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Pakistan First ! The case for Pakistani Nationalism.

Baibars_1260

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Wow ! 👏👏👍👍
spot on...
Videos are awesome. These should be shown repeatedly on national television, and in theaters before the start of the main movie.
It was high time somebody spelt out our linguistic and cultural identity so clearly.

Which makes the case for moving on from Urdu and snapping our linguistic affinity with our eastern neighbor. We can develop a national language, either Saraiki or going back to simple Farsi.
The Ghurid Khorasan boundaries need to be rejuvenated by a Federation or a Commonwealth of Indo-Iranic states.
Full open boundaries with Afghanistan like a Canada USA border.
Full open boundaries with Iran,

Complete people to people contact.
 

Salik

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There were non-Muslims (Jews) who fought in the army of Hazrat Muhammad sallalahu alayhi wassalam in battle of Uhud. They were never called shaheed when they died. I don't think you understand the concept of "shaheed." Only a Muslim can be one.
There were no Jews in the battle of Uhud in Muslims side.

Apart from that, non-Muslims have the right to own and Islam respects that right. If a non-Muslim is killed while protecting his lawful belongings he is shaheed although not in his consciousness, he will be rewarded for this act.

A non-Muslim will be rewarded for all the good deeds and compensated for all the losses.

On topic: Muslims and Jews were living together in Madina showing that Muslims and non-Muslims could live together in any part of the world. Islam does not demand separate state for Muslims exclusively based on two nations theory.

Jinnah sahib was advocate of Hindu-Muslim unity. That was the original Islamic stance. He was forced to leave that stance and Pakistan was forced to be made.

Now Pakistan should use it's leverage and talk about conditions of minorities in India because Muslims are/were not the only minority in India. And that would be the continuation of Jinnah's mission.

Secondly, Islam believes in independent administrative units. Companions of the prophet peace be upon them were appointed as governors of different cities and were authorized to take decisions on their own if there was no solution in the books.

With that there is saying of prophet Muhammad peace be upon him:

كلكم راع وكلكم مسؤول عن رعيته​

All of you are shepherds and you are responsible for your sheep.
(Sahiḥ al-Bukhari. 7138)


Why Islam did not have the same effect on sub continent cultures? Why did we not get a chance to become top dog? Or get our moment in the sun and shine? During the periods of Islamic golden age, 6th century to 17th century, the Persians, Arabs, Turks contributed enormously to human intellect. They revived philosophy, science and arts - even the non Muslims agree that Islam ended the European dark ages (primarily due to Almighty's assistance in: Iqra bismi rabikalazi khalaq). During this period, when Islam was ruling the sub-continent also (7th century to 17th century) what contribution did the folks in the sub continent provide to the human intellect. Why were we not as successful as the Turks, Persians and Arabs?
The region of the Indian subcontinent is destined to be used for different purpose. It's tone is low and calm. There's no extravaganza. Even in the golden age of the subcontinent there were no big infrastructures like the pyramids of Egypt, focus of the people was somewhere else.

We see the scholars of Islam leave extravaganza in last few years of their life and focus somewhere else.

Pakistan should look to the west and go for extravaganza, but in balance. Balance opens the doors of irrational knowledge and a person is selected that miracles occur on his hands.
 

ThunderCat

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Which makes the case for moving on from Urdu and snapping our linguistic affinity with our eastern neighbor. We can develop a national language, either Saraiki or going back to simple Farsi.
The Ghurid Khorasan boundaries need to be rejuvenated by a Federation or a Commonwealth of Indo-Iranic states.
Full open boundaries with Afghanistan like a Canada USA border.
Full open boundaries with Iran,

Complete people to people contact.
I don't understand why Pakistani affiliate what is today called "urdu" with India. For one it doesn't sound like an Indian language at all, aside from the name appearing from a poet native today's Northern India. Most serious academia, including the Indian side claim it originated in Lahore.

I notice while Indians (or specifically the chuvanistic ones) have more of a tendency appropriate while Pakistanis have more of a tendency to reject.

I am happy and proud of our national language. As a neutral non-ethnic language, it can give us an equal inter-communication and has a very nice sound to it. My only objection to it is the name "urdu" a word from a foreign unrelated Turkic language as the name for an Indo-Aryan language.
 

magra

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I don't understand why Pakistani affiliate what is today called "urdu" with India. For one it doesn't sound like an Indian language at all, aside from the name appearing from a poet native today's Northern India. Most serious academia, including the Indian side claim it originated in Lahore.

I notice while Indians (or specifically the chuvanistic ones) have more of a tendency appropriate while Pakistanis have more of a tendency to reject.

I am happy and proud of our national language. As a neutral non-ethnic language, it can give us an equal inter-communication and has a very nice sound to it. My only objection to it is the name "urdu" a word from a foreign unrelated Turkic language as the name for an Indo-Aryan language.
So @Baibars_1260 , looks like you guys will continue to talk in Urdu and thus the linguistic connection with India will continue
 

Baibars_1260

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So @Baibars_1260 , looks like you guys will continue to talk in Urdu and thus the linguistic connection with India will continue
I loose... :-) unless hopefully India adopts Sanskrit as a national and link language.
See this link.

Then Pakistan as a nation is linguistically defined and so is India.
 

Pan-Islamic-Pakistan

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Salam, did you make this brother?

It is a great video, however I do not think the bit about religion is unrealistic. Pakistan is one of the most conservative Islamic nations in the world, and pretty homogeneous as 97% of the society is Muslim.

We have to work to bring in all the Islamic firqe together. Out focus should be religious and cultural cohesion. I do like the linguistic and racial stuff in the video. Thanks for sharing.
 

magra

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I loose... :-) unless hopefully India adopts Sanskrit as a national and link language.
See this link.

Then Pakistan as a nation is linguistically defined and so is India.
Sanskrit is on ventilators and being artificially kept alive. Most Indians cant understand or speak it.
They just rote learn it in bhajans and mantras.
It is just like people reciting Quran in Arabic without understanding.
 

Baibars_1260

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Sanskrit is on ventilators and being artificially kept alive. Most Indians cant understand or speak it.
They just rote learn it in bhajans and mantras.
It is just like people reciting Quran in Arabic without understanding.
You might be interested in
this thread that started a few months earlier.

Go through it and let us know what you think..

 

magra

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You might be interested in
this thread that started a few months earlier.

Go through it and let us know what you think..

How old are you? You have visited India too? Which cities have you been to?
 

leonblack08

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Pakistani nationalism does not imply one has to let go of the very foundation the country was formed on. That is Islam. And to date probably still the only country in the world to have that honor. This should be a matter of pride and honor. This should be the driving force to take your country forward. It does not imply Pakistan has to be a loyal servant to other Muslim countries. If in the past Pakistan has been doing that- that is on the incompetency of the foreign policy.

Going through the thread, all I can see is a nefarious agenda being openly propagated by some individuals to "secularize" Pakistan in the veil of catchy slogans like "Pakistan First". Seems attractive now, but it will have its impact on society decades down the line. The "usual suspects" are also quite active to vilify other Muslim countries and on a mission to isolate Pakistan from the Muslim world.

Only one country will benefit from that, and that is not Pakistan.
 

Khan vilatey

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We are Pakistan's First ....

It is necessary now as never before to emphasize our identity.

We are Pakistanis, dwellers of Sindh, Baluchistan, KPK, Gilgit, Baltistan, Punjab and Azad Kashmir. We are defined by a common cultural thread of Saraiki linking our provinces and our peoples.
Ours is an ancient culture going back to the dawn of civilization established in the Indus River Valley 5400 years ago. We have evolved over the centuries absorbing other cultures and religions.

Over the last 50 years our cultural and national identity has been transformed and redefined.
We are redefining our cultural traditions to as they were centuries back with deep roots to Central Asia and the Middle East. In dress, language, and cuisine we are now different than we were 50 years back. Few nations in the world have culturally transformed so rapidly.

To further redefine it is necessary to emphasize who we are NOT...
Pakistanis are Not :

1. "Indian" Muslims - We are not part of "India", and yes a majority of our
population is Muslim, but religion is not the only defining feature of our national
identity.
We have no connection with the Muslim population of "India" as defined by its
territory today.

2. "West" Pakistanis - There is no "East" or "West" Pakistan but simply Pakistan.


3. "South" Asians- Pakistanis are Asians and our population similarity is with West or Central
Asia.

What do PDF members think?

Are the other South Asian populations at all relevant to us?
I am against nationalism in the nazi sense of any kind. The beauty of Pakistan is Punjabi, Sindhi, Phshto, , Urdu speaking , Balochi. I like you thought of bending Pakistani above all before moving to Canada and now understand that cultural identity makes diverse nation which makes a nation stronger not weaker. See when you have diversity it allows you to absorb the best in each culture for instance the French are ingenious in their ideas of science, art and cooking, the natives are great in spirituality and tenacity, the English are amazing at business, science order and sence of duty....

in the same vein, the south punjab serikhi belt make the best soldiers, the northern Punjab is all about love and business, the pushtoon which includes the Hinki belt are Gerry warrior, great scientists and oddly enough great prime ministers, the Balochi are a sea fearing , trading people with a diaspora all the way to Italy Monica baloochi is an example. The Urdu speaking provides education, business , administration and scientists ( I am adding memons, gujratis and way more) and finally the Sindhi, the beautiful poets , the great civilization of the desert people , the artists.

allow all of this to grow and let their love for Pakistan run deep rooted in their individual culture to make Pakistani a strong nation. Don’t try to scuttle it.

k
 

Baibars_1260

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The Urdu speaking provides education, business , administration and scientists ( I am adding memons, gujratis and way more) and finally the Sindhi, the beautiful poets , the great civilization of the desert people , the artists.
Agree entirely. We are a multi-ethnic , multi-lingual, multi-cultural people.
There are four main languages or language groups in Pakistan.
Sindhi, Pashto, Punjabi, Baluchi and Saraiki is a common link language across three provinces.
Urdu is not native to Pakistan though it is a beautiful language and has been adopted as a link language similar to the way Farsi was in the earlier era.

Sometime in the future our linguistic identity centered around a different indigenous evolving link language ( Saraiki? ) will be redefined.
 

Pan-Islamic-Pakistan

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Pakistani nationalism does not imply one has to let go of the very foundation the country was formed on. That is Islam. And to date probably still the only country in the world to have that honor. This should be a matter of pride and honor. This should be the driving force to take your country forward. It does not imply Pakistan has to be a loyal servant to other Muslim countries. If in the past Pakistan has been doing that- that is on the incompetency of the foreign policy.

Going through the thread, all I can see is a nefarious agenda being openly propagated by some individuals to "secularize" Pakistan in the veil of catchy slogans like "Pakistan First". Seems attractive now, but it will have its impact on society decades down the line. The "usual suspects" are also quite active to vilify other Muslim countries and on a mission to isolate Pakistan from the Muslim world.

Only one country will benefit from that, and that is not Pakistan.
@PAKISTANFOREVER is a patriot and he is loved by us. Please do not insult our brother.

As for the others who wish to secularize Pakistan, it is a pipedream at best.
Agree entirely. We are a multi-ethnic , multi-lingual, multi-cultural people.
There are four main languages or language groups in Pakistan.
Sindhi, Pashto, Punjabi, Baluchi and Saraiki is a common link language across three provinces.
Urdu is not native to Pakistan though it is a beautiful language and has been adopted as a link language similar to the way Farsi was in the earlier era.

Sometime in the future our linguistic identity centered around a different indigenous evolving link language ( Saraiki? ) will be redefined.
Urdu is derived from Punjabi, so the case can be made that it is a native language as well. The word itself comes from the Urdo (army camps) of Mahmed e Ghaznavi (rahmat Allah alayh).
 

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