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South Korea unveils design for future military transport aircraft

Indos

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Jul 25, 2013
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I believe this new Korean plane is of different class and category and will not become a rival or redundant to our own plans... The Koreans are planning a jet powered military transport plane of at least similar size and capability to Hercules.. while our future plans are for medium to large sized civilian commuter turboprop planes (rivals to ATR etc)... I see no overlap there...

Joining the Koreans in this project (if possible) will give us practical experience in designing a larger (Hercules sized) plane with jet engines and also provide a "localized" alternative to Hercules for AU...
We have both financial and human resources constrain, we even need to build production facility for IFX which is not cheap and this time will likely use similar production facility for IF 21 like happening in KAI.

For human resource constrain I have already shown you Indonesian program that are already quite many, and this is I bring more statement over this human resource constrain from KFX/IFX configuration design leader


---------------------------------------------------------------------

This is about first development phase

Translation from Google translate:

February 6, 2014 (Angkasa/Space Magazine)

KFX / IFX program continued , Government Asked to Immediately Selecting Design

Korea was once considered Indonesia engineer do not understand about the design of a jet fighter. But the notion was quickly turned , when the Indonesian team describes the design and the various inputs. The Indonesian side also the one who finally managed to convince that the aircraft take-off weight of 50,000 pounds must .

Confirmation of the Parliament of South Korea on the resumption of the program KFX / IFX team warmly welcomed designers from Indonesia. They include asking both governments immediately call the engineers involved in preparing work that has been long overdue. They also want the governments of both countries to make sure one of the two designs that have been produced in the Technology Development phase for cultivation in the next phase .

"Program KFX / IFX is a multi - program years , costly, and involve various sectors and foreign partners. For that there must be a definite declaration on it goes. For Indonesia it is important to determine the financing schemes and their human resources planning, "said Dr Rais Zain, M. Eng , KFX / IFX Configuration Design Leader for Angkasa , in late January.

"In the near future Indonesia will also work on the N219 and R - 80. We do not have enough engineers to work three programs, especially KFX / IFX will take place until the 2020s.

The government is expected to call home engineers who are now working abroad to come help the regeneration process. Outside there are approximately 200 people . If half of it can be returned to the country, it is enough to help, " added Rais who is also a lecturer at the Faculty of Aerospace Engineering ITB, Bandung.


As reported by the national media, the confirmation of the continuation of the program of making front - liner Korean - Indonesian fighter jets received by the Ministry of Defense on January 3, 2014. Notice is further announced Defense Minister Purnomo Yusgiantoro told reporters, Wednesday, January 8, 2014, on the sidelines of Rapim Kemenhan in Jakarta. Explanations related to exposure delivered weapon system procurement plans in the Strategic Plan II, 2015-2019.

The Indonesian government hopes the project of making the 4.5 generation fighter jet could be done because it would be a referral program to remove the dependence of the transfer of technology from other countries. Besides KFX / IFX, Indonesia is also pursuing a program of making submarines , warships, propellants , rockets, and tank size medium. For submarines, Indonesia is also cooperating with the same country.

Superior to the Su - 35Program KFX / IFX was stopped temporarily by Korea's new leader Park Geun - Hye end of 2012 after reviewing the state financially in the country. This prestigious project was worked on since the beginning of 2011, shortly after President Lee Myung - bak and President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono confirmed the bilateral cooperation in the defense field in Jakarta. From the Technology Development Phase that has been completed, a team of scientists has completed a number of conical design that later became two.

The two designs is a model of the stealth fighter jet -winning twin-engine air superiority with horizontally - tails in the back, and the other one is with canards on the front. "Each has consequences different financing and partners. Thus , it must first be decided which one is selected. It is important that when followed, all parties are ready to do it , "said Rais Zain , whose day-to- day lecturer at the Faculty of Engineering, Aerospace Engineering,ITB, Bandung.

As stated Wamenhan Sjafrie, Korean parliament has prepared 20 million U.S. dollars (temporary , Indonesia : $ 5 million) to continue this program in 2015. At that time , the team will go to the Engineering Manufacturing Development Phase. In addition must have a high thrust engine with a power to be able to fight in the air, the aircraft must also have weapons stored in the internal weapons bay , the data - link capable of randomizing communications, advanced radar target voters, and anti - jamming device.

The prototype is expected to finish by the end of the Strategic Plan II . Even if there are things that need to be criticized , it is a matter of operation requirements are much more determined the Korean Air Force . This was inevitable because the Korean bear 80 percent of the funding, and the country actually have a real enemy. This program is targeted to spawn a jet fighter with performance equivalent or superior to the opponent fighter jets which are the Sukhoi Su - 35.

Prerequisites itself dismissed the proposed counter designs KAI ( Korean Aerospace Industrie) recently, rather than to cut development costs are too great. In configuration ( see Space, December 2013 ), looks KFX type E is only one engine powered with weapons outside the radar sweep prone opponent.

Angkasa examine admiration of ADD ( Agency for Defense Development, Defence Research and Development Agency of Korea ) submitted to the Indonesian engineer team. Initially, the team assumes Korea really had no idea about the design of Indonesian fighter jets. However, the assumption was turned when Indonesian engineers began to describe the design and the various inputs to the design of Korea. The Indonesian side also who ultimately ensure that the aircraft must have a takeoff weight of 50,000 pounds.(A.Darmawan/Angkasa magazine).

http://www.angkasa.co.id/index.php/...tkan-pemerintah-diminta-segera-memilih-desain

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is the most respected aerospace media in Indonesia but unfortunatelly they have erased that 2014 page but I have posted the translation in previous KFX/IFX thread in 2014.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/kf-x...of-south-korea-indonesia-images.182361/page-4
 

Whizzack

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We have both financial and human resources constrain, we even need to build production facility for IFX which is not cheap and this time will likely use similar production facility for IF 21 like happening in KAI.

For human resource constrain I have already shown you Indonesian program that are already quite many, and this is I bring more statement over this human resource constrain from KFX/IFX configuration design leader


---------------------------------------------------------------------

This is about first development phase

Translation from Google translate:

February 6, 2014 (Angkasa/Space Magazine)

KFX / IFX program continued , Government Asked to Immediately Selecting Design

Korea was once considered Indonesia engineer do not understand about the design of a jet fighter. But the notion was quickly turned , when the Indonesian team describes the design and the various inputs. The Indonesian side also the one who finally managed to convince that the aircraft take-off weight of 50,000 pounds must .

Confirmation of the Parliament of South Korea on the resumption of the program KFX / IFX team warmly welcomed designers from Indonesia. They include asking both governments immediately call the engineers involved in preparing work that has been long overdue. They also want the governments of both countries to make sure one of the two designs that have been produced in the Technology Development phase for cultivation in the next phase .

"Program KFX / IFX is a multi - program years , costly, and involve various sectors and foreign partners. For that there must be a definite declaration on it goes. For Indonesia it is important to determine the financing schemes and their human resources planning, "said Dr Rais Zain, M. Eng , KFX / IFX Configuration Design Leader for Angkasa , in late January.

"In the near future Indonesia will also work on the N219 and R - 80. We do not have enough engineers to work three programs, especially KFX / IFX will take place until the 2020s.

The government is expected to call home engineers who are now working abroad to come help the regeneration process. Outside there are approximately 200 people . If half of it can be returned to the country, it is enough to help, " added Rais who is also a lecturer at the Faculty of Aerospace Engineering ITB, Bandung.


As reported by the national media, the confirmation of the continuation of the program of making front - liner Korean - Indonesian fighter jets received by the Ministry of Defense on January 3, 2014. Notice is further announced Defense Minister Purnomo Yusgiantoro told reporters, Wednesday, January 8, 2014, on the sidelines of Rapim Kemenhan in Jakarta. Explanations related to exposure delivered weapon system procurement plans in the Strategic Plan II, 2015-2019.

The Indonesian government hopes the project of making the 4.5 generation fighter jet could be done because it would be a referral program to remove the dependence of the transfer of technology from other countries. Besides KFX / IFX, Indonesia is also pursuing a program of making submarines , warships, propellants , rockets, and tank size medium. For submarines, Indonesia is also cooperating with the same country.

Superior to the Su - 35Program KFX / IFX was stopped temporarily by Korea's new leader Park Geun - Hye end of 2012 after reviewing the state financially in the country. This prestigious project was worked on since the beginning of 2011, shortly after President Lee Myung - bak and President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono confirmed the bilateral cooperation in the defense field in Jakarta. From the Technology Development Phase that has been completed, a team of scientists has completed a number of conical design that later became two.

The two designs is a model of the stealth fighter jet -winning twin-engine air superiority with horizontally - tails in the back, and the other one is with canards on the front. "Each has consequences different financing and partners. Thus , it must first be decided which one is selected. It is important that when followed, all parties are ready to do it , "said Rais Zain , whose day-to- day lecturer at the Faculty of Engineering, Aerospace Engineering,ITB, Bandung.

As stated Wamenhan Sjafrie, Korean parliament has prepared 20 million U.S. dollars (temporary , Indonesia : $ 5 million) to continue this program in 2015. At that time , the team will go to the Engineering Manufacturing Development Phase. In addition must have a high thrust engine with a power to be able to fight in the air, the aircraft must also have weapons stored in the internal weapons bay , the data - link capable of randomizing communications, advanced radar target voters, and anti - jamming device.

The prototype is expected to finish by the end of the Strategic Plan II . Even if there are things that need to be criticized , it is a matter of operation requirements are much more determined the Korean Air Force . This was inevitable because the Korean bear 80 percent of the funding, and the country actually have a real enemy. This program is targeted to spawn a jet fighter with performance equivalent or superior to the opponent fighter jets which are the Sukhoi Su - 35.

Prerequisites itself dismissed the proposed counter designs KAI ( Korean Aerospace Industrie) recently, rather than to cut development costs are too great. In configuration ( see Space, December 2013 ), looks KFX type E is only one engine powered with weapons outside the radar sweep prone opponent.

Angkasa examine admiration of ADD ( Agency for Defense Development, Defence Research and Development Agency of Korea ) submitted to the Indonesian engineer team. Initially, the team assumes Korea really had no idea about the design of Indonesian fighter jets. However, the assumption was turned when Indonesian engineers began to describe the design and the various inputs to the design of Korea. The Indonesian side also who ultimately ensure that the aircraft must have a takeoff weight of 50,000 pounds.(A.Darmawan/Angkasa magazine).

http://www.angkasa.co.id/index.php/...tkan-pemerintah-diminta-segera-memilih-desain

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This is the most respected aerospace media in Indonesia but unfortunatelly they have erased that 2014 page but I have posted the translation in previous KFX/IFX thread in 2014.

https://defence.pk/pdf/threads/kf-x...of-south-korea-indonesia-images.182361/page-4
Well.. It was only my opinion, doesn't mean we will or should get involved... or even whether the Koreans wants to... but my thinking was based on the below points :

Pros :
1. We already have an existing partnership with Korea through the KFX program.
2. We have practical expertise and experience in designing and building high wing transport planes (unlike in KFX project which we have very little) and so can contribute more.
3. This planned military transport plane is of different class to our existing products (NC212 & CN235) or even to our future products (N245 & R80) and so there will be no risk of competition... and it will actually complement our products portfolio.
4. We get new experience in designing a bigger jet powered transport plane, this experience might be beneficial to improve our own products such as the R80... it's unlikely we will ever decide to build one on our own.
5. Assured customers... ROKAF and TNI AU... We definitely need to replace our legacy Hercules series in the coming years...

Cons :
1. Due to existing ongoing and planned projects, we might lack the financial and manpower resources to take on another high tech / high profile project.
2. Korea might not want to partner with us anymore due to past issues in our partnership in KFX.. seeing us as a "risky" partner.
3. Even if Korea is willing, they might only want us a Junior partner (as in KFX) instead of an equal partner (as in CN235 development).
4. Our own "procurement mafia" and other "western interest parties" will fight tooth and nail to prevent this from happening, and will spread smear / disinformation campaign as they are doing now against our collaboration in KFX and CBG projects..
 

Indos

PDF THINK TANK: ANALYST
Jul 25, 2013
12,950
22
16,958
Country
Indonesia
Location
Indonesia
Well.. It was only my opinion, doesn't mean we will or should get involved... or even whether the Koreans wants to... but my thinking was based on the below points :

Pros :
1. We already have an existing partnership with Korea through the KFX program.
2. We have practical expertise and experience in designing and building high wing transport planes (unlike in KFX project which we have very little) and so can contribute more.
3. This planned military transport plane is of different class to our existing products (NC212 & CN235) or even to our future products (N245 & R80) and so there will be no risk of competition... and it will actually complement our products portfolio.
4. We get new experience in designing a bigger jet powered transport plane, this experience might be beneficial to improve our own products such as the R80... it's unlikely we will ever decide to build one on our own.
5. Assured customers... ROKAF and TNI AU... We definitely need to replace our legacy Hercules series in the coming years...

Cons :
1. Due to existing ongoing and planned projects, we might lack the financial and manpower resources to take on another high tech / high profile project.
2. Korea might not want to partner with us anymore due to past issues in our partnership in KFX.. seeing us as a "risky" partner.
3. Even if Korea is willing, they might only want us a Junior partner (as in KFX) instead of an equal partner (as in CN235 development).
4. Our own "procurement mafia" and other "western interest parties" will fight tooth and nail to prevent this from happening, and will spread smear / disinformation campaign as they are doing now against our collaboration in KFX and CBG projects..
After N 245 and R80 program are completed inshaAllah, the next likelihood project is jumbo turboprop plane for civilian market, this program has been around Indonesia Aerospace planner since about 2-3 years ago.

Unlike R 80 program that will serve medium journey and compete with ATR 72, this plane is projected to compete with jet plane like Boeing 747. We are seeking passengers that would trade 2-3 days more journey for long route like Indonesia to USA with much lower tickets price.

This jumbo turboprop plane if it is really realized has future to be developed into military transport plane with ramp door so we can finance 1 project with opportunity to target two market, civiliant and military.
 

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