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Possibility of F-35 for Pakistan Air Force

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PradoTLC

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Now I know from the title, many of PDFians will be getting ready for trolling me or this thread, You guys almost typed your cheeky one-liners and Indians already bring their old argument of " Where is the money "? Buts let's discuss this notion for what it is worth. I will propose a couple of scenarios where it might be possible for the Pakistan Air force to get F-35's from the USA, So hear me out and also without trolling discuss the possibility by providing realistic approaches for this endeavor.

Scenario 1) As we know that US seems to be trying to pack its stuff from Afghanistan and leave, as much as I support the idea of bringing US troops home, something is not adding up for me, but in a hypothetical scenario what if (God Forbid) another massive Terror Attack hit America and its connection goes back to Pak-Afghan border regions? The US will definitely stay and then it will again come to if Pakistan will corporate or not (With us or against us) notion can come up again, but this time Pakistan's situation won't be as dire as it was back in 2001, Chinese Influence was minimum at that time along with their economical assistance, Russia was hesitant in building any relationship with Pakistan, Turkey was there but not as influential as they are today, so this time maybe US might use a different approach to Pakistan decision-makers (GHQ), and offer CSF, Financial and Military Aid, releasing all Military hardware which was held from Pakistan within a span of 1-3 years, and if this war sees the intensity and US keep relying on Pakistan to provide bases, Air space and route for US supplies then along the way (by end of this decade) maybe US will offer F-35's (18 units) similar to F-16's block 52's a sqd to PAF.

Scenario 2) America always used leverage on countries to do their bidding, there is no secret it that, they did this with every country except Israel, now in past several years the relationship between US-PAK has gone from bad to worse, and trust is as low as between Trump and Melania, with CPEC becoming Operational and Chinese replacing Americans in Pakistan from Financial Aid to Military hardware, the US think tanks might see this as another important ally going into Chinese camp, they might try to butter Pakistan in future because their Stick policy has not been that fruitful and it pushes Pakistan way to deeper in Chinese Camp. Specifically in Military hardware among many development and success of JF-17 stand out taller than any other procurement by Pakistan from China, and now as JF-17 block 3 ready to roll out with AESA and other modern goodies it is a matter of pride for Pakistan but concern for West especially America, not because JF carries some Alien technology but the Independency Pakistan enjoys with their own fighter, no sanctions can hurt this program, no spare parts issues, no weapon integration and definitely no Kill Switches (only for @SQ8 :disagree:) All that experience, going into Project Azm which is the end game for PAF, developing a 5th Generation fighter, now when PAF chief told us that his vision is for PAF is to have 5th generation Air force by 2040, the actual catch here is that the independency which PAF is looking forward to, having 5th Generation fighter is not an issue after 2030, but building it at home through a sanction free supply chain is massive, which means Pakistan is taking away that one thing US always enjoy over weaker and financially starve nations like Pakistan, Leverage. So keeping PAF going from AZM, not because once again that AZM will bring some Alien tech to the table but bar Pakistan from getting fully independent over its Future Generation Fighter program they might bring an offer to the table which top brass at PAF won't be able to refuse, something like 1-2 Sqs of F-35 in a similar way they provide F-16's with US teams station at PAF bases to keep Chinese away from getting a glimpse of the tech.

Scenario 3) Pakistan become financially stable, the economy picks up and exports increase along with Foreign reserves, CPEC attracts more countries to invest, security situation improve amid Afghan Peace, some sort of Peace deal with India is signed and a political/diplomatic approach to Kashmir is taken by both parties, hence the ties between US and Pakistan improve as after the Afghan withdrawal there is a chance that America stops seeing Pakistan through the lens of Afghanistan, but as a separate country with its own national interest, and as ties improve and Pakistani's pockets become healthier they can approach US with a proposal of a couple of Sqs of F-35's as Indians by mid-2030s will have their own plans in motion to transform their Air forces into a full 5th Generation Air force, leaving Pakistan behind will tilt the balance of Power in the region hence push Pakistan to test more Nukes and missile to keep that minimum deterrence against India.

Feel free to add any other scenario you seem fit, and Please avoid the typical arguments such as Pakistan is poor, etc, everyone knows that and the whole idea of this thread is to discuss some hypothetical scenario's not getting into some same old arguments.

Also, feel free to discuss the integration process such as building up infrastructure in PAC kamra to support F-35's, supply lines, weapon integrations, EW suites etc

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @JamD @dbc @SQ8 @The Eagle @araz @Windjammer


you have too much free time..
 

Mentee

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Even if available its gonna be severely handicapped like our f16 fleet -------. buying stunted weaponry as a token of loyalty in this age when we've access to more advanced technique would be stupid at best @Dalit
 

Baz2020

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Now I know from the title, many of PDFians will be getting ready for trolling me or this thread, You guys almost typed your cheeky one-liners and Indians already bring their old argument of " Where is the money "? Buts let's discuss this notion for what it is worth. I will propose a couple of scenarios where it might be possible for the Pakistan Air force to get F-35's from the USA, So hear me out and also without trolling discuss the possibility by providing realistic approaches for this endeavor.

Scenario 1) As we know that US seems to be trying to pack its stuff from Afghanistan and leave, as much as I support the idea of bringing US troops home, something is not adding up for me, but in a hypothetical scenario what if (God Forbid) another massive Terror Attack hit America and its connection goes back to Pak-Afghan border regions? The US will definitely stay and then it will again come to if Pakistan will corporate or not (With us or against us) notion can come up again, but this time Pakistan's situation won't be as dire as it was back in 2001, Chinese Influence was minimum at that time along with their economical assistance, Russia was hesitant in building any relationship with Pakistan, Turkey was there but not as influential as they are today, so this time maybe US might use a different approach to Pakistan decision-makers (GHQ), and offer CSF, Financial and Military Aid, releasing all Military hardware which was held from Pakistan within a span of 1-3 years, and if this war sees the intensity and US keep relying on Pakistan to provide bases, Air space and route for US supplies then along the way (by end of this decade) maybe US will offer F-35's (18 units) similar to F-16's block 52's a sqd to PAF.

Scenario 2) America always used leverage on countries to do their bidding, there is no secret it that, they did this with every country except Israel, now in past several years the relationship between US-PAK has gone from bad to worse, and trust is as low as between Trump and Melania, with CPEC becoming Operational and Chinese replacing Americans in Pakistan from Financial Aid to Military hardware, the US think tanks might see this as another important ally going into Chinese camp, they might try to butter Pakistan in future because their Stick policy has not been that fruitful and it pushes Pakistan way to deeper in Chinese Camp. Specifically in Military hardware among many development and success of JF-17 stand out taller than any other procurement by Pakistan from China, and now as JF-17 block 3 ready to roll out with AESA and other modern goodies it is a matter of pride for Pakistan but concern for West especially America, not because JF carries some Alien technology but the Independency Pakistan enjoys with their own fighter, no sanctions can hurt this program, no spare parts issues, no weapon integration and definitely no Kill Switches (only for @SQ8 :disagree:) All that experience, going into Project Azm which is the end game for PAF, developing a 5th Generation fighter, now when PAF chief told us that his vision is for PAF is to have 5th generation Air force by 2040, the actual catch here is that the independency which PAF is looking forward to, having 5th Generation fighter is not an issue after 2030, but building it at home through a sanction free supply chain is massive, which means Pakistan is taking away that one thing US always enjoy over weaker and financially starve nations like Pakistan, Leverage. So keeping PAF going from AZM, not because once again that AZM will bring some Alien tech to the table but bar Pakistan from getting fully independent over its Future Generation Fighter program they might bring an offer to the table which top brass at PAF won't be able to refuse, something like 1-2 Sqs of F-35 in a similar way they provide F-16's with US teams station at PAF bases to keep Chinese away from getting a glimpse of the tech.

Scenario 3) Pakistan become financially stable, the economy picks up and exports increase along with Foreign reserves, CPEC attracts more countries to invest, security situation improve amid Afghan Peace, some sort of Peace deal with India is signed and a political/diplomatic approach to Kashmir is taken by both parties, hence the ties between US and Pakistan improve as after the Afghan withdrawal there is a chance that America stops seeing Pakistan through the lens of Afghanistan, but as a separate country with its own national interest, and as ties improve and Pakistani's pockets become healthier they can approach US with a proposal of a couple of Sqs of F-35's as Indians by mid-2030s will have their own plans in motion to transform their Air forces into a full 5th Generation Air force, leaving Pakistan behind will tilt the balance of Power in the region hence push Pakistan to test more Nukes and missile to keep that minimum deterrence against India.

Feel free to add any other scenario you seem fit, and Please avoid the typical arguments such as Pakistan is poor, etc, everyone knows that and the whole idea of this thread is to discuss some hypothetical scenario's not getting into some same old arguments.

Also, feel free to discuss the integration process such as building up infrastructure in PAC kamra to support F-35's, supply lines, weapon integrations, EW suites etc

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @JamD @dbc @SQ8 @The Eagle @araz @Windjammer
If I there was a way to reach you through the screen, I would have done some nice things to you on even thinking of this non sense. The fact that you tried to preempt reaction on this comic that you have written shows how full of yourself you are. Go and find something better to do
 

TheSnakeEatingMarkhur

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Now I know from the title, many of PDFians will be getting ready for trolling me or this thread, You guys almost typed your cheeky one-liners and Indians already bring their old argument of " Where is the money "? Buts let's discuss this notion for what it is worth. I will propose a couple of scenarios where it might be possible for the Pakistan Air force to get F-35's from the USA, So hear me out and also without trolling discuss the possibility by providing realistic approaches for this endeavor.

Scenario 1) As we know that US seems to be trying to pack its stuff from Afghanistan and leave, as much as I support the idea of bringing US troops home, something is not adding up for me, but in a hypothetical scenario what if (God Forbid) another massive Terror Attack hit America and its connection goes back to Pak-Afghan border regions? The US will definitely stay and then it will again come to if Pakistan will corporate or not (With us or against us) notion can come up again, but this time Pakistan's situation won't be as dire as it was back in 2001, Chinese Influence was minimum at that time along with their economical assistance, Russia was hesitant in building any relationship with Pakistan, Turkey was there but not as influential as they are today, so this time maybe US might use a different approach to Pakistan decision-makers (GHQ), and offer CSF, Financial and Military Aid, releasing all Military hardware which was held from Pakistan within a span of 1-3 years, and if this war sees the intensity and US keep relying on Pakistan to provide bases, Air space and route for US supplies then along the way (by end of this decade) maybe US will offer F-35's (18 units) similar to F-16's block 52's a sqd to PAF.

Scenario 2) America always used leverage on countries to do their bidding, there is no secret it that, they did this with every country except Israel, now in past several years the relationship between US-PAK has gone from bad to worse, and trust is as low as between Trump and Melania, with CPEC becoming Operational and Chinese replacing Americans in Pakistan from Financial Aid to Military hardware, the US think tanks might see this as another important ally going into Chinese camp, they might try to butter Pakistan in future because their Stick policy has not been that fruitful and it pushes Pakistan way to deeper in Chinese Camp. Specifically in Military hardware among many development and success of JF-17 stand out taller than any other procurement by Pakistan from China, and now as JF-17 block 3 ready to roll out with AESA and other modern goodies it is a matter of pride for Pakistan but concern for West especially America, not because JF carries some Alien technology but the Independency Pakistan enjoys with their own fighter, no sanctions can hurt this program, no spare parts issues, no weapon integration and definitely no Kill Switches (only for @SQ8 :disagree:) All that experience, going into Project Azm which is the end game for PAF, developing a 5th Generation fighter, now when PAF chief told us that his vision is for PAF is to have 5th generation Air force by 2040, the actual catch here is that the independency which PAF is looking forward to, having 5th Generation fighter is not an issue after 2030, but building it at home through a sanction free supply chain is massive, which means Pakistan is taking away that one thing US always enjoy over weaker and financially starve nations like Pakistan, Leverage. So keeping PAF going from AZM, not because once again that AZM will bring some Alien tech to the table but bar Pakistan from getting fully independent over its Future Generation Fighter program they might bring an offer to the table which top brass at PAF won't be able to refuse, something like 1-2 Sqs of F-35 in a similar way they provide F-16's with US teams station at PAF bases to keep Chinese away from getting a glimpse of the tech.

Scenario 3) Pakistan become financially stable, the economy picks up and exports increase along with Foreign reserves, CPEC attracts more countries to invest, security situation improve amid Afghan Peace, some sort of Peace deal with India is signed and a political/diplomatic approach to Kashmir is taken by both parties, hence the ties between US and Pakistan improve as after the Afghan withdrawal there is a chance that America stops seeing Pakistan through the lens of Afghanistan, but as a separate country with its own national interest, and as ties improve and Pakistani's pockets become healthier they can approach US with a proposal of a couple of Sqs of F-35's as Indians by mid-2030s will have their own plans in motion to transform their Air forces into a full 5th Generation Air force, leaving Pakistan behind will tilt the balance of Power in the region hence push Pakistan to test more Nukes and missile to keep that minimum deterrence against India.

Feel free to add any other scenario you seem fit, and Please avoid the typical arguments such as Pakistan is poor, etc, everyone knows that and the whole idea of this thread is to discuss some hypothetical scenario's not getting into some same old arguments.

Also, feel free to discuss the integration process such as building up infrastructure in PAC kamra to support F-35's, supply lines, weapon integrations, EW suites etc

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @JamD @dbc @SQ8 @The Eagle @araz @Windjammer
Scenario 1) Do you Taliban have been protecting US bases for almost 1 year now ? Against other groups ?
Scenario 2) Pakistan can ask for upgrade of F16 plus more if it fits in doctrine instead for F35
Scenario 3) Financial stability for Pakistan is years away that too if we work hard and with consistency
 

dbc

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Thanks for the tag, I suggested a long time ago that the F-35 will be hamstrung in the IAF.
They simply do not have the suite of off-board, land and space based sensors and comms to make the F-35 very effective in their arsenal. The same is true of Pakistan, a lot of work and investment needs to occur before Pakistan can go anywhere near the F-35.

I don't think the F-35 has a peer today or is at risk of having one in the next decade. The Brits working with the Swedes may come close to challenging our fifth gen platforms but the Russians and Chinese are decades away.
 

GumNaam

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license production agreement with transfer of technology for both f35s & f22s at kamra has already been signed in exchange for safe amreekan exit from afghanistan. all u.s. production facilities will be shut down & all supply chains for these aircrafts will now be soully & exclusively through the PAC. furthermore, in exchange for secret airbase, amreeka with five 2 super carriers & 5 seawolf submarines that can launch thaad missiles from under water depths of 100 meters. loyd austen and anthony blinken will personally deliver the said platforms while wearing hawaiian tutus with coconut bras. oh and they will hand iiok to you as well a sign of appreciation. :enjoy:
 
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Riz

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We should force USA to exchange these F-35s with our F-16 block1 which we bought in 90s … :lol:
 

The Maverick

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We should force USA to exchange these F-35s with our F-16 block1 which we bought in 90s … :lol:
if you join the quad against China
make peace with India,
kick China off your land in gilgat and gwader
allow usa,naval base. and air base in gilgat

then usa may sell you down graded f35 in small.nos by 2030.

China will.not leave gwader now your stuck and f35 will.not be given to chinease ally period .

you got into.bed with the enemy of usa it's too late
 

Riz

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if you join the quad against China
make peace with India,
kick China off your land in gilgat and gwader
allow usa,naval base. and air base in gilgat

then usa may sell you down graded f35 in small.nos by 2030.

China will.not leave gwader now your stuck and f35 will.not be given to chinease ally period .

you got into.bed with the enemy of usa it's too late
Pak is not enemy of USA, actually we tried our best to let our friend get out from the mess called Afghanistan, soon they will realize how good friend was pak who saved priceless lives and money of USA
Pak helped them and they are now solo super power, pak helped them and they became friend of china... I have long list how good we are and how good our friendship was
Now tell me how india will help them against china?? Do u have guts or power to do so?? For example we actually shot down many soviet union jets at the time of war and before the start of war,now tell me do india have guts to shot down PLA jet for the sake of USA??
 

VCheng

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Pak is not enemy of USA, actually we tried our best to let our friend get out from the mess called Afghanistan, soon they will realize how good friend was pak who saved priceless lives and money of USA
Pak helped them and they are now solo super power, pak helped them and they became friend of china... I have long list how good we are and how good our friendship was
Now tell me how india will help them against china?? Do u have guts or power to do so?? For example we actually shot down many soviet union jets at the time of war and before the start of war,now tell me do india have guts to shot down PLA jet for the sake of USA??

There is nothing permanent in international geopolitics. Every nation must decide for itself how its own national interests can align with those of other countries to created allies for as long such commonality exists. What was in the past may have been great, but it is up to both USA and Pakistan to find such common grounds for continued partnerships. Or go their own separate ways in pursuing their own respective national interests. That is how it works.
 

Riz

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There is nothing permanent in international geopolitics. Every nation must decide for itself how its own national interests can align with those of other countries to created allies for as long such commonality exists. What was in the past may have been great, but it is up to both USA and Pakistan to find such common grounds for continued partnerships. Or go their own separate ways in pursuing their own respective national interests. That is how it works.
That is what we are trying to explain them.. Nothing is permanent, they are here for temporary and we are permanent, and we not allow them to ruin everything just like they did in the past, helping them to destroy soviets was our mistake and i hope india will never follow our path that would disturb the balance of the power
 

Basel

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Now I know from the title, many of PDFians will be getting ready for trolling me or this thread, You guys almost typed your cheeky one-liners and Indians already bring their old argument of " Where is the money "? Buts let's discuss this notion for what it is worth. I will propose a couple of scenarios where it might be possible for the Pakistan Air force to get F-35's from the USA, So hear me out and also without trolling discuss the possibility by providing realistic approaches for this endeavor.

Scenario 1) As we know that US seems to be trying to pack its stuff from Afghanistan and leave, as much as I support the idea of bringing US troops home, something is not adding up for me, but in a hypothetical scenario what if (God Forbid) another massive Terror Attack hit America and its connection goes back to Pak-Afghan border regions? The US will definitely stay and then it will again come to if Pakistan will corporate or not (With us or against us) notion can come up again, but this time Pakistan's situation won't be as dire as it was back in 2001, Chinese Influence was minimum at that time along with their economical assistance, Russia was hesitant in building any relationship with Pakistan, Turkey was there but not as influential as they are today, so this time maybe US might use a different approach to Pakistan decision-makers (GHQ), and offer CSF, Financial and Military Aid, releasing all Military hardware which was held from Pakistan within a span of 1-3 years, and if this war sees the intensity and US keep relying on Pakistan to provide bases, Air space and route for US supplies then along the way (by end of this decade) maybe US will offer F-35's (18 units) similar to F-16's block 52's a sqd to PAF.

Scenario 2) America always used leverage on countries to do their bidding, there is no secret it that, they did this with every country except Israel, now in past several years the relationship between US-PAK has gone from bad to worse, and trust is as low as between Trump and Melania, with CPEC becoming Operational and Chinese replacing Americans in Pakistan from Financial Aid to Military hardware, the US think tanks might see this as another important ally going into Chinese camp, they might try to butter Pakistan in future because their Stick policy has not been that fruitful and it pushes Pakistan way to deeper in Chinese Camp. Specifically in Military hardware among many development and success of JF-17 stand out taller than any other procurement by Pakistan from China, and now as JF-17 block 3 ready to roll out with AESA and other modern goodies it is a matter of pride for Pakistan but concern for West especially America, not because JF carries some Alien technology but the Independency Pakistan enjoys with their own fighter, no sanctions can hurt this program, no spare parts issues, no weapon integration and definitely no Kill Switches (only for @SQ8 :disagree:) All that experience, going into Project Azm which is the end game for PAF, developing a 5th Generation fighter, now when PAF chief told us that his vision is for PAF is to have 5th generation Air force by 2040, the actual catch here is that the independency which PAF is looking forward to, having 5th Generation fighter is not an issue after 2030, but building it at home through a sanction free supply chain is massive, which means Pakistan is taking away that one thing US always enjoy over weaker and financially starve nations like Pakistan, Leverage. So keeping PAF going from AZM, not because once again that AZM will bring some Alien tech to the table but bar Pakistan from getting fully independent over its Future Generation Fighter program they might bring an offer to the table which top brass at PAF won't be able to refuse, something like 1-2 Sqs of F-35 in a similar way they provide F-16's with US teams station at PAF bases to keep Chinese away from getting a glimpse of the tech.

Scenario 3) Pakistan become financially stable, the economy picks up and exports increase along with Foreign reserves, CPEC attracts more countries to invest, security situation improve amid Afghan Peace, some sort of Peace deal with India is signed and a political/diplomatic approach to Kashmir is taken by both parties, hence the ties between US and Pakistan improve as after the Afghan withdrawal there is a chance that America stops seeing Pakistan through the lens of Afghanistan, but as a separate country with its own national interest, and as ties improve and Pakistani's pockets become healthier they can approach US with a proposal of a couple of Sqs of F-35's as Indians by mid-2030s will have their own plans in motion to transform their Air forces into a full 5th Generation Air force, leaving Pakistan behind will tilt the balance of Power in the region hence push Pakistan to test more Nukes and missile to keep that minimum deterrence against India.

Feel free to add any other scenario you seem fit, and Please avoid the typical arguments such as Pakistan is poor, etc, everyone knows that and the whole idea of this thread is to discuss some hypothetical scenario's not getting into some same old arguments.

Also, feel free to discuss the integration process such as building up infrastructure in PAC kamra to support F-35's, supply lines, weapon integrations, EW suites etc

@Bilal Khan (Quwa) @JamD @dbc @SQ8 @The Eagle @araz @Windjammer
USA is not allowing T-129 engines l, AH-1Zs CSF and people are dreaming about F-35. WOW.

When will Pakistanis wake up and see the reality.
 

FuturePAF

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There’s a reason the PAF joined the FC-1/JF-17 program after the Pressler Amendment and the US tried to get Pakistan to leave it as Air Marshall Latif once said.


It is also the reason Pakistan is now focused on Project AZM.

The Turks have learned this as well (look at the coup the west supported, and in response the Turks got the S-400 for which they were kicked out of and seem to be totally focus on the T-FX.

I don’t even expect PAF to get any more F-16s or any upgrade from them. Best to move on or else be at the mercy of fair weather friends for another generation.

We need to remember the F-35 is not a super duper plane. It’s a compromise design and what was cutting edge tech 10 years ago, is slowly becoming the norm in competing designs around the world.

we should be of the mindset that all F-16s in the current fleet will serve out the last of their remaining lives as it, and should plan accordingly. This is why the JF-17 Block III needs to be as good as possible. We should push to fund (or hopefully only have to co-fund) the development of an A2A missile in Chinese industry that the JF-17 can carry that will out range the Meteor; possibly something like the proposed “Ramjet powered PL-21”.

Whatever the J-10 can do we should find a way to allow the JF-17 to do that as much as possible, and our next fighter should be Project AZM’s NGFA or if cost does not permit a more modest single engine fighter that could replace the F-16.

Obviously take any new F-16s if offered for free or CSF, but don’t count on any equipment out of the US.

P.S. we definitely must try to get ToT of the RD-93MA or WS-13 engine to license produce them in Pakistan. We should at least have the ability to make a full fighter in house. It’s the Turks ability to make the F-16’s engine that gives them something to build the T-FX upon.
 
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python-000

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Kindly change the name of this threat from (Possibility of F-35 for PAF) into ( Posibility of J-35 for PAF)...
 
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