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Pakistan officially inducts HQ 9 Air Defence system

MH.Yang

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Many people wonder why China buys S400. China ordered S400 from Russia in 2013.
In 2012, Japan's Anti China far right government came to power, and the possibility of air war between China and Japan in the East China Sea increased significantly.
In 2012, two US aircraft carrier fleets entered the South China Sea.
DF21 has not stabled in 2012 and DF17 has not appeared.
In 2012, J20 has not been put into service, J11 has not been mass produced, and J16 has not made its first flight.
In 2012, China has not built an airport in the South China Sea, and there is no Beidou navigation global network.
China began to expand its navy on a large scale only in 2016. In 2012, the Chinese navy was not as good as the Japanese Navy.

So the question should not be why China should buy S400. The question should be why Russia delivered so late.
 
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MH.Yang

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In fact, Pakistan's biggest advant HQ9P is that Pakistan's army air defense system can fully connect with China's air defense system. If necessary, Pakistan can obtain China's resource support through HQ9P.
 

arjunk

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That's a wrong assumption. Long range high altitude SAMs require short/medium range SAMs to complement them and provide them security from small and low flying threats. You wouldn't see S400 as a standalone system in Russia it would always be accompanied by Tor or Pantsir or probably both along with S300.
Well yeah, this is ignoring the clusters of SA-3s along the border.
 

mudas777

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What would you attack on the land with it that you cannot target with a BM or a cruise missile?
Qubsa Mafia I guess. There have to be some novel ways to retrieve the plots of lands from the mafias if your local police SHO is not helping lol. 😁.
Its like smart phones keep on adding more apps and some gullible will fall in love with some facility which is never going to get used and forget about the main features of the phone.
Its meant to be an air defence system but here and there giving a wake up call to the nearest Indian air base traffic controller won't hurt if they are running late and don't switch on their radars.
HQ 9 is a potent system lets focus on what it is designed for and it full fills PA needs.
 

AR KHAN

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I think it's evolving thanks to greater tri-services integration (e.g., Project Vision and RAMP, Space Command, etc). So, the tri-services could be building towards common goals, but can be responsible for domains they're best equipped to handle. With its investments in air defence over the years, it seems the Army is confident it can support the HQ-9. In fact, this sets the precedent for the Navy to also induct a long-range SAM down the line for its surface ships.

The alternative is that the tri-services have revised the coverages they're responsible for ... e.g., maybe the Army and Navy can go up to 150 km range and 60,000 ft altitude, but the Air Force owns everything above that plus stuff like BMDs, satellites, etc. So, the PAF is becoming more of an 'Air and Space Force'.
Times and battles have evolved. Airforce cannot provide coverage to the field formation and to all of the front and rear at the same time. It is next to impossible. Though PAF historically had superior Sam's in the past, but they were only to protect their own heavily priced bases/assets rather than the land forces ( which only had point defense capacity of their own). Though it is the PAFs responsibility to protect the country's air, but this very role of protecting the battle formations against enemy's missiles ( of all types and forms) and other aerial threats lies with respective forces. PAF will never be able to fill that role. It will require them to attach/deploy/coordinate their own personal and assets with other forces. Which will only create a mess both interms of operational and in command domain.
The PAF only have the complete air picture of PKs airspace(i.e. what's, where and who's in the air). It coordinates with the relevant forces (Land, Sea or Air) and provide them with the relevant information/threat.
These Sam systems with land and sea will be an addition to the information inflow (become additional eyes for the Airforce) and enhance the air picture of our airspace. And at the same time be able to neutralize the eminent /immediate threat.
Likewise the defense against the ballistic missiles will also be Army's & Navy's responsibility and not of the Airforce.
 

waz

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I like how everyone forgets the fact that we’ve had our HIMADS in service since late 2018 and now have 4 regiments will nearly full coverage of our border as well as more regiments on the way to not only cover the entire border but to overlap in sensitive areas.

Meanwhile india won’t have S400 in full operation anytime before 2024, yet they’ve been acting like they’ve had it for a decade now. That means for over half a decade, there’s a serious gap in Indian AD, one which won’t be plugged soon. We have the advantage.

That’s the difference between the two forces. One barks, the other bites.

You also forget that india is several times bigger than Pakistan and that they have the Chinese border to cover, we have no such issue. With our geography the HQ-9P will work just as well as S400.
Ah bro to some of our kin you have to tell them many times.
Here let me do it in pictures.


JY-27A, range 500km (yes you read that right).

1635028853564.png



Will talk to this, ZDK-03, range 400km.


1635029092054.png


They will both talk to this, and it will decide;

1635029492338.png


Before sending lots of these;

RKgl1in.gif



1635029675453.png
 

AZADPAKISTAN2009

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Khalistan Referendum is more worrisome for India :coffee:

HQ9 is just Teeka on buttocks

If they stand up , Sikh Community will beat them down
If they Sit , the HQ9 will sting for sure
 

khanasifm

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The most basic formation of a HQ-9 batteries consisted of one Type 305B search radar, one tracking radar, one 200 kW Diesel generator truck, and eight Transporter erector launchers (TELs) each with 4 missiles, totaling 32 rounds ready to fire.
This basic formation can be expanded into more capable larger formation, with the addition of the following equipment: one TWS-312 command post, one site survey vehicle based on Chinese Humvee, one main power grid converter, additional transporter / loader vehicles with each vehicle housing four missile TELs based on Tai'an TAS5380,

one Type 120 low altitude search radar,

one Type 305A AESA search radar for full anti ballistic missile capability, and a passive radar against stealth targets.

The HQ-9B with a longer range and extra seeker achieved initial operational capacity in 2014. It is a new vertical launch, ground-to-air missile defence system with a target range of more than 250km and up to an altitude of 50km. (165k feet)

 
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ozranger

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Many people wonder why China buys S400. China ordered S400 from Russia in 2013.
In 2012, Japan's Anti China far right government came to power, and the possibility of air war between China and Japan in the East China Sea increased significantly.
In 2012, two US aircraft carrier fleets entered the South China Sea.
DF21 has not stabled in 2012 and DF17 has not appeared.
In 2012, J20 has not been put into service, J11 has not been mass produced, and J16 has not made its first flight.
In 2012, China has not built an airport in the South China Sea, and there is no Beidou navigation global network.
China began to expand its navy on a large scale only in 2016. In 2012, the Chinese navy was not as good as the Japanese Navy.

So the question should not be why China should buy S400. The question should be why Russia delivered so late.
Some sources indicated China used S-400 radar and EW suite mostly for upgrading the existing but also outdated S-300PMU and S-300PMU2 systems as they are fully compatible.

China didn't get the 400km range 40N6E missiles when they started operating their S-400 systems as Russia couldn't finish the development on time. Not quite sure about it now but it looks to me China is not that obsessed with 40N6E and the so called 400km range.
 

CHI RULES

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Some sources indicated China used S-400 radar and EW suite mostly for upgrading the existing but also outdated S-300PMU and S-300PMU2 systems as they are fully compatible.

China didn't get the 400km range 40N6E missiles when they started operating their S-400 systems as Russia couldn't finish the development on time. Not quite sure about it now but it looks to me China is not that obsessed with 40N6E and the so called 400km range.
Even considering past Russian supplies the export version S400 missiles may have lesser range comparing to which are installed domestically by Russia for any foreign country whether it is China or India.
 

vi-va

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Some sources indicated China used S-400 radar and EW suite mostly for upgrading the existing but also outdated S-300PMU and S-300PMU2 systems as they are fully compatible.

China didn't get the 400km range 40N6E missiles when they started operating their S-400 systems as Russia couldn't finish the development on time. Not quite sure about it now but it looks to me China is not that obsessed with 40N6E and the so called 400km range.
S400 never has 400 km range with 40N6E. The actual range is much shorter.

Range is highly affected by the target height, speed, direction, maneuverability, RCS, electronic warfare.

So HQ-9 only mentioned 265km slant distance. The max range of QH-9 is much longer. HQ-9 can hit 400 km easily, but it's meaningless because the momentum is not enough to catch the jet.

1635066837986.png
 

redtom

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S400 never has 400 km range with 40N6E. The actual range is much shorter.

Range is highly affected by the target height, speed, direction, maneuverability, RCS, electronic warfare.

So HQ-9 only mentioned 265km slant distance. The max range of QH-9 is much longer. HQ-9 can hit 400 km easily, but it's meaningless because the momentum is not enough to catch the jet.

View attachment 787281
The next generation of rocket propulsion will be unveiled in a few years. I got this information while reading about PL15 and meteors. The new technology would increase the range of existing rocket-powered missiles by up to 300% and achieve extremely high terminal speeds.
 

LeGenD

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S400 never has 400 km range with 40N6E. The actual range is much shorter.

Range is highly affected by the target height, speed, direction, maneuverability, RCS, electronic warfare.

So HQ-9 only mentioned 265km slant distance. The max range of QH-9 is much longer. HQ-9 can hit 400 km easily, but it's meaningless because the momentum is not enough to catch the jet.

View attachment 787281
The 40N6 (or 40H6M to be precise) is noticeably bigger interceptor.

HQ-9 interceptor is comparable in size to 48H6E2 interceptor.

Russian interceptors are compared in terms of size in following link:


The TEL of S-400 system can accomodate 2 x 40H6M interceptors or 4 x 48H6E2 type interceptors.

40H6M can engage large aircraft such as AEW&C around 380 KM mark.

HQ-9 interceptor can do the same around 250 KM mark*.

Target characteristics such as dimensions, speed, direction, maneuverability, RCS, Electronic Warfare (EW) capabilities will collectively affect 'range' as you correctly pointed out.

*This range is beyond the capacity of the HT-233 dedicated FCR for the system. HQ-9 is compatible with different types of Chinese radar systems to address this limitation. IMAD is helpful.

However;

The 961NE dedicated FCR of S-400 can detect and track targets at a much greater range than the HT-233 dedicated FCR of HQ-9. This distinction is helpful in standalone situations and/or in degraded IMAD situations.
 

waz

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Ah bro to some of our kin you have to tell them many times.
Here let me do it in pictures.


JY-27A, range 500km (yes you read that right).

View attachment 787203


Will talk to this, ZDK-03, range 400km.


View attachment 787205

They will both talk to this, and it will decide;

View attachment 787206

Before sending lots of these;

View attachment 787207


View attachment 787208
I don't think many of the brothers realise is just how many assets the HQ-9P will be working with. Do remember much of the AD network is Chinese so there'll be great interconnectivity and multiple radars monitoring threats that haven't even reached the border yet.
This awesome piece of tech is the key here, which will make the HQ-9P even more potent.

1635077587880.png

1635077665711.png



At 500km what happens in India will be known to us fast.


It's already made headlines.

Intriguingly, the Chinese government claimed that while under development in Shandong it was able to track American F-22 Raptors flying over South Korea.



A Chinese-made type JY-27 radar deployed by Venezuelan Air Defense detected a United States F22 stealth aircraft as it approached the country’s airspace and sent a warning to the American fighter jet on Tuesday.

According to Avia Pro website, following the incident the Venezuelan army issued a warning to the US Air Force on May 12 that it was ready to fire without warning at any American aircraft if it tried to violate the country’s airspace.


 
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