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PM rejects criticism of dual nationals holding public office

CodeforFood

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Wasnt he the one to be the biggest critic of overseas pakistanis holding positions?
Frankly a person who gave up living in the country or gave up business in it have no right to come and rule or be on big positions. A dual national will pack bags n leave the day govt ends and then no one can catch him for corruption or for state secrets. These dual nationals are mostly foreign agents too and collect sensitive information using their office.
People who are not accountable to the people of Pakistan should never hold any public office. Imran khan is a uturn morons king.
Wow.. Listen to yourself, oh but we are giving you too much credit for that.
Loyalty to Pakistan and honesty are more important than talents. Actually, foreign educated 'talented' people (specially UK) have destroyed Pakistan so far. So no, dual nationals must not be allowed in government positions. They are free to join the private sector.
So I am assuming you want to lead all the fields starting from metallurgy, technology etc yourself. If you had that in you, you would have done it by now. All the big major defense(talking only that since it is defense forum) milestones are developed/reached by people who got exposed to international arena. Good thing wiser head than yours(knucklehead) are making the decisions.
 
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CodeforFood

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Wow.. Listen to yourself, oh but we are giving you too much credit for that.

So I am assuming you want to lead all the fields starting from metallurgy, technology etc yourself. If you had that in you, you would have done it by now. All the big major defense(talking only that since it is defense forum) milestones are developed/reached by people who got exposed to international arena. Good thing wiser head than yours(knucklehead) are making the decisions.
What has Pakistan invented on its own. A tank, an Airplane, A balloon ??? All came through people's exposure outside the country.
Come to your senses.
 

FuturePAF

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As I appreciate the sentiments of the PM, towards us Overseas Pakistanis, I have to feel for the Pakistanis in Pakistan, that for lack of opportunity don’t get to develop their skills as much as they could with the adequate resources. Conversely, are sidelined or suppressed when they speak out to get those resources and opportunities.

Secondly, there is a potential security risk of inviting overseas Pakistanis, that hold a foreign nationality into the government, as a minister, unless it is for the specific post of minister for Overseas Pakistanis.

What maybe a good way for overseas Pakistanis to contribute without having to relinquish their foreign nationality, but offer advise (when the government requests it) would be consultancies in the form of think tanks and heads of startup incubators. In this way, they can share their expertise, and help open a new private avenue to find local partners, to try new things, and offer their findings. The government can commission studies from them if their firm proves the most capable, and local firms can also compete to win contracts on equal footing.

In any area, the government considers requesting input of overseas Pakistanis, it should fund research by local top talent, at research universities, and allow the two to collaborate with their independent findings afterwards. The two independent approaches and subsequent collaboration may allow for a better understanding of the ground realities, challenges and opportunities, without wasting or diminishing the expertise of both talent pools.

In a sense this approach has been tried before, in Pakistan, when the team from PAEC collaborated with scientists under the direction of A.Q. Khan, if I remember correctly. They’re separate but equally valid expertise led to nuclear capabilities Pakistan has today.
 

Vortex

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As I appreciate the sentiments of the PM, towards us Overseas Pakistanis, I have to feel for the Pakistanis in Pakistan, that for lack of opportunity don’t get to develop their skills as much as they could with the adequate resources. Conversely, are sidelined or suppressed when they speak out to get those resources and opportunities.

Secondly, there is a potential security risk of inviting overseas Pakistanis, that hold a foreign nationality into the government, as a minister, unless it is for the specific post of minister for Overseas Pakistanis.

What maybe a good way for overseas Pakistanis to contribute without having to relinquish their foreign nationality, but offer advise (when the government requests it) would be consultancies in the form of think tanks and heads of startup incubators. In this way, they can share their expertise, and help open a new private avenue to find local partners, to try new things, and offer their findings. The government can commission studies from them if their firm proves the most capable, and local firms can also compete to win contracts on equal footing.

In any area, the government considers requesting input of overseas Pakistanis, it should fund research by local top talent, at research universities, and allow the two to collaborate with their independent findings afterwards. The two independent approaches and subsequent collaboration may allow for a better understanding of the ground realities, challenges and opportunities, without wasting or diminishing the expertise of both talent pools.

In a sense this approach has been tried before, in Pakistan, when the team from PAEC collaborated with scientists under the direction of A.Q. Khan, if I remember correctly. They’re separate but equally valid expertise led to nuclear capabilities Pakistan has today.
so why not to do as China and some other countries who do not allow more than one nationality ?
You are talking about risk... but then let me know if some dishonest Pakistanis are not able to destroy Pakistan from within ?

yeah strip of Pakistani nationality of all overseas citizens.
With this kind of mindset I will start to request all overseas Pakistanis to stop sending remittances. It’s fair isn’t it?
 

FuturePAF

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so why not to do as China and some other countries who do not allow more than one nationality ?
You are talking about risk... but then let me know if some dishonest Pakistanis are not able to destroy Pakistan from within ?

yeah strip of Pakistani nationality of all overseas citizens.
With this kind of mindset I will start to request all overseas Pakistanis to stop sending remittances. It’s fair isn’t it?
Another thing China does is vet anyone that wants to hold a position of power. And when in power, these leaders are watched for signs of corruption. If found indulging, they are removed and punished.

Yes, I mentioned the risk. Saying there is a risk from a person hold dual nationality does not mean Pakistanis in Pakistan couldn’t also be a risk, but perhaps it would be more difficult to properly vet an overseas Pakistanis, especially for security clearances on sensitive matters, which is why the Pakistani military doesn’t allow dual nations to be high ranking officers, or in the military in general, I assume. (Can some one clarify this issue?)

I myself am an overseas Pakistani that sends remittances to family back home. No one is talking about stripping Pakistani nationality of overseas Pakistanis holding dual nationality. The issue is dual nationals holding political office in Pakistan.

Ultimately, With talent available in the diaspora, if the possibility is opened up to overseas Pakistanis, and the parliament votes to allow it, we can see how it develops.
 
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Old School

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A potential MNA aspirant is supposed be known in his/her constituency so that people can vote for them. One who has been missing from the public eyes for a long 20/30 years will generally find it very hard to get votes and eventually elected unless there is an illigal backdoor such as rigged election. Why all of a sudden so many so called 'talented' overseas PAK born people become so much interested in public office when most of them are not very known to general public ? We don't know what they have been doing all those years abroad besides being 'talanted'. Failed states such as Afghanistan/Iraq/Libya/Somalia etc. all have now such imported 'talentpool' running their countries. We can not take anything at face values in Pakistan these days. We did have imported PM with dual nationalities before and we also know the consequences which followed.
 
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Arsalan345

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i think it's terrible. why we have people with irani passport and still holding public offices? same is true for Saudi or Arab countries. all these people are serving these countries as well. this is not good for Pakistan. it looks like an infiltration, infiltration using valid laws of a country but serving other country and remain in contact with enemy intelligence.don't tell me that there are no traitors. everyone knows what is going on here.
 

Vortex

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Another thing China does is vet anyone that wants to hold a position of power. And when in power, these leaders are watched for signs of corruption. If found indulging, they are removed and punished.

Yes, I mentioned the risk. Saying there is a risk from a person hold dual nationality does not mean Pakistanis in Pakistan couldn’t also be a risk, but perhaps it would be more difficult to properly vet an overseas Pakistanis, especially for security clearances on sensitive matters, which is why the Pakistani military doesn’t allow dual nations to be high ranking officers, or in the military in general, I assume. (Can some one clarify this issue?)

I myself am an overseas Pakistani that sends remittances to family back home. No one is talking about stripping Pakistani nationality of overseas Pakistanis holding dual nationality. The issue is dual nationals holding political office in Pakistan.

Ultimately, With talent available in the diaspora, if the possibility is opened up to overseas Pakistanis, and the parliament votes to allow it, we can see how it develops.
A potential MNA aspirant is supposed be known in his/her constituency so that people can vote for them. One who has been missing from the public eyes for a long 20/30 years will generally find it very hard to get votes and eventually elected unless there is an illigal backdoor such as rigged election. Why all of a sudden so many so called 'talented' overseas PAK born people become so much interested in public office when most of them are not very known to general public ? We don't know what they have been doing all those years abroad besides being 'talanted'. Failed states such as Afghanistan/Iraq/Libya/Somalia etc. all have now such imported 'talentpool' running their countries. We can not take anything at face values in Pakistan these days. We did have imported PM with dual nationalities before and we also know the consequences which followed.
Is the problem lying in the honesty of the characters, (I mean in its lack of it) or it’s dual nationality ?
 
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Old School

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Is the problem lying in the honesty of the characters, (I mean in its lack of it) or it’s dual nationality ?
The issue we are dealing with is called risk mitigation. No need to take unnecessary risks. These dual nationals are not magicians anyway.
 

Vortex

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The issue we are dealing with is called risk mitigation. No need to take unnecessary risks. These dual nationals are not magicians anyway.

Nobody is magician. And I hope nobody is using magic as it is forbidden.

But there are risks mitigation’s and risks mitigations.

If you are clever, you will get the best.... if not, then you will lost what the best you could have.

Life is not easy.

Today you exclude overseas, tomorrow you will exclude Sindhi, Punjabi, Baluchi, Kashmiri, etc... and in 50 years we as Pakistanis will be still looking for our identity.
 

TNT

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Bro what you are not able to see is what we lack as Pakistanis. We lack identity, a National Identity !
As I have many said on this forum, we are still looking at an Identity !
We were not able to build a National Identity. Everyone define itself as Punjabi or Sindhi or Baluchi or Kashmiri etc. Add to that some are defining themselves as Sunni or Shia or Christian etc... We are defining India as our enemy but confused as we are, most of us watch bollywood films etc.

We are in the 21st century but with Middle Ages mindset. We are using modern concepts without knowing what they are. What are the prerequisites etc...

We lost the jazba our elders had when they fought for our own country. Our awam is musguided by every mullah, politician, patwaris. It’s kind of “ ye hey hamara mulk, ye hey hum aur ye hey humary pawry” if I can put a joke.
If our country was modern enough but still with its true Islamic values, then be sure Pakistan would have been the USA or Israel of Asia ! It would have foreigners who would bring their money in Pakistan.
If Pakistan was not working on its beradery or its ethnicity Pakistani awam be it dual nationality holder or not, would have made Pakistan more stronger , as everyone would have been accountable for everything. Justice would have been true justice, and Pakistan’s voice would have not been the peanut in the monkey mouth’s value.
What I see is even if someone is more experienced he would not have any chance to offer its valuable experience to Pakistan. Because of your mindset. You are happy we send remittances but that’s all. You are telling us go f.ck off.
You are telling me that I’m not seeing the ground reality, but what you are not seeing is why and how these foreign countries are developed and what they offers to their national even if they are dual nationality holders. Something you as Pakistanis are not able to offer even to
Pakistanis.


you won’t be able to build a modern Pakistan with that mindset.

It’s very sad. What you said me broke all what jazba I have as being Pakistani ! Thank you very much Bro.


Now tell me how many will apply for green card if were told USA is opening its country to Pakistanis ? Be sure 95% if not 100% of Pakistanis would queue in front of the US consulate.
Still there are huge queues infront of every visa office. So u tell me how do we build an identity? We already have an identity but our own ppl dont own it and don't feel proud of it.
There are millions ready to leave Pakistan but not a single person who want to fix this country. There are millions who would send their kids abroad for education in a blink of an eye but would never bother to even try n fix our education system.
There are millions of Pakistanis ready to take oath of allegiance to the queen or anyone else but not a single person sincere with the country. So u tell me what to do??
Yes remittances are good for the country but does not mean we let the dual national run the country. We have had bad experiences like that shaukat aziz. My point is, if a dual national is invited or used for a position due to his experience or specialty, he should have the audacity to for go his other nationality so as to avoid any conflict of interest. I dont think this is too much to ask.
I know Pakistan doesnt offer much and foreign countries offer way more than us, its an easy escape. It easy to succeed there with all the facilities and opportunities and its hard to even survive in Pakistan, with all the sifarshi and rishwat culture, phds are jobless and BA pass are on big positions. So the ones living here are taking the tough route and not escaping and not giving up.
 

TNT

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With this kind of mindset I will start to request all overseas Pakistanis to stop sending remittances.
Lol ur talking as if that money is sent to govt or poor ppl of Pakistan. Remittances are sent by those working abroad to their families, not doing anyone a favour to others. The only advantage it gives the country is the foreign currency.
Also remittances are mostly sent by labourers and workers working abroad and having families in Pakistan, they are not dual nationals. Dual nationals take their families with them never send any remittances and have no advantage to the country.
 

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