• Saturday, July 20, 2019

PLA may upgrade radar of its Su-30 MKK to match Su-30 MKI of India

Discussion in 'Indian Defence Forum' started by Indo-guy, May 9, 2014.

  1. Indo-guy

    Indo-guy SENIOR MEMBER

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    http://www.defencenews.in/defence-news-internal.aspx?id=IWcwnR9zDKo=



    To compete with India's Sukhoi Su-30MKI fighters, the People's Liberation Army Air Force may consider replacing the RLPK-27VE integrated radar targeting system of its Sukhoi Su-30MKK fighters with more advanced passive electronically scanned array radar, according to the Moscow-based Military Parade magazine.
    [​IMG]
    To compete with India's Sukhoi Su-30MKI fighters, the People's Liberation Army Air Force may consider replacing the RLPK-27VE integrated radar targeting system of its Sukhoi Su-30MKK fighters with more advanced passive electronically scanned array radar, according to the Moscow-based Military Parade magazine.

    Even though China has shown itself capable of building its own version of Russian fighters such as the J-11B and the J-15 through reverse engineering, many Western experts still question whether the quality of these Chinese fighters is really equal to the Russian originals. This is the reason why China still needs to purchase the Su-35S, Russia's 4.5-generation, despite the fact that it is already capable of designing a fifth-generation stealth fighter.

    China is currently still unable to design and produce engine and radar systems as advanced as Russia's. India, one of China's major rivals, has purchased a Su-30MKI with a passive electronically scanned array and gained a license from Russia to produce Saturn AL-31FP engines domestically. With the ability to track targets 200 kilometers away, the Indian Air Force's Su-30MKI could easily overcome Chinese fighters in a potential conflict.

    With only the RLPK-27VE integrated radar targeting system, China's Su-30MKK cannot even fire the Russian-built KS-172 air-to-air missile, according to Kanwa Defense Review published by Andrei Chang also known as Pinkov, a military from Canada. This is the reason why China is considering installing passive electronically scanned array radar to upgrade its fighters. China has also developed its J-15 carrier-based fighters with AL-31FP engines, although the price of the fighter has gradually increased.
     
  2. he-man

    he-man ELITE MEMBER

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    Damn,,,thats pretty bad if u ask me.
    But there were reports that china was already testing an aesa??

    @Chinese-Dragon
     
  3. dray

    dray BANNED

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    PLAAF doesn't have any fighter in service that can match-up to SU30-MKI, the difference will be maintained in future also with PAK-FA / FGFA. :)
     
  4. Indo-guy

    Indo-guy SENIOR MEMBER

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    we should never underestimate the potential enemy

    It's better to overestimate power of potential enemy and prepare ...than underestimate and be complacent ...
     
  5. cirr

    cirr ELITE MEMBER

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  6. bolo

    bolo SENIOR MEMBER

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    How many times do we need to repeat this. China was never interested in Su35. Rumour has been going on since 2005. Any Chinese member can tell you Kanwa + Andrei Chang is laughable at best. A US politician has more credibility than Kanwa or Andrei Chang.
     
  7. cirr

    cirr ELITE MEMBER

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    Chinese Air Force Takes Delivery of New J-16 Strike Fighters
    By the end of April 2014, the People's Liberation Army Air Force (PLAAF) has taken delivery of a regiment of J-16 multirole fighters, with an expected initial operational capability in late 2014. Marrying the survivability and air combat power of the Russian Su-30MKK airframe with the Xian JH-7A's versatile arsenal, the Shenyang J-16 strike fighter is notable for its full suite of fully indigenous Chinese guided munitions. While the Su-30MKK was restricted to firing only Russian-made antiship and bunker busting bombs, the domestically designed JH-7A carried a full range of Chinese super and subsonic anti-ship missiles, air to air missiles, satellite guided bombs, cruise missiles and electronic countermeasure (ECM) jammers. However, the JH-7 did not have radar guided air to air missiles, which makes it vulnerable to other fighters common in the region such as the F-16.

    [​IMG]
    J-16
    J-16, with production number #1601 painted on the right side of the cockpit, is the first production J-16 delivered to the PLAAF. The J-16 provides China with a comprehensive aerial combat and precision bomber capability in one airframe.
    Goneless via www.top81.cn

    Publically available photos of the J-16 are hard to come by, given the work of Chinese censors. What we do know is that despite their similar missions, the J-16 is actually built on a different Su-27 Flanker airframe than the Su-30MKK (notable differences include the J-16's cropped vertical fin tails vs. the Su-30MKK's square topped vertical fin tails). The J-16 is the strike version of the J-11BS, a twin seat version of the Su-27K. The most important upgrade to the J-16 is an Active Electronically Scanned Array (AESA) radar, which is more powerful than the slotted array radars that the Su-30 and JH-7A have. The AESA radar allows the J-16 to intercept enemy aircraft at longer ranges than either of its predecessors, and to attack multiple surface targets simultaneously. The AESA radar would also be datalinked to other Chinese platforms, including unmanned vehicles, to increase their situational awareness.


    [​IMG]
    J-16 Multirole Fighter
    The J-16 strike fighter is based off of the Su-30MKK Flanker. Having a two person crew allows for a dedicated weapons sensor officer, seated in the cockpit's rear, to focus on finding targets, managing electronic warfare and controlling precision guided munitions.
    lt.cjdby.net
    This addition offers a wider set of options for Chinese military planners. Multirole fighters like the Tornado IDS, F-15E Strike Eagle and now the J-16 are well suited for the challenges of high tech conventional warfare, by combining the air combat capability of fighters with the guided munitions capability of bombers. The J-16's survivability and long range means it can match and even outnumber enemy fighters before going on to bomb their airfields, command centers and ships. And on the defensive, the J-16 can switch to a full air to air missile load to defend Chinese airspace against enemy aircraft.


    Read more at Chinese Air Force Takes Delivery of New J-16 Strike Fighters | Popular Science
     
  8. janon

    janon ELITE MEMBER

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  9. BoQ77

    BoQ77 BANNED

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    made in china all superior than russia made. why overall quality still terrible
     
  10. cirr

    cirr ELITE MEMBER

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    some 60,with AESA for all future fighter jets save the first batch of J-15s。

    J-10B、J-10C、J-15B、J-16、J-20、J-21 etc

    The list goes on。

    China can now make advanced AESA radars like Chinese families make noodles。

    Piece of cake。:D

    Chinese quality is super nowadays as long as you are willing to pay the price。

    China makes low-cost products for those who can barely afford a basic living。The majority of our Indian friends fall in this category。

    China also makes top-notch products for exports to the so-called developed countries。

    Haier is a good case in point。Check it out。
     
  11. janon

    janon ELITE MEMBER

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    I know China can make AESAs - my question was how many Chinese fighters have them in operational service. And the reason I asked is because you expressed such disdain for PESA technology, as if all your air force has moved on to AESAs. Let's keep things realistic, shall we? The fact is that most Chinese fighters fly with mechanical radars, and PESAs would be a tremendous improvement. And that is true for most other countries as well.
     
  12. BoQ77

    BoQ77 BANNED

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    haier included inside all of panasonic or masushita components, you call it china made? final assembly, with poor quality management
     
  13. spectribution

    spectribution FULL MEMBER

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    According to Force India (2010):

    And come 2014, UAC, together with Hindustan Aeronautics Ltd (HAL) will begin upgrading the first 100 IAF Su-30MKIs by modifying their airframes to make them stealthy, converting the existing ‘Bars’ into an active phased-array radar, enhancing the situational awareness by incorporating active electronically scanned transmit/receive arrays on the aircraft’s wings, and beefing up the defensive-aids suite by installing a combined radar/laser warning system and a missile approach warning system. Tikhomirov-NIIP had by last November begun laboratory-level tests of a ‘Bars’, which was fitted with an AESA array made up of X-band transmit/receive modules built by Istok JSC. Since then, another two ‘Bars’ radars have been modified as part of the R&D phase, which will last until 2012, and will be followed by flight qualification a year later. Incidentally, Tikhomirov-NIIP has also developed the Irbis-E passive phased-array radar for the Su-35BM and will soon begin work on modifying the Irbis-E into an active phased-array radar, which will go on board the Fifth Generation Fighter Aircraft (FGFA) that will be co-developed by UAC and HAL. In addition, both UAC and Tikhomirov-NIIP have come together to develop the ‘smart skin’ concept under which an AESA array’s transmit/receive modules can be placed anywhere on board the Su-30MKI to generate the relevant radiation field required for achieving more than 180-degree field-of-view.

    1.) Su-30 MKI to undergo mid-life upgrade starting 2014
    2.) Bars radar to be upgraded with AESA antenna
    3.) active skin - AESA T/R modules to be mounted in wing sections to provide > 180 deg FoV
    4.) Al-31FP engines to be uprated by 20% with operating life increased to 6k hrs
    5.) Conformal weapons station between engine pods for stealth

    MKI has airframe exactly like SU 35 which is why it can hold a heavy radar like BARS N011M or N011M+. SU 30MK2 is a smaller airframe and hence can't have a similar phased array.

    Anyways China did buy a phased array from Russia for MK2.

    In 2000, China placed an order of passive electronically scanned array radar named Sokol (Falcon), designed byPhazotron, while the radar was still under development, it is reported that China had either partially funded or joined the development, but this can not be confirmed. All twenty units were delivered in 2004 after the development completed at the end of 2003, and the radars are installed on the Su-30MK2. The maximum range, average and peak power of Sokol radar remain the same as that of Zhuk-MSE radar on Su-30MKK, but the maximum number of targets it can simultaneously track actually decreased by 40%, from the original 20 to 12. However, the number of targets it can simultaneously engage is increased to six from the original four, thus fully utilizing the capability of the SUV-VEP subsystem of the onboard fire control system. The diameter of the antenna array is increased to 980 mm from the 960 mm of Zhuk-MS/MSE. The scan sector of the radar is 170 degrees and the elevation of the scan is from −40 degrees to +56 degrees. The radar has three receivers and a gain of 37 dB. When used against surface targets like a destroyer, the maximum range is doubled to 300 km, same as that of American AN/APG-68. There is not any confirmation for any follow-on orders of Sokol radar and unlike the capability optronic pod, this radar capability is not known to be added to the earlier Su-30MKKs during the incremental upgrades.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2014
  14. conworldus

    conworldus FULL MEMBER

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    This makes little sense. The Chinese Su-30MKKs belong to the navy and are stationed in mostly in South China sea for anti-ship missions. The Indian MKIs are air superiority fighters. Why would China upgrade the MKK radar to counter the MKIs which are thousands of miles away with completely different roles?

    The Indian news must be confused.
     
  15. BoQ77

    BoQ77 BANNED

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    china made up for their ability of manufacturing domestic aircraft for earning some money fm export. but at last they cannot sell many, like j10, they must donate it to pk, because cannot compete to f16. and potential customer would not accept made in china engines.

    the topic is about the chinese dream of attach something "new" onto an old fashioned Russian made aircraft while not ruin it.
    purchase some more aa missiles onto aircraft and unable to proper firing them. lol

    us and russian made aircrafts proved their endurance and superiority for long time. the quantity for export is huge, similar to Boeing or Airbus in air passenger field.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2014