• Thursday, October 17, 2019

THOUGH SLOW, PAKISTAN’S ARMOUR AND ARTILLERY MODERNIZATION IS MOVING

Discussion in 'Pakistan Army' started by Signalian, Oct 6, 2019.

  1. Signalian

    Signalian PDF THINK TANK: ANALYST

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    In its disclosure of production and procurement activities for 2017-2018, the Pakistan Ministry of Defence Production (MoDP) outlined that the Pakistan Army’s projects, while slow moving, were progressing. But it appears that the priority at this stage is overhauling older tanks and procuring surplus/used howitzers.

    Main Battle Tanks

    Al-Khalid

    According to the MoDP, Heavy Industries Taxila (HIT) manufactured 20 al-Khalid-I main battle tanks (MBT) for the Army, a slight increase over the 16 it rolled-out in 2016-2017.[1]

    The main difference between the al-Khalid-I (short for Improved) and the preceding version is that the al-Khalid-I has a new digital fire control system.[2] In addition, it is also equipped with a laser warning system for detecting incoming anti-tank guided missiles (ATGM)[3] as well as head mirror stabilized gunner-sight.

    According to IHS Jane’s in 2016, the Pakistan Army operated about 400 al-Khalid MBTs.[4] With these two batches, it should have at least 436, potentially more since the latest MoDP report only covers activities for 2017-2018. In other words, the information is 12-18 months behind, so the Army may have more.

    During the 2016 International Defence Exhibition and Seminar (IDEAS), HIT signed for 200 6TD-2 1,200 hp diesel engines, which indicates that the Army intends to procure up to 200 al-Khalid-Is. However, the new disclosures also show that HIT is still producing well below its capacity of 50-60 al-Khalid MBTs per year.

    Al-Khalid 2

    In terms of the al-Khalid 2 — the next-generation variant of the al-Khalid — the MoDP report states that it is in the “final stages” of development. HIT will work on prototype with a “powerful power pack and latest/ modern fire control system / gun control system … in near future.”

    The al-Khalid 2 is expected to feature a 1,500 hp diesel engine, new electronics, and possibly, new armour technology. On the latter front, the Turkish OEM Roketsan is offering Pakistan the composite and ballistic armour it developed for the Altay MBT.[5] HIT could receive offers from China and Ukraine as well.

    Likewise, Aselsan is offering its support on electronics. However, it appears that HIT’s Advanced Research, Development & Information Centre (ARDIC) is responsible for the al-Khalid 2’s electronics, at least in terms of integration and testing, if not development. The Army did not disclose how it intends to configure the al-Khalid 2 in terms of electronics and countermeasure systems.

    T-80UD

    HIT disclosed that it successfully repaired 45 T-80UD MBTs. Furthermore, it will also overhaul five T-80UDs as part of a pilot project, potentially as part of a joint-project with UkrOboronProm. HIT stated that upon the successful completion of the pilot, it will overhaul the Army’s remaining 315 T-80UDs…

    End of Excerpt (439/1,546 words)

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    [1] Year Book (sic) 2017-2018. Ministry of Defence Production. Government of Pakistan. 05 September 2019. URL: http://www.modp.gov.pk/frmDetails.aspx

    [2] “Al Khalid I makes public debut at IDEAS.” Asian Military Review. 29 November 2018

    [3] Ibid.

    [4] Farhan Bokhari. “Defending the Borders.” Pakistan Briefing. IHS Jane’s Defence Weekly. 2 November 2016.

    [5] “A Roketsan Product for Every Need.” MSI Turkish Defence Review. January 2017.

    https://quwa.org/2019/09/28/though-slow-pakistans-armour-and-artillery-modernization-is-moving-2/
     
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  2. Syed Hammad Ahmed

    Syed Hammad Ahmed FULL MEMBER

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    Is Al Khaild getting any night version which DRDO has made for IA's T 90s?
     
  3. sparten

    sparten SENIOR MEMBER

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    It’s always has NVD.
     
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  4. Rajput_Pakistani

    Rajput_Pakistani FULL MEMBER

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    Hi @Signalian

    How would PA tank fleet fares against IA Armoured corps?
    Essentially I would like to have your insight on T90, T72 of IA. How many regiments of IA are committed against Chinese? What is the status of modernization on their very large but old fleet of T72?
     
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  5. Mrc

    Mrc ELITE MEMBER

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    100s of videos that came out of syria show again and again that t 72 is not a good tank even against moderately armed militias. ..

    T 90 is the real deal


    Expect t 72 to fairly poorly against pak tank hunters and other tanks
     
  6. CHI RULES

    CHI RULES FULL MEMBER

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    The Indian MBTs as reported have below par night vision tech so DRDO is given task to provide better night vision for MBTs. PA is quite satisfied with existing night vision capabilities on MBTs.

    Sir with relatively lighter armor and reportedly so far no APS can Pak T80UD, AK and Az withstand Indian MBTS?
     
  7. Signalian

    Signalian PDF THINK TANK: ANALYST

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    I might have replied this before also. IA has 67 Armored Regiments, PA has 46 Armored Regiments.
    For both Armies to have any success in the domain of armored warfare, its necessary to have excellent Logistics supply line of spares, ammunition and fuel. After that, are the reserves (Replacements for Destroyed MBT). Then is the mechanism of deployment, how are the armored forces deployed in all kinds of terrain.

    PA's AZ, AK, T-80 UD and T-85 are capable to take on any IA MBT, be it T-90 or Arjun I/II or T-72. The T-59's used by PA deployed in Infantry Divisions and even though they will give direct firepower to infantry during an offensive, they will depend upon Infantry to protect them. T-59's are being phased out in any case. India gets advantage in the desert due to massive size of its Armored/Mechanized forces. Both armies will be fielding MBTs where their breakthroughs can be exploited- weakly defended positions.

    MBTs operating alone are cannot bring success. In mechanized forces, IA has around 48 mechanized battalions, PA has far lesser. BMP-2 has better firepower than M-113/Talha series. PA holds an advantage in SP Artillery, while IA is catching up with Korean K-9 but has lesser numbers. In AD, both forces are on par with each other, PA should go for Pantsir if its available.

    T-90 has tremendous fire power. It has seen combat in Syria, urban and open environments. IA regularly conducts exercises with T-90 in the desert regions. Its armor and protection systems are adequate for its generation- there is ERA, layered armor and news of active protection like SHTORA on it. The biggest advantage is its weight, its lighter than Modern western MBTs. Armored combat is about reach - the distance that can be covered in minimal time. MBT is not expected to stand like a fixed bunker and fight, MBT is expected to cover distance and make contact with the enemy. Issue with IA T-90s is that they are deployed sparsely in the country, few armored formations are near the border, rest reside well inside. Transporting T-90 shouldn't be an issue though- be it rail or road. There is always news of T-72 being upgraded in protection systems and night vision. If T-90 and T-72 engines don't give up, don't require extensive maintenance during an offensive and the Field workshops can provide timely repairs, then expect them to be threat on the battlefield. I mentioned that since we have been seeing posts of T-90 issues, most of which have been rectified and also issues from time to time, like the exploding barrel case in recent past. Rest assured, PA's ATGM teams will be hunting IA's T-90 and T-72 MBTs. ATGM is the most capable weapon against MBTs.

    There are 3 in Ladakh, expect another 6 -10 in case of war with China.

    This is @Dazzler department. He is up to date on such information.
     
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  8. Bilal Khan (Quwa)

    Bilal Khan (Quwa) SENIOR MEMBER

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    This is why the PA is now looking for a new MIFV. HIT is proposing the Viper (developed from the M113/Talha), but there are other contenders, namely from China, Turkey and Ukraine. The latter has a clean-sheet project through the BMP-U, which is interesting. Besides that, the PA stocked up on second-hand M109Ls from Italy, and -- conveniently perhaps -- Leonardo created an upgrade program that can turn those into 155/52-cal SPHs. There is also the wheeled SPH program which, though hitting a snag with apparently so-so trials, can factor in again.

    Obviously, we have fiscal constraints. That said, I do think there's a way to gradually build out, the key is for the PA to avoid ad hoc procurement and formulate a plan for platforms that can work for the next 40-50 years. And gradually modernize from there.
     
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  9. GIANTsasquatch

    GIANTsasquatch BANNED

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    Ajeya variants are better than T72M1 export trash sent to the mid east
     
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  10. JPMM

    JPMM FULL MEMBER

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    Brother, plus the rebuilding of the T85IIAP and the "restart" of the Al-Zarrar program.
    It probably means no new "Al-Haider" tank. They will upgrade those T59MII to Al-Zarrar with the Infantry Divisions at North and T85IIAP with those at South.
     
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  11. Syed Hammad Ahmed

    Syed Hammad Ahmed FULL MEMBER

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    What? I was told before Al Zarrars are going to get retired soon
     
  12. WarKa DaNG

    WarKa DaNG FULL MEMBER

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    Does AK have APS?
     
  13. Dazzler

    Dazzler PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT

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    Sir ji, their t-72 upgrade is slower than our Arty upgrades..

    upload_2019-10-6_16-45-12.png
     
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  14. Mrc

    Mrc ELITE MEMBER

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    I dont think t 72 has a chance against any of the ones u mentioned even upgraded t 72...

    T 90 is a different ball game .. I expect alkhalid to fare favorably against it . Not the rest
     
  15. TheNoob

    TheNoob SENIOR MEMBER

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    Syrian T72's are of the old soviet export quality....
     
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