• Tuesday, December 12, 2017

Panama Case - Post Verdict Discussion and Updates

Discussion in 'Pakistani Siasat' started by Arsalan, Aug 2, 2017.

  1. PakSword

    PakSword SENIOR MEMBER

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    بدنام اگر ہوں گے تو کیا نام نہ ہوگا

    Joke aside, money sometimes do wonders.. and the individual forgets about respect and dignity.


    Sir lagta hai aaj kuppi nahi mili... lolz..

    Agar hudaibiya reopen hogaya... tou phir Bari tind ke saath chhoti tind ka bhi kaam tamaam samjhain..

    And I hope that the first casualty of this movement is Maryam.. because she presented false trust deed, which equals false witness.

    Problem with our nation is that we sometimes prefer money over everything..
     
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  2. El Sidd

    El Sidd ELITE MEMBER

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    Qaum e brownie behas e majmooi khatme nabooyat ki munkir paayi gayi.

    Butt parasti me mubtala qaum per mongol atay hain.

    Wo arahe hain
     
  3. PakSword

    PakSword SENIOR MEMBER

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    This I agree.
     
  4. El Sidd

    El Sidd ELITE MEMBER

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    Selective kuppi ho
     
  5. Shane

    Shane FULL MEMBER

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    So you agree that:

    You can see that the difference between what we are saying is only that I am not sure if the judgement can be made part of the case from the get go or not. If it is made then it shall be a total annihilation instead of a still uphill task for the defendants.

    It all depends on if the case is allowed to be reopened in the first place due to some technicalities.

    I am sure that during this reopening case, NAB prosecutor or the judges themselves will ask the defence as to why the accused did not challenge Justice Khosa's findings or verdict. But only the defendant SS can argue that he was not one of the co-accused in Panama case. However, in their final verdicts, there is no stopping the judges to refer to the unchallenged findings of Justice Khosa's verdict to find that the case should be reopened after all.

    Then, in the trial court, the above posted is going to be an additional rock for the defendants to climb. So you are right on the money about justice khosa's verdict and remarks in the review case, it shall haunt them every step of their legal ladder.

    In sha Allah! But you can see how the choti tind is trying his best to present himself as separate, opposite and better choice than the waddi after their most recent double crossing game plan has failed miserably.
     
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  6. Farah Sohail

    Farah Sohail SENIOR MEMBER

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    I am not sure abt money as far as QAzi Faez Isa is concerned..but he surely is heavily biased in favor of sharif family.. but after all tht sharif family has done...especially after being diaqualified...uske baad jitni buir tarah ye exopse ho chukay hain...badmouthing SC and its judges...uske baad bhi kisi ka inke favor main biased hona...waqayi bhtt susipcious hai...

    When Ejaz Afzal was sympathetic towards sharifs...during initial hearing of panama case..us waqt tak Nawaz sharif itni ziada buri tarah expose nahi hua tha.. obviously they had presented qatari letter and fake trust deed....aur ministers had started giving threatening statements like saad rafiq said hum lohay ke chanay hain chabaye nahi jayein ge...but still us waqt tak Nawaz sharif ne aisi harkatein khud shuru nahi ki theen...

    But JIT ke waqt jab se PML N aur Geo ne ziada propaganda shuru kia tha JIT aur SC ke against.....us waqt se Ejaz Afzal change hona shuru hogaye thay... infact Ejaz Afzal as..head of panama implementation bench countered all sharif family's tactics against JIT......although ke us waqt hum bhtt pareshan hotay thay jab sharif family har doosrey din JIT ke against application detay thay.humein Ejaz Afzal se darr lagaa rehta tha.,.,,.Bilal Rasool aur Amir Aziz ke against bhi application di thee.... aur esp jab Hussain Nawaz ki photo leak hui thee...us waqt tu bhtt ziada pareshan huay thay hum log ke Ejaz Afzal ab JIT ke against koi action na le lein ya remarks na dein but Ejaz Afzal along with other judges didnt let sharif family's tactics succeed against JIT.....agar us waqt SC support na karti JIT ko...Geo news jitna propaganda karrahay thay JIT ke against.aur JIT members ko jitni threats mil rahi thee. ...agar SC ki full support na hoti tu shayad ..JIT members aisa kaam na karsaktay ya resign kar ke chalay jatay.

    So Jis waqt sharifs se sympathetic thay Ejaz Afzal..initially ...us waqt tak ye log itni buri tarah exopse nahi huay thay...aur jab inhon ne apni harkatien shuru ki..Nihal Hashmi ne threats dena shuru ki..us waqt Ejaz Afzal and other judges gave full support to JIT..

    Lekin ab tu sharif family poori tarah expose hi chuki hai..esp after "Mujhe kiun Nikala" campaign by Nawaz Sharif..jitna us ne SC ke judges ko bura bhala kaha hai..threat kiya hai.. Shraifs sayin ke Ye 4-5 log awaam ka faisla nahi badal saktay blah blah....ab tu kisi andhay ko bhi nazar aajaye ke ye kis tarah ke log hain?

    Also..not only Justice Khosa...but in panama review verdict...Ejaz Afzal had written tht how sharifs had placed thier cronies in all state instituitions...and its a unanimous verdict....all judges signed it.. so its an established fact now...

    So ab judges kaisy pooch rahay hain esp Qazi Faez Isa ..ke sharif family kaisy influence karskati thee....reference quash karnay ke liye? When all 5 judges have signed in panama review verdict tht they influenced all state instituitions..

    Sharif family ke har tarah se itni buri tarah expose hojaany ke baad abhi bbi jo judges us se sympathy rakhay ya uske favor main biased ho...unhien pata nahi kiya kaha jaana chahye? Money wala factor tu hum...for sure nahi keh saktay ....kuin ke iss baray main koi valid info nahi humaray pass...but Qazi Faez Isa aur even Justice Dost Muhammad ka IRfan Mangi ko insult karna aur baray baray logon ko chor dena..like Dr Asim aur ab Qazi Faez Isa ka sharif family ke favor main biased hona.....bhtt doubts zuroor create karta hai..
     
    Last edited: Nov 30, 2017
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  7. Farah Sohail

    Farah Sohail SENIOR MEMBER

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    Jaisa main ne kaha ke mujhe lagta hai ke SC se re open tu hojayega eventually... Qazi Faez Isa ke ilaawa bhi 2 judges hain...aur agar baqi 2 judges hudaibya case reopen karnay ki ijaazat denay lagay....phir tu Qazi Faez Isa ke liye bhi bhtt muhskil hojayega dissent karna...pehlay justice Khosa ka detailed verdict regd hudaibya...aur uske baad agar baqi 2 judges bhi ne NAB ki appeal ko accept kar liya tu it would be almost impossible for Qazi Faez Isa to dissent... so it can also be a unanimous verdict too......

    Asal khatra accountability court se hai.. jaisy ke ab panama verdict unanimous hai...lekin basheeray ki harkatein dekh lein.. ye yahan se bach jayein ge.. aisa hi mijhe hudaibya case ke liye lag raha hai ke hudaibya case bhi SC se reopen ho bhi jaye..tu jaisy basheera inhein har tarah relief de raha hai...waisy hi hudaibya case SC se reopen honay ke baad....accountability court aur high courts se relief le lein ge..

    Tu bari tind aur choti tind...dono ke accounatability court se acquit honay ke chances hain..aur shayad baad high courts aur SC se bhi..depending ke kon se judges appeal sunein ge? High courts main sharif family ke bhtt sympathisers hain..

    SC se abhi ka verdict actually itna matter nahi karta...... bari tind aur choti tind ka kaam tamaam dehknay ke liye pata nahi shayad humari saari zindagi guzar jayegi
     
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  8. El Sidd

    El Sidd ELITE MEMBER

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    is this Esa judge an actual judge or just some random gali kay konay wala lachaar chacha

    he has the power to do anything yet he sits there and complain like a squealing animal.

    no one is interested in lectures. give the damn verdict or stop wasting everyones time you fucking old retard
     
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  9. Farah Sohail

    Farah Sohail SENIOR MEMBER

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    Maryam kaisy hoskati hai? Panama case tu guzar gaya... us waqt SC karsakti thee.. ab tu aanay walay cases se ye apply hoga..jab ye bhi movement initiate ki..
    rahi accountability court aur high courts ki baat...wahan se tu waisy hi achi umeed na rakhein.. basheera tu waisy bhi ziada se ziada relief denay ke chakkar main hai...

    Aur ye movement jab bhi start ki....usay streamline honay main kafi time lagay ga..

    Waisy i soo love Justice Khosa for his continuous efforts to improve judicial system..

    Although he is not Chief Justice yet..but he is continuosly making efforts.. pehlay punjab main model courts wala project initiate karaaya... aur ab ye keh rahay hain.. i hope he starts it soon... almost roz har case main ye jhootay witnesses ke against remarks detay thay ke jhooti gawahi se asal mujrim bach jatay hain..ab waqt aagaya hai ke inhein jail bheja jaye.. main yehi sochti thee ke phir inhein kuch karna chahye.....it seems..tht now he has a plan for this too.. i hope ye movement against false witnesses jaldi shuru ho.
    .
    I remember in a speech earlier on criminal justice pilot project ustice Khosa said tht i told CJ Saqib Nisar tht we still have few yrs and we will not go down without a fight.. we will atleast make an effort...
    Oh yes i got the link for vid..where Justice Khosa said tht..



    I think..after criminal justice project.. Justice Khosa is now thinking about movement against false witnesses.. may Allah bless him always.. we have very few ppl like him..
     
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  10. Farah Sohail

    Farah Sohail SENIOR MEMBER

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    This has been answered by Justice Khosa already..

    Read para 128 of Justice Khosa's verdict which I have shared in post 4609


    Hmm..vocal tu yeh bhtt hain ... atleast thankGod tht he is not fhe head of this bench.. Justice Mushir Alam is heading this bench.. i really hope Justice Mushir Alam is not influenced by Qazi Fez Isa but hope he follows Justice khosa's verdict..

    @bold really? Aap ne bhi suna hai..Justice Qazi Faez Isa ke baaray main? Abhi tak tu hum, 2-3 hi profile cases se andaazay lagaa rahay thay Qazi Faiz Isa ke baaray main ....like Dr Asim ECL case, aur ab hudaibya case..aur woh case jis main Irfan Mangi ki insult ki thee ke kiun na..unhein mulzim banaa dein? Hum samajh gaye thay ..ke yQazi Faez Isa ...baatein bari bari kartay hain show karnay ke liye ke corruption ke against hain lekin baray logon ko favor detya hain verdicts main..

    Aap ne ...exactly kia usna hai..inke baaray main? Justice Faez Isa ki overall shuru se yehi reputation hai ke ye technicalities ki basis par accused ko favor kartay hain..esp agar accused influential ho? Iska matlab hum ne bilkol theek socha..inke baaray main? Lekin samajh nahi aata ke phir ye.... .itnay popular kiun hain?
     
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  11. Farah Sohail

    Farah Sohail SENIOR MEMBER

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    I really really hope NAB prosecutor uses Justice Khosa's verdict properly... yes judges must refer to Justice Khosa's unchallenged verdict regarding hudaibya case, in their verdict

    You are right......Justice Khosa initial panama verdict and his para in the review judgment will haunt sharifs for ever.. i soo love Justice Khosa for the sheer pain and torture tht he has given to sharifs thruogh his single verdict.. his verdict will have far reaching effects..

    I wonder..ke jab ye apna panama verdict lihk rahay honge.. did he even realise at tht time..ke unke iss verdict ke kitnay far reaching consequemces honge? Us waqt tu yeh bhi pata nahi tha ke NAB kabhi hudaibya case par appeal karay gi bhi ya nahi? Qamar Zaman Ch ne tu safa manaa kar diya tha..us waqt ke hum appeal nahi karein ge..

    Justice Khosa ko shayad panama verdict likhtay huay khud bhi ehsas nahi hoga..ke unka verdict itni importance ikhtiyar kar lay ga.. ab hudaibya case reopen karaany ke liye Justice Khosa ka verdict sab se ziada important hai..only if NAB is sincere..and intelligently uses it in the cuort proceedings.. agar NAB hi mili hui ho sharif family se...aur Justice Khosa ke verdict ko sahi se utilise hi na karay tu phir tu kuch nahi hosakta...otherwise Justice khosa's verdict on hudaibya is most critical now...

    Also.. i love how Justice Khosa made his initial panama verdict ..part of final/main order by writing thise 3-4 lines in review judgment and no judge disagreed with him......he played a master stroke by saying tht since no body challenged it...so no need for review..and by this..he made his initial minority verdict...part of main judgment...which nobody ever challenged..he really played a master stroke.. sahi se phansaya hai sharif family ko.. aur jo kasar reh gayi thee..woh unhon ne tab poori kar di.....jab hudaibya case bench se recuse kartay huay unhon ne apnay hudaibya case par remarks repeat kar diye aur sab ko dobara yaad dilaa diye ...aur ye bhi kaha ke atleast Ishaq Dar ki hadd tak tu main faisla de chuka hoon..jis ke baad NAB ne Ishaq Dar ka case tu already re open kar hi diya hai..
    woh bench se jaatay jaatay bhi sharif family ko phansaa gaye apnay remarks sab ko dobara yaad dilaa kar....ke doosray judges ke liye bhtt muhskil hogaya..ab unke verdict ko reject karna...aur Ishaq Dar ka case tu already re open ho hi gaya..
     
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  12. Shane

    Shane FULL MEMBER

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    AlhamduliAllah in the case of Ishaq Dar and DQ and for all the cases in general, soon in sha Allah.
     
  13. Farah Sohail

    Farah Sohail SENIOR MEMBER

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    Oh No.. nothing like tht.. where did u get this idea from? infact i eagerly look forwards to your posts and info..

    Just tht i am not at all hopeful about our legal system, and i find it impossible tht sharifs can be convicted in money laundering ...More than their political downfall..i want sharifs to be legally convicted, and punished which i know is almost impossible :( esp with ppl like basheera in accuontability courts and sharif family's sympathisers in high courts and even some in SC........ this is the reason of my hopelessness...

    Waisy....do u have any idea/info about Justice Mushir Alam and Justice Mazhar Alam Miankhel? Inki reputation kaisi hai?
     
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  14. Realistic Change

    Realistic Change FULL MEMBER

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    I'll let you decide :) .....am not too sure as I have conflicting info from different sources, however, someone sent an older item involving J Mazhar Alam, other than he being the Judge who ordered freezing of Musharraf's assets as well as grilled prosecutor re the circumstances that allowed him to flee by asking to furnish docs pertaining to the arrangement that made his fleeing possible:

    The Supreme Court has been asked to constitute a seven-member bench for hearing a criminal appeal against Prime Minister Mian Nawaz Sharif like it had done in the contempt case that ousted ex-premier Yusuf Raza Gillani.
    The apex Court was candidly cautioned about the alleged influence of the Prime Minister and, in particular, his “covert political connections” with some Judges. “He managed to install a former Judge as the President of Pakistan. Thereafter, in 2008, he nominated the former Chief Justice of Pakistan as his Party’s Presidential Candidate”, the application pointed out.
    The contempt petition against the Prime Minister was dismissed by Peshawar High Court a month ago and the petitioner was penalized by 24-hours in prison for his contemptuous assertions against its Chief Justice, Mazhar Alam Khan Miankhel.
    In routine, the criminal appeal is to be heard by a bench of three Judges but the appellant emphasized it was “intricately and inseparably linked to the murder” of his brother in 1997. The appellant also pointed a finger at the alleged pressure on the judges and cited a case wherein the former Chief Justice of Lahore High Court had to tender his resignation after the Supreme Court over ruled his judgment in the SGS Cotecna Case against late Prime Minister Benazir Bhutto. Audio tapes were run in the apex Court to expose the pressure exerted by the Prime Minister’s Secretariat on two Judges.
    The Court was asked to recall and remember the manner in which Nawaz Sharif had forcibly interrupted contempt proceedings against him in November 1997 by organizing an attack on the Court. “The end objective of the Appeal is not to remove a Prime Minister or sentence him to six months simple imprisonment”, stated the appellant adding that he mainly sought confirmation of the facts noted by the Supreme Court in 1999 about his brother’s murder. The Application stated that no Judge “who passed any order adverse to the prosecution of the said murder” may be included the bench. – Pak Destiny

    The Supreme Court of Pakistan

    (Appellate Jurisdiction)

    Cr. Misc. Application ____________/2015

    In Cr. Appeal No. 26/2015

    In COC. P. No. 313-P of 2014 in Cr. R. 87/2013

    Shahid Orakzai Vs Mohammad Nawaz Sharif &

    Mazhar Alam Khan Miankhel

    Application under Order XI of the S. C. Rules

    for constituting larger bench

    Applicant: Shahid Orakzai,

    1. This application for constituting a larger bench of Seven Judges may kindly be put before the Court so that the appellant can explain the necessity and priority. (See Para 5 below)

    2. That Respondent No. 1 is the Prime Minister and this Court, in 2012, had constituted a bench of Seven Judges for contempt proceedings instituted against the then Prime Minister, Yusuf Raza Gillani.

    3. The Cr. Appeal does not seek similar proceedings against the incumbent Prime Minister and the decision, thus, cannot disqualify the Prime Minister.

    4. The alleged contempt, in fact, has been committed against Peshawar High Court which is still to give its final verdict under the law, i.e.; u/s 19 of the Contempt of Court Ordinance, 2003.

    5. To ensure impartial proceedings, this Court needs to check the political influence and back stage manipulation of Respondent No. 1 and may take note of the following:

    a. The respondent has, in the past, maintained covert political connections with some Judges. He involves them in politics by offering political offices.

    Example: He managed to install a former Judge as the President of Pakistan. Thereafter, in 2008, he nominated the former Chief Justice of Pakistan as his Party’s Presidential Candidate.

    b. The respondent has, in the past, also pressurized the judges even at the High Courts.

    Example: The former Chief Justice LHC had to tender resignation following the Supreme Court Judgment in the SGS Cotecna Case against Benazir Bhutto.

    c. The respondent has, in Nov. 1997, forcibly interrupted contempt proceedings against him by a 5-member Bench headed by the Chief Justice of Pakistan and did so by organizing an attack on the Court. PLD SC 2000, page 1969

    d. For the past 17-years, the respondent has effectively obstructed the process of law and, regardless of executive power, managed to resist the directions of this Court given with regard to the prosecution of the murder of Major (R) Khalid Saeed Orakzai. PLD SCMR 1999, page 48

    6. That in view of the above stated facts, as reported in the Judgments, the applicant shall explain the Supreme Court’s duty to do “complete justice”, procedurally, under Article 187.

    7. The Criminal Appeal is intricately and inseparably linked to the murder case and seeks to establish the facts impartially noted by the Supreme Court in1999. The end objective of the Appeal is not to remove a Prime Minister or sentence him to six months simple imprisonment.

    The Chief Justice of Pakistan may kindly, considerately and appropriately ensure that no Judge who passed any order adverse to the prosecution of the said murder is included the bench. This Court shall ensure that the Cr. Appeal is ruled independently of any extraneous influence.

    Remedy Required:

    This Court may, therefore, request the Chief Justice of Pakistan to constitute a 7-member larger bench.

    And in case you @Farah Sohail wondering what this case was it was related to Horse Trading deal of 1993 elections in which Shahid Orakzai’s brother voted for Nawaz by accepting 10.5 million but due to dispute he eventually got murdered.

    Remember where this halal money was pouring from against BB? The famous or infamous guy who funded Nawaz heavily in 1993 to overthrow PPP. Rings a bell?

    https://www.thenews.com.pk/archive/...rds-24-hour-prison-sentence-to-shahid-orakzai
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2017
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  15. Farah Sohail

    Farah Sohail SENIOR MEMBER

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    :rolleyes::rolleyes: