• Saturday, October 20, 2018

Saudi Arabian women join their male counterparts on stadiums after stadium ban removal

Discussion in 'Middle East & Africa' started by Saif al-Arab, Jan 13, 2018.

  1. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

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    Another moronic law with origins in the "Sahwa era" and in the post Grand Mosque Seizure/Iranian "Islamic" Revolution (both in 1979) era. In the dustbin for good. A few of such moronic laws remain in place but their lifespan is very short-lived by all accounts.



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    Our gifted head of the Saudi Arabian Sports Federation Princess Reema (daughter of the "famous" Prince Bandar):

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    Most trending Twitter hashtag currently worldwide as well.
     
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  2. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

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  3. lastofthepatriots

    lastofthepatriots BANNED

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    Good. Saudis need to lead the way. But don't think the rest of us won't check you guys, If you become too crazy!

    Overall a very positive development.
     
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  4. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

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    Some people (conservatives) are already making Youtube videos denouncing this move and complaining. However nothing will change in this regard and law is law. Such people can stay at home and watch the games or not watch football at all and do something constructive. Luckily they are a tiny minority and within a few days their complains will be totally dwarfed by the vast majority as is in fact already the case. After all you had people some 55-60 years ago who opposed television. Some 20% or so of the population oppose women driving (according to polls) for instance. In 2 years time I bet this number will reach 10%. In 5 years time nobody will even consider talking about this issue just like nobody talks about whether TV or radio should be banned LET alone the much younger internet.:lol: Certain people are just afraid of change or still competing about who can appear most religious although the "Sahwa era" is on its last legs. Reputation after all. It's more manly to say that women do not belong on football stadiums. Those who support it will be denounced by such people with such views as weak men etc. Just total nonsense. Just look at the faces of those people and you need to know nothing more.
     
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  5. Clutch

    Clutch SENIOR MEMBER

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    I am glad Saudi Arabia is moving in the right direction...
     
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  6. lastofthepatriots

    lastofthepatriots BANNED

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    I don't blame them. People fear what they don't know. That's a natural reaction. I honestly don't see anything wrong with this as long as women are with their families. They deserve to enjoy sporting events as well.
     
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  7. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

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    So am I and most Saudi Arabians and Arabs. Long may it continue.

    Sure however instead of the usual knee-jerk reactions such people (usually young men ironically) should study what it is about and not mix apples and oranges. Obviously many of them use religion to appear better or gain respect. It has the opposite effect on people. Hence the "Sahwa era" in KSA being on its deathbed. Most people make fun of such people today.

    I don't know what is going through the heads of such people. Can't they see the photos and videos of happy families and women and men alike who enjoy watching a harmless sport (football)? Not sure what their problem is really.

    I was not in Jeddah nor am I an Al-Ahli fan (in fact I support/like the rival club Al-Ittihad) but if I could I would have attended.
     
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  8. KapitaanAli

    KapitaanAli FULL MEMBER

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    Saudi is without a doubt hell bent on leading the Arabian renaissance.

    Now we'll have certain peoples claiming the rightful Islamic inheritance.
     
  9. lastofthepatriots

    lastofthepatriots BANNED

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    Listen man. All I can say is that we in Pakistan have never had such problems. But letting a girl go on her own to such events or anywhere else is not acceptable. Not because of our culture, not because of Arabs from the GCC, but because of our religion. Women are the most powerful/terrifying beings known to man, but also the most vulnerable. We love them so much, that instinctively we want to protect them. I hope you understand what I am trying to say.
     
  10. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

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    Let us see about that but it has been a very promising past year and much more is to come. What is most important here that those changes are not artificial or forced but have the full backing of the population (vast majority). In a sense KSA has been a hostage (the people first and foremost) of the events in 1979 and most importantly after effects and the ultraconservative (always a minority) element represented by the clergy (vast majority of it).

    I have always been saying this here on PDF throughout the years and told people that such changes were only a question of time. In return deluded outsiders were telling me that the people would go berserk if women were allowed to drive for instance again, public concerts, women entering stadiums, religious police almost stripped of all their powers (all arresting powers in fact rendering them useless) etc. and no such thing has occurred. Not even a single violent incident. Tells everything really.

    Before 1979 the society was much different on many fronts. All those idiotic bans (moronic laws of which many are gone now) did not exist. There was no competition on who could appear most religious and who could show off the most in public. Women while modestly dressed did not necessarily war headscarf and that was in Hijaz the cradle of Islam and spiritual heartland.

    As for mantles, if you ask me and most Saudi Arabians, we would much rather focus on improving KSA further and progressing on all fronts first and foremost. Let others take this mantle although history, geography is difficult to change so in a sense Muslim masses will always look towards KSA. That's why KSA is single-out and judged so harshly by many Muslims for things that they themselves do and most other Muslim countries (in fact all of them). So that is the curse of history.

    Just like oil and gas (natural resources in general) had its positives but also curses (Dutch disease etc.). Luckily both issues are being tackled and were right on the track on both fronts towards fighting the right balance through national dialogue. As should be the case everywhere in a optimal world. Bumps will be there on the road but we will get there, I have no doubt about this.
     
  11. sammuel

    sammuel FULL MEMBER

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    A move in the right direction ,but looking at some of the pictures posted above does make it seem their is still a long way to go ....
     
  12. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

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    I don't know if some women attended on their own but usually (public gatherings such as festivals etc.) women are accompanied by men as well. Either relatives or a husband or female friends.

    I had the same view of women (always looking for the safety of men) but I have met some of the most independent women of late, including relatives. I would have no doubt that they would be able to do well on their own even in Western societies like say the US but obviously you would worry as a relative or man either indirectly or directly.

    Look when we become parents (a daughter for instance) we will be even more focused on such issues when she/they grow up (I cannot imagine anything else) but we must also understand that times and societies change. Women are not weak existences and already 1400 years ago Muslim women were engaged in practices that today are viewed as mainly "manly practices". Successful warriors on the battlefield, doctors, businesswomen, administrators (yes) and much more.

    In KSA we need to make our sisters confident and for instance increase their work participation on the job market (ongoing process going the right way) and we must protect them against those who falsely claim that they cannot do anything or little on their own without the assistance of men. In fact such people are doing a disservice to them and whether they mix cultural practices (honor etc.) or purely religious, both are counterproductive IMO.

    How exactly? Are headscarfs or the lack of it a sign of progress or a lack of it. Never heard anything more ridiculous in a long time here and that says a lot. That's a ridiculous statement. While we speak there are leading Saudi Arabian female professors and scientists in the West and at home wearing headscarfs and being hugely successful women.

    There is also something called dignity. As for the first photo, it is a hilarious and harmless photo. As if women shyness/interest has anything to do with headscarfs or not.

    BTW KSA is its own society. We have no interest in imitating Denmark for instance. Each society is different.
     
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  13. Enigma_

    Enigma_ FULL MEMBER

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    Good. A long way to go though. Hopefully KSA becomes modern enough one day so that others that bow down to them follow their good deeds.
     
  14. sammuel

    sammuel FULL MEMBER

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    I agree with you that dress code is partly a cultural thing and though i admit that seeing so many woman wearing abaya , personally makes me feel uncomfortable , it is because i am not used to it and it is indeed my problem. I agree that each society is different in that way.

    However there is also the issue that the dress code is enforced by law and woman who fail to follow it can be hassled by the police. That makes it no longer a cultural issue but a human rights issue and in that perspective i hold that woman should be allowed to wear what they want. There is a huge difference between woman who choose to wear headscarf or modest closing to them being forced to do so.

    ~
     
  15. Saif al-Arab

    Saif al-Arab BANNED

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    In this sense it is religious in nature.

    An abaya is a harmless dress and is the only dress that is enforced/encouraged while out in public due to the modesty laws in Islam. Headscarf is not mandatory in KSA.

    Well, there are always limits everywhere. For example there are nudists who would prefer to walk around naked publicly but they are not allowed to do so anywhere (public space) in 99,9% of all countries (if not all) due to existing modesty laws in that country and cultural norms shaped by culture, religion etc. Meanwhile women are walking around naked (possibly) somewhere in Africa or Papua New Guinea in isolated tribes and that is tolerated. Cultural differences and all.

    I see nothing oppressive about wearing an abaya in a Muslim majority country (almost all nationals are Muslims). They are wearing their usual clothes underneath anyway and mostly the newest fashion as Arab women (at least in the GCC) are quite focused on appearance and can mostly afford the fashion.

    For me as a Muslim and person that is used to seeing most women in public wearing an abaya, I see absolutely no problem and for me there are TONS of more important issues to focus on.

    BTW for me it is indecent when tourists (women included ) walk around half-naked in Barcelona (not the beaches) during the summer season. For most locals included. So it is all about perceptions. I understand that nobody forces them to do so but I am forced to look at it (as are others) while we are minding our own business.
     
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