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The First Indian attempt at ASAT failed in February 2019

amardeep mishra

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The SM-3 Block 2A has a diameter of 0.5m, and can easily manage altitudes of 600Km, likely more than Arrow-3. This should be our goal for mid-course defence against MRBMs.
Exactly this is what I was alluding to. Having a capability is one thing and mass producing it on a scale where it can be confidently deployed is quite another. What we have right now is capability. However I still feel they'd have to reduce the diameter of the system to at least 1m to reduce footprint and logistics. 1.4m is simply way too much
 

randomradio

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Exactly this is what I was alluding to. Having a capability is one thing and mass producing it on a scale where it can be confidently deployed is quite another. What we have right now is capability. However I still feel they'd have to reduce the diameter of the system to at least 1m to reduce footprint and logistics. 1.4m is simply way too much
Deployment happens on stuff that has been tested though.

1.4m is fine. The K-4 is a shorter missile than the Agni I to boot. Also, this is not supposed to be a highly mobile system anyway. So you can even put them in silos if you want to keep things cheap.

Not to mention we do not know how well it compares to a missile as small as the Arrow 3. For all you know, Arrow 3 is good only up to 300 or 400Km or even 600Km, while our ASAT may even cross 1000Km. The Israelis face very different threats compared to India. So 1m may not give us the capability we need, say, against a 5000Km missile.

As a long term perspective, you can't discount the ASAT will end up carrying multiple kill vehicles too, which is the end goal of missile based BMD. So that extra space will be very useful.
 

The Deterrent

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The optimism here doesn't fail at all. It was just a bureaucratic holdup. Once it's cleared, things will go back on course. This is well within the expectations of what we can get from the real world.

As for Pakistan's missiles, manoeuvring during the mid-course is a long ways away still. Even advanced nations are still working on a sufficiently advanced post-boost capability. And by the time it's developed, we could be talking about laser BMD against boost phase.

I mean, think about it, just a few months ago, we were talking about only terminal BMD. But with the ASAT test, we are now talking about mid-course interception already. So how soon will it be by the time we start talking about laser BMD.
All the best.

"Even advanced nations are still working on sufficiently advanced post-boost capability"...I guess I should personally spank the head of Lawrence Livermore for doing such a shoddy job back in the 80s...if he's alive. Of course only Modi Jee will deliver on this one as well.

You're already talking about it...the day is saved.
 

randomradio

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All the best.

"Even advanced nations are still working on sufficiently advanced post-boost capability"...I guess I should personally spank the head of Lawrence Livermore for doing such a shoddy job back in the 80s...if he's alive. Of course only Modi Jee will deliver on this one as well.

You're already talking about it...the day is saved.
What you are talking about is old generation post boost vehicles which carries around all warheads on a single MIRV bus. This is not enough to fool a modern ASAT. Even satellites can switch orbits and the DACS can easily make all the manoeuvres necessary to compensate, so you can expect our ASAT also to be prepared to handle such manoeuvres.

Point being, your warhead and decoys will not be performing complex enough post boost manoeuvres if you are only bringing in the tech from the Minuteman or Trident.

More importantly, your missiles are yet to show off post boost manoeuvres. Maybe we can expect one on Ababeel, but I won't be surprised if it's only at Minuteman level.

What I'm talking about and is more interesting is the independent post boost vehicle, which other countries are still working on.

Of course, considering the distance between India and Pakistan, it would be more interesting to see the ASAT killing the missile before the post boost vehicle is deployed.

Just a heads up, if you are referring to countermeasures invented in the 70s and 80s, you can be sure our scientists have already catered for such measures. This much should be obvious.
 

The Deterrent

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What you are talking about is old generation post boost vehicles which carries around all warheads on a single MIRV bus. This is not enough to fool a modern ASAT. Even satellites can switch orbits and the DACS can easily make all the manoeuvres necessary to compensate, so you can expect our ASAT also to be prepared to handle such manoeuvres.

Point being, your warhead and decoys will not be performing complex enough post boost manoeuvres if you are only bringing in the tech from the Minuteman or Trident.

More importantly, your missiles are yet to show off post boost manoeuvres. Maybe we can expect one on Ababeel, but I won't be surprised if it's only at Minuteman level.

What I'm talking about and is more interesting is the independent post boost vehicle, which other countries are still working on.

Of course, considering the distance between India and Pakistan, it would be more interesting to see the ASAT killing the missile before the post boost vehicle is deployed.

Just a heads up, if you are referring to countermeasures invented in the 70s and 80s, you can be sure our scientists have already catered for such measures. This much should be obvious.
Your problem is that not only you're optimistic in your hopes, you're optimistic regarding facts as well...picking and choosing whatever suits your narrative. Even the Agni-III, IV & V are capable of exo-atmospheric maneuvering to a limited extent. Its just sad that you don't even know about your own nation's capabilities.

You don't seem to have a grasp on when exactly a PBV is deployed, how long is it supposed to stick with the warhead(s), can PBVs be made an integral part of the RVs (like Agni-IV/V), how many different types of counter-measures a PBV can deploy...

Please, it is becoming embarrassing for ME. Kindly do not quote me again, I beg you. Instead just go through this thread: https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/the-...missiles-obsolete.540429/page-5#post-10195930
 

randomradio

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Your problem is that not only you're optimistic in your hopes, you're optimistic regarding facts as well...picking and choosing whatever suits your narrative. Even the Agni-III, IV & V are capable of exo-atmospheric maneuvering to a limited extent. Its just sad that you don't even know about your own nation's capabilities.
I never said our missiles cannot perform post boost manoeuvres. Such a weird thing for you to bring up. I said, you guys are yet to show it.

You don't seem to have a grasp on when exactly a PBV is deployed, how long is it supposed to stick with the warhead(s), can PBVs be made an integral part of the RVs (like Agni-IV/V), how many different types of counter-measures a PBV can deploy...
A topic I never touched on.

Anyway:
http://delhidefencereview.com/2019/...-about-the-pdv-mk-ii-indias-satellite-killer/
 

God Parshuram

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SOURCE: The Tribune Weeks before India announced that it successfully carried out an anti-satellite (ASAT) test on March 27, claims have emerged from a US expert that a similar test had failed on February 12. Official sources in the Defence Research and Development Organisation (DRDO) which carried out the ASAT test refuted this claim, saying, “There was no ASAT test on February 12.” A senior fellow at the Federation of American Scientists, Ankit Panda, has quoted US government sources and written in the ‘The Diplomat’ that a missile was tested on February 12 and it failed after flying for 30 seconds.




India knocked out an indigenous satellite on March 27. Panda argued that on February 12, the date of the first test, Indian authorities had notified a notice to airman (NOTAM) — which informed about an exclusion zone for flights over the Bay of Bengal — in effect telling the world that India planned to conduct missile tests in the designated area. This zone was exactly the same as that announced ahead of March 27 when India did bring down a test satellite.

Sources said drawing conclusions on the basis of a NOTAM was odd. i

idrw.org .Read more at India No 1 Defence News Website http://idrw.org/page/2/ .
 

God Parshuram

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I had argued this in ASAT failure article. It is very much possible that ASAT test may fail but it is highly unlikely that a successful test may follow in one and half month. No country can do that. It may take a lots of analysis and and revisiting so many things to find out the reason. It will be followed by corrective measure in hardware and software.
 

kris

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I had argued this in ASAT failure article. It is very much possible that ASAT test may fail but it is highly unlikely that a successful test may follow in one and half month. No country can do that. It may take a lots of analysis and and revisiting so many things to find out the reason. It will be followed by corrective measure in hardware and software.
Good observation
 
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SO fools think such a test even if a failure wont get detected? There was not a word from any corner of the world after our so called failed asat test but every self proclaimed expert is getting oral diarrhoea
 

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