What's new

Featured Pakistan wants to be treated like an ally, not a scapegoat - Washington Post

Adecypher

FULL MEMBER
Dec 17, 2014
1,834
1
1,801
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
Can someone please list the long term common interests of Pakistan and US…plz keeping China’s Belt and Road initiative and it expanding hegemony in the region as well as Russia’s connectivity to Pakistan - China good relationship …

I mean I can list plethora of articles and think tank analyses of how to counter China as a threat in future from US perspective …
 

Sainthood 101

BANNED
Jul 24, 2021
2,091
-2
2,150
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
As a diplomatic mission

What can be our pitch to the US?, We realize India is more important to thier plans and we can't have equal relationship

But at the same time we want a balance between US and China (as much as possible that doesn't impact our core national intrests) and not necessarily play with this camp s***

What's the incentive for the US to keep a good relationship with Pakistan independent of India (knowing India will do anything in thier power to hurt Pakistan intrests through US)

Cause India will push them in anti- Pak direction and they will go in that direction if we leave the field open

So as Pakistan I don't necessarily want an equal relationship to India, but I do want US to not go completely anti-Pak, want good relationship with them

What are we offering em?, Why should they listen to us?
 

insight-out

FULL MEMBER
Sep 16, 2009
832
1
1,200
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
This is international geopolitics, not a court of law, so your analogy is simply inapplicable.
The US sits in judgment of everyone else through its lists, pronouncements, and sanctions, implying it's own moral superiority, much like a judge in a court of law. So the analogy holds.

That said, I do not expect the US to change its policies towards Pakistan, not for any price that Pakistan would be willing to pay.

So the answer to your original question is "nothing". Pakistan can offer nothing that could sway US policies in its favor. Both the US and Pakistan have already chosen their alliances in the region, and that's not about to change anytime soon.
 

Vapnope

SENIOR MEMBER
Nov 11, 2015
5,126
15
8,961
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
You keep asking for something in return. What would the US like in return? Enlighten us.
There would be a long list of demands from US and i can assure you even then, US would not be an ally like China.

Hint: Pakistan helped US in 1971 to have talks with China secretly but abandoned Pakistan against Indian terror despite knowing all facts.

Firstly, they would want to use us like a proxy against China and would abandon us just like they did with Kurds.
Secondly, they would want us to give up our nukes so that it would be easier for them to tackle us if we don't follow their commands.
Thirdly, start hostilities with Iran and help US tackle Iranian issue as well.
 

PradoTLC

SENIOR MEMBER
Mar 17, 2007
5,188
1
5,813
Country
Pakistan
Location
United Arab Emirates
Opinion: Pakistan wants to be treated like an ally, not a scapegoat

View attachment 773051
Pakistani Prime Minister Imran Khan speaks during a news conference in Kabul in November 2020. (Rahmat Gul/AP)

Opinion by Josh Rogin
Columnist
Today at 9:37 a.m. EDT

As the world begins to process the implications of the Taliban’s takeover of Afghanistan, lots of people in Washington are pointing fingers at Pakistan, a major non-NATO ally that hasn’t been seen as an ally for a long time. But the world is changing fast, and the United States and Pakistan each have a clear interest in moving past their problems and working together, the country’s national security adviser told me in an interview.

To the extent that Pakistan is mentioned in U.S. media coverage of the Afghanistan crisis, it is mostly indicted for its alleged support of the Taliban over the years. Now that the Taliban has taken power, Washington experts are once again accusing Pakistan of complicity with the jihadists and calling for punishments, such as cutting off assistance or imposing sanctions on the government. But in Islamabad, the civilian leadership is not celebrating the Taliban victory. Instead it is trying to manage the coming fallout.

Afghan instability could lead to more terrorism, refugees and economic hardship for Pakistan, Prime Minister Imran Khan’s national security adviser, Moeed Yusuf, said in a phone interview. The United States and Pakistan have a shared interest in working together in Afghanistan, he said, but that will require fixing the bilateral relationship.

“Right now, in the situation we are in, how are U.S. and Pakistan’s interests not aligned?” he said. “I’m not asking for any sympathy for Pakistan. I’m thinking in terms of pure U.S. selfish national interests. How does it help to push away a country of this size, stature and power?”

U.S. intelligence agencies believe that elements of the Pakistani military and intelligence system have supported the Taliban for years, a charge the civilian leadership denies. According to Human Rights Watch, this support has included funding, diplomatic support, recruiting and training of Taliban fighters, providing the Taliban arms and even direct combat support.

Pakistan perennially stands accused of providing havens for the Taliban on its side of the border. Pakistani officials point out that tens of thousands of Pakistani soldiers have died fighting extremists in their own country since 9/11.

“Pakistan is the victim. We had nothing to do with 9/11. … We teamed up with the U.S. to fight back … and after that there is a major backlash on Pakistan,” Yusuf said. “But let’s let all that pass. We need to work out how to move forward as partners, because neither side can do without the other in terms of stability in the region.”

The U.S.-supported government in Kabul used Pakistan as a scapegoat to excuse its own ineptitude, corruptions and unpopularity, Yusuf said. Pakistan helped bring the Taliban to the negotiating table at Washington’s request, got cut out of the negotiations and is now being blamed for the outcome.

“Did Pakistan tell the Afghan National Army not to fight? Did Pakistan tell Ashraf Ghani to run away?” he said. “The entire state collapsed in a week. So somebody was lying, somebody was misreporting, or somebody was mistaken about the reality and when it came to informing the taxpayers of the Western world.”

From the statement Khan’s government put out last week about the Taliban takeover it becomes apparent there is actually significant overlap with the Biden administration’s policy goals. Pakistan is calling for the Taliban to work with other ethnic groups toward a political settlement to establish an inclusive government in Kabul. Pakistan has urged the Taliban to respect international law and human rights. Islamabad agrees with Biden that withdrawing all U.S. troops was the right decision.

“Continuation of foreign military presence for a longer duration now would not have yielded a different outcome," the statement said.

Pakistan also wants the United States to increase its diplomatic and economic involvement in Afghanistan and to find a way forward to engage diplomatically with the Taliban. The United States should not isolate Afghanistan to punish its new rulers, Yusuf said.

“Now that the Taliban has the whole country, they don’t really need Islamabad as much anymore,” he said. “Assistance and recognition is the leverage. Who has that? It’s the Western countries that have much more leverage in Afghanistan than Pakistan.”

Former U.S. ambassador to Afghanistan and Pakistan Ryan Crocker wrote last week in the New York Times that the United States made a mistake by disengaging with Pakistan in the 1990s and would be repeating that mistake by turning away from Islamabad now.

“We need to be engaged with Pakistan on ways to assess and deal with this enhanced threat,” wrote Crocker. “The prospect of violent destabilization of a country with about 210 million people and nuclear weapons is not a pretty one.”

The U.S.-Pakistan relationship can’t be just about Afghanistan, Yusuf told me; the two countries share a much broader range of interests. But first, the United States must learn the lessons of the 1990s, when it abandoned Afghanistan. Otherwise it can expect a similar outcome.

“If a security vacuum is left in Afghanistan by abandoning it, you will see that these terrorist organizations take root again. Let’s not kid ourselves,” Yusuf said.

Given Biden’s haphazard withdrawal from Afghanistan and the Taliban takeover, the United States has little alternative but to seriously consider Pakistan’s offer of cooperation. Sure, it might not work, but it’s worth a shot. Meanwhile, Washington and Islamabad might find a path back to being true allies. That still makes strategic sense for both countries, perhaps now more than ever.





too late..

the strategic paradim has changed. Pakistan doesnt really need or care about US. This is just optics.

The real daddies are now Russia , China and Turkey.
 

IceCold

PDF VETERAN
May 1, 2007
17,069
8
20,520
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
But what can it offer in return to make such treatment possible?
Actually everything, something you missed in the article, US wants to make sure Afghanistan does not become a safe heaven for terrorists while Pakistan wants to ensure that Afghanistan remains peaceful in return keeping our borders safe. A civil war is the last thing we want and can support US to increase its efforts in engaging the Taliban. But the real question is if the US actually wants it at all?
By the looks of it Biden administration is not interested, well so be it but than stop blaming us.
 

PurpleButcher

FULL MEMBER
Oct 31, 2008
1,213
2
2,366
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
That is what Pakistan would like, sure. What can it offer in return to help make it possible?
Access to aghanistan's rare earth minerals. Lets US also make money from a peaceful Afghanistan. Ask Us to invest in Af-Pak economy and not let Pakistan fall completely into China camp.

USA can spend some money on roads, rails, dams and power grids and elon musk would be very happy in making lots of "LITHIUM" batteries instead of some chinese rival.

Pakistan needs to sell its strategic position for global economic interests to WEST to EAST to Everyone!
 

Dalit

ELITE MEMBER
Mar 16, 2012
14,904
-16
28,002
Country
Pakistan
Location
Netherlands
Access to aghanistan's rare earth minerals. Lets US also make money from a peaceful Afghanistan. Ask Us to invest in Af-Pak economy and not let Pakistan fall completely into China camp.

USA can spend some money on roads, rails, dams and power grids and elon musk would be very happy in making lots of "LITHIUM" batteries instead of some chinese rival.

Pakistan needs to sell its strategic position for global economic interests to WEST to EAST to Everyone!
We already do that. The West views China and Chinese ventures with suspicion. The West also views Pakistan unfavorable, but favors Hindustan.

There won't be any successful cooperation between Pakistan and the US/West. The West has invested very heavily in their anti-China campaign over the years. Even Afghanistan was meant to be a piece of the China containment puzzle. I can assure you that China and Pakistan are today the most relieved nations after US/NATO and Indian withdrawal.

You have to understand that the Western powers are extremely paranoid when it comes to China. Their paranoia is comparable to USSR anti-Communist era.

There is only one right way to fix the problem. China, Pakistan, Russia and Iran must unify and fix Afghanistan. Everything else is noise and meaningless rhetoric.
 
Last edited:

Goritoes

SENIOR MEMBER
Jan 20, 2021
2,571
0
3,901
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
That's great. But what can it offer in return to make such treatment possible? That is the key question.
What America is looking for from Pakistan? Do they want bhutto ? we have a spare Zardari and Qaim Ali Shah, we are willing to give them to Washington, just give 2 bags of screws and nuts for F-16.
 

AsifIjaz

FULL MEMBER
May 22, 2014
962
3
999
Country
Pakistan
Location
Qatar
The possibility of a sane approach from the US for a somewhat limited to a few point-specific collaborations with Pakistan is almost impossible in the presence of Indian and Israeli lobby and influence.
There are too many foes or too many voices against Pakistan. Like over the last 2 decades there were too many voices against leaving Afghanistan with them propagating against such a move. A few people including Mullen have now accepted their mistake to stay in Afghanistan for this long. Moeed Yousuf has done a splendid job and the military and bureaucracy need to keep singing the same tune. Things could have been relatively easier if we had continued with the lobbies hired in the Musharaf era and our civil leadership would have persistently campaigned for a national cause.
 

VCheng

ELITE MEMBER
Sep 29, 2010
42,169
55
35,579
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
The US sits in judgment of everyone else through its lists, pronouncements, and sanctions, implying it's own moral superiority, much like a judge in a court of law. So the analogy holds.
LOL, absolutely not, and never. USA only pursues its national interests, now and always, that is all.

So the answer to your original question is "nothing". Pakistan can offer nothing that could sway US policies in its favor. Both the US and Pakistan have already chosen their alliances in the region, and that's not about to change anytime soon.
In other words, both nations will follow their own respective national interests, just as they should, by sovereign rights.
Actually everything, something you missed in the article, US wants to make sure Afghanistan does not become a safe heaven for terrorists while Pakistan wants to ensure that Afghanistan remains peaceful in return keeping our borders safe. A civil war is the last thing we want and can support US to increase its efforts in engaging the Taliban. But the real question is if the US actually wants it at all?
By the looks of it Biden administration is not interested, well so be it but than stop blaming us.
Please see the above.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 1, Members: 0, Guests: 1)


Top Bottom