• Thursday, April 25, 2019

Should Pakistan convert Mi-17 to optional attack role?

Discussion in 'Pakistan Army' started by Philip the Arab, Apr 16, 2019.

  1. Philip the Arab

    Philip the Arab FULL MEMBER

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    This thread is exactly what the title is, should Pakistan convert their Mi-17 to optional attack role from the South African company Paramount Group? This upgrade will significantly increase anti-tank capabilities through the addition of 8 ZT3 Ingwes which has about 1000mm of penetration after ERA and would prove deadly to Indian tanks be it T-72, or T-90s, or Arjuns. 8 Mokopas which can also take on any Indian tank around. A 23mm gun pod can also be integrated onto the helicopter which makes it even deadlier than it already is. New composite rotor blades, as well as a new cockpit, sighting system, and helmet system would further modernize the system and really make it equivalent to the American OH-58 Kiowa in terms of the role it plays. This could complement the Fennec with a helicopter already in service with Pakistan.


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    More info about Mi-17 upgrade here www.paramountgroup.co.za/media/1149/paramount-mi17-2015.pdf



    Also, instead of Pakistan purchasing new Mi-35s from Russia, why don't they just buy other countries Mi-24s and get them again upgraded by a South African company? Again, new avionics, 20mm gun, Mokopa. This is arguably the best variant of the Mi-24 out there and puts this beast on a whole new level.



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    More info here www.paramountgroup.com/media/1320/paramount-night-hawk.pdf
     

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  2. Starlord

    Starlord ELITE MEMBER

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    I think there is no need , we just need to order more Mil-35's they will work with similar capabilities .
     
  3. Irfan Baloch

    Irfan Baloch SENIOR MODERATOR

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    NO
    get more Hinds instead for the intended role
    keep Mi 17s for the role they are needed and they are needed a lot for that role.
     
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  4. Philip the Arab

    Philip the Arab FULL MEMBER

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    Old Mi-24s can be ordered and converted. Again the South African Mi-24 is probably the best Mi-24 variant in service today with advanced South African ATGMs. Much cheaper than buying new Hinds from Russia which is 3 Mi-35s for 100 million.
    @Starlord
     
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  5. nahtanbob

    nahtanbob SENIOR MEMBER

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    China has attack helicopters that are cheaper
     
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  6. Philip the Arab

    Philip the Arab FULL MEMBER

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    An upgrade is way less expensive than a new built helicopter.
     
  7. nahtanbob

    nahtanbob SENIOR MEMBER

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    it depends upon the situation
     
  8. Philip the Arab

    Philip the Arab FULL MEMBER

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    As I Said before, an upgraded Mi-24 gets many new things that makes it lighter, better protected, better armed, and with glass cockpits and has to be on par with the most modern Mi-35 variants. It would be much cheaper to buy older Mi-24s than buying new built helicopters considering they are 3 for 100 million for Pakistan's army.
     
  9. nahtanbob

    nahtanbob SENIOR MEMBER

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    Russian airframes and engines are not known for durability
     
  10. Sulman Badshah

    Sulman Badshah STAFF

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    I think we will have sufficient attack helicopter fleet in future .. Current 48 AH-1F will entirely be replaced

    Future / Current attack helicopter platform
    > 48 Ah-1F (current, will be replaced in future)
    > 4 Mi-35 (current) and more 5 reportedly ordered , speculations are that order maybe increased to 20 total
    > 30 T-129 Helicopters reportedly on order (Deliveries awaiting)
    > 15 AH-1Z Viper (9 air frames are already built but currently sanctioned, Talks of their retreivel from US are underway)
    > 10 Fennec (Light attack and scout helicopters are in service as well
     
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  11. nahtanbob

    nahtanbob SENIOR MEMBER

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    what about chinese attack choppers ??
     
  12. Syed Hammad Ahmed

    Syed Hammad Ahmed FULL MEMBER

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    Is IAF Mi17 V5 attack Helicopter?
     
  13. Sulman Badshah

    Sulman Badshah STAFF

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    3 were evaluated and than sent back (later we heard Turkish T129 got ordered)
     
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  14. Philip the Arab

    Philip the Arab FULL MEMBER

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    Kind of, it is better armed that Pakistani ones though.
    The helicopter is armed with Shturm-V missiles, S-8 rockets, a 23mm machine gun, PKT machine guns and AKM sub-machine guns. It features eight firing posts for aiming the weapons. Personally Pakistan should do the same as optional attack helicopters which wouldn't hurt. The Shturm has 500-600 mm of penetration while South African ATGMs have 1000+ after ERA.

    Tell me which helicopter is better armed?

    Indian Mi-17 V-5 armed with rockets.
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    South African Super Mi-17 armed with 8 Mokopas or Ingwes which can easily each take on any Indian tank. Also notice how the Indian one doesn't have a FLIR system.

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    Mokopa
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    South Africa
    Entered service 2005
    Armor penetration 1 350 mm RHAe after ERA
    Range 10 km
    Weight 49.8 kg
    Missile length 2 m
    Missile diameter 0.18 m
    Fin span ?
    Warhead HEAT, HE-FRAG, or Thermobaric
    Warhead weight ?
    Guidance Semi-active laser, infrared homing, or active radar


    Ingwe ATGM
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    Entered service 1987
    Armor penetration up to 1 000 mm
    Range 250 - 5 000 m
    Weight 28.5 kg
    Missile length 1 750 mm
    Missile diameter 127 mm
    Warhead Tandem HEAT
    Warhead weight ?
    Guidance system Semi-active laser
     
    Last edited: Apr 16, 2019
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  15. TOPGUN

    TOPGUN PDF THINK TANK: ANALYST

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    PA has no need to do so, although not a bad idea but again PA has no need for it those birds are for transport only with light machine gun.