vision of unity, faith and discipline. No political agenda should ever be allowed to change these principles and it must be mandatory for a political manifesto to define how best it can enhance, support and develop those defined principles first and foremost. No other course can ever serve this country better and if we follow this path, reforms are recommended, which need to be put in to place with the highest priority: Judicial reforms are needed to provide a homegrown judicial system compatible with international law, to ensure equality for all and for no one to be treated as a lesser human being by profession, belief, caste, creed or birthright. De-politicisation of the Police is also needed—to make this institution independent of politicians.






It is also important to modify or rewrite the constitution. It must be remembered that this is a document provided by the ‘people’ to the legislators to ensure that they understand the limits of their power and remain confined within stipulated parameters. Human rights and individual freedom, liberty and security to life and property must be the basis of the constitution. In Pakistan, democracy has quickly become the tyranny of the majority and the constitution must address this matter. Proportional representation must be included based on ethnicity, profession and social order. Religion must be separated from state business. It should be an individual choice and not a communal business. Maulvis have to be put out of business of politics. They should be allowed to function only after being licensed and with strict code of conduct and stipulated regulations. For provinces, Pakistan must either consider the United States of Pakistan with total autonomy to the provinces or the provinces should be further divided to create about twenty or twenty-five provinces. Provincial separatist movements that keep threatening national cohesion can be addressed by creating more provinces. The people that have robbed this country must be held accountable. No plea bargains to be allowed. Closure must be brought to these matters as quickly as possible. The government has no business participating in the corporate sector and must divest all its businesses. The government must make policy and not run businesses. The power distribution system is a good illustration, the government cannot control theft, corruption and mismanagement. If handed over to the private sector and competition is encouraged, the matter of power distribution would easily be resolved.






The question that now comes up is how can these reforms should be done. The road to hell is paved with good intentions and so intent will never be enough. The current leadership, even by any conservative measure, falls under one of the three categories: corrupt, obligated or compromised and having secured their position by deceiving the people, are now free to pursue their individual agendas. Thus there is no hope that any political party can bring about these reforms no matter what good intentions they may have. Any attempt by the army or the judiciary or a combination of both would be perceived as interference in the political order and a disruption of this so-called democracy. The theme would be exploited by the international community to impose sanctions and embargoes so as to force Pakistan into some sort of pliant posture within the frame of international political order. Taking a political initiative to right the wrong in governance as it stands today by any leader who may be in a position to deliver and has the capacity or capability to do so is a very difficult decision. Yet it is like stating the obvious; the writing is on the wall and everyone knows what this country needs. It needs someone with a stout heart, who is determined to put the country on the right track. The reluctance by the individual leader always stems from a lack of confidence in one’s own capabilities and lack of clarity related to the end state. The individual feels he is alone and is frightened of the consequences if matters go wrong. These fears are easily addressed by not going out of the ambit of the current constitution and putting together a good team—an honest team of brave people, not pliant yes men. So to conclude, In Pakistan, the immediate need is the dissolution of the parliaments at the request of the Prime Minister while the National Security Council (NSC) takes on a supra-constitutional role. The Chief Justice and the leader of the opposition must be made part of it while the service chiefs are already members of the council. The NSC should then dispense governance, do the reforms through a presidential form of government with the current PM as the President. There can be no serious objection to this process and the country would benefit in leaps and bounds by circumventing the spoilers. Somewhere, along the line, at an appropriate time in a transparent manner, a referendum should be held to secure the people’s decision to switch to a presidential system with qualified technical expertise in the cabinet to assist the President to govern the country through selected Governors.






This article was first published in


Reporter’s Diary, and excerpts have been reproduced here with permission.
O Mr. General! Shut the F**k up
 

Imran Khan

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You don't even know what is presidential system. Presidential system main parliament Senate provincial assemblies elected provincial governors local government sab kuch hota ha. Only difference between provincial and parliamentary system is head of state in presidential system is elected and in parliamentary system head of state is unelected or indirectly elected.
Parliamentary system was created for monarchies like UK they have this type of system because they have king or Queen as head of state they don't need an elected head of state
I THINK WE HAVE SEEN PRESIDENTIONAL SYSTEM DEMO IN AYOUB-YAHYA ZIA MUSHRRAF ERA . and its was painful
O Mr. General! Shut the F**k up
even man in uniform thinks himself Aristotle here
 

bananarepublic

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O Mr. General! Shut the F**k up
Generals come and talk about how to run a country
Physics professors come and talk about running the country
Mullahs come and tell us how to run a country
Judges come and tell us how to run a country.
And we talk all of them serious, each with their own fiefdoms and mobs blindly following them.
See the pattern?
 

untitled

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What's the point of any new political system when anyone with sufficient street power can hold the entire country hostage?
 

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