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Pakistan First ! The case for Pakistani Nationalism.

Indos

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Is it anti Islam to show that much legs as the two in the center. The schoolgirl in France seemed to say it was.
We dont force our woman to wear hijab, but majority still wear hijab voluntarily and the rest who dont wear hijab still show moderation and also very small percentage who wear sexy cloth.
 

jupiter2007

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Be it a religious identity or some other identity, you need a leadership establishment that will build that identity through long-term planning and institutions, especially education.

Our leadership lacks the depth for that kind of work. That's why we keep running into problems like sectarian strife, or million-strong protests void of any real messages.

Unfortunately, our politicians, generals, judges, clerics etc, are all interested in playing their roles, but not actually being who they're supposed to be. The ones in charge are just actors. @SQ8
Once established stop playing games and start helping government in building Pakistan, we will be ahead of all our neighbors.

In the past I have given you’all solution by which Pakistan can improve it’s economy, reduce poverty, education our masses and convert unskilled labor to skill labor. We need to decentralize power to union council level and each level of government must fulfill their responsibilities.
 
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Baibars_1260

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Our country's name literally is Islamic Republic of Pakistan. You are willing to find identity in thousands of year old ruins but neglecting religious belief of majority of the population
Correct.
I am not disputing the existing name of our nation.
National identity is not so much defined by our religion, which is why I emphasized that Pakistanis were not "Indian" Muslims. Nor for that matter are we "West" Pakistanis ( a term chest thumping hyper nationalist Bangladeshi trolls use on this forum).

We could debate separately what the description "Islamic Republic" really means, or for that matter a "Christian Republic " , "Buddhist Republic", "Bahai Republic " means.
At this point our emphasis should be to send a message to our "friendly neighbors" in the east; both the Religious fascists and the linguistic parochial chauvinist wannabe" Islamic Unity" poodles.
One peddles religious and caste superiority with a "return to roots" and the other promotes "Islamic Brotherhood" with the slogan " My language above all". So we have to kick both these types in the "nuts" where it hurts by reminding them who we really are.
 

Baibars_1260

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If you don't want to be part of the Ummah you should denounce Islam altogether for being a lone wolf on an unforgiving territory means you will get penetrated.. The only reason you exist is due to your strength but when ganged upon you can be overcome specifically in a world like WW3 if you don't have allies you are doomed.

Islam is for the strong anyways. Allah choices these who are strong because they will keep safe his religion

A reality check on how strong we are.


Our "Ummah " in faith kicked the stuffing out us, chest thumping their national identity on their language and culture. Our so called brethren gave us a reality check that nations are not based on religion alone.
We were fortunate to have survived with the best part of the land in our hands, and left the gooey muddy morass that is sinking into the sea to our "brethren". We are far stronger today, far more than anyone could have imagined 50 years back because of our faith and our love for our nation.
 

khansaheeb

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We are Pakistan's First ....

It is necessary now as never before to emphasize our identity.

We are Pakistanis, dwellers of Sindh, Baluchistan, KPK, Gilgit, Baltistan, Punjab and Azad Kashmir. We are defined by a common cultural thread of Saraiki linking our provinces and our peoples.
Ours is an ancient culture going back to the dawn of civilization established in the Indus River Valley 5400 years ago. We have evolved over the centuries absorbing other cultures and religions.

Over the last 50 years our cultural and national identity has been transformed and redefined.
We are redefining our cultural traditions to as they were centuries back with deep roots to Central Asia and the Middle East. In dress, language, and cuisine we are now different than we were 50 years back. Few nations in the world have culturally transformed so rapidly.

To further redefine it is necessary to emphasize who we are NOT...
Pakistanis are Not :

1. "Indian" Muslims - We are not part of "India" and yes a majority of our population is
Muslim
but religion has nothing to do with our national identity. We have no
connection with the Muslim population of "India" as defined by its
territory today.

2. "West" Pakistanis - There is no "East" or "West" Pakistan but simply Pakistan.


3. "South" Asians- Pakistanis are Asians and our population similarity is with West or Central
Asia.

What do PDF members think?

Are the other South Asian populations at all relevant to us?
You identify yourself as a Muslim but refute basic tenets of Islam such Muslim unity and borderless Islamic regions. There is no such thing as a Pakistani Muslim or Indian Muslim but only a Muslim. Putting your own skewed interpretation questions your motives.
 

fitpOsitive

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We are Pakistan's First ....

It is necessary now as never before to emphasize our identity.

We are Pakistanis, dwellers of Sindh, Baluchistan, KPK, Gilgit, Baltistan, Punjab and Azad Kashmir. We are defined by a common cultural thread of Saraiki linking our provinces and our peoples.
Ours is an ancient culture going back to the dawn of civilization established in the Indus River Valley 5400 years ago. We have evolved over the centuries absorbing other cultures and religions.

Over the last 50 years our cultural and national identity has been transformed and redefined.
We are redefining our cultural traditions to as they were centuries back with deep roots to Central Asia and the Middle East. In dress, language, and cuisine we are now different than we were 50 years back. Few nations in the world have culturally transformed so rapidly.

To further redefine it is necessary to emphasize who we are NOT...
Pakistanis are Not :

1. "Indian" Muslims - We are not part of "India" and yes a majority of our population is
Muslim
but religion has nothing to do with our national identity. We have no
connection with the Muslim population of "India" as defined by its
territory today.

2. "West" Pakistanis - There is no "East" or "West" Pakistan but simply Pakistan.


3. "South" Asians- Pakistanis are Asians and our population similarity is with West or Central
Asia.

What do PDF members think?

Are the other South Asian populations at all relevant to us?
I absolutely loved the writing. But our population is kind of unique blend of East and west. Dark skinned people, light skinned people, small eyes, big eyes, straight hair, curly hair, brown eyes, colored eyes.... you can find these traits in Pakistan, and from natives.... so basically we are not pure race, but a mixture of many races, because Pakistan most of the time in history served as door to east, and to be honest it still serving the same purpose.
And that's true, like Musharraf said: Pakistan and Pakistanis first.
 

PAKISTANFOREVER

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You identify yourself as a Muslim but refute basic tenets of Islam such Muslim unity and borderless Islamic regions. There is no such thing as a Pakistani Muslim or Indian Muslim but only a Muslim. Putting your own skewed interpretation questions your motives.



Ummah can ONLY exist if ALL Muslims accept and embrace it's concept. Not just by Pakistanis continuely emphasising it.

Try telling an Arab, Iranian or Albanian Muslim that Pakistani Muslims are the same as them. That there is no difference between them and Pakistani Muslims. See what the response would be.

PS Your so called indian "Muslims" hate Pakistan and Pakistanis even more than indian hindus and sikhs do. That's YOUR ummah for you........ :disagree:
 

Baibars_1260

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Pakistani territorial nationalism is a reactionary sentiment to non-Pakistani Muslim mistreatment of Pakistan. But I still don't agree with it. Its a clone of Indian territorial nationalism. Allowing territorial nationalism will open the way for Punjabi ethno-nationalism and dreams to reunited both sides of Punjab which were divided on religious basis.
Actually, it is not so much non-Pakistani mistreatment of Pakistan but
once-"Pakistani Muslim" mistreatment of Pakistan. We got kicked hard. Something our chest thumping Bangladeshi "Muslim" guests and their Hindu masters holding the leash on their dog collars keep reminding us on this very forum time and time again.

Nationalism is only the privilege of Bangladeshis, because to them their language and culture is supreme, and we must bury our language and culture and grovel before them cowering under the whip of "Islamic Unity". You only need to go to the "Chill Bangladesh" thread and see what our so called "brethren in faith" really think of Islamic Unity. One statement:
"Brother, Islamic Unity is fine and I am all for it, but when it comes to a choice, it is my nation first " There are other statements with expletives against the founding fathers of Pakistan, Punjabis, Baluchis, Sindhis, and people of KPK best not repeated here.

That is what our "once-Pakistani Muslim" brethren in faith are saying right here, on this very forum. They have been screaming these in our ears for 70 years. Then they turn around and talk Islamic brotherhood in the name of the Ummah. We have been so deafened by the mantra of "Islamic brotherhood ", that we don't listen, not even to the abuse..

The Turks, Iranians, Arabs, North Africans, Indonesians all have national identities. Are those clones of India.
Why shouldn't Pakistan have its national identity
 

khansaheeb

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Ummah can ONLY exist if ALL Muslims accept and embrace it's concept. Not just by Pakistanis continuely emphasising it.

Try telling an Arab, Iranian or Albanian Muslim that Pakistani Muslims are the same as them. That there is no difference between them and Pakistani Muslims. See what the response would be.

PS Your so called indian "Muslims" hate Pakistan and Pakistanis even more than indian hindus and sikhs do. That's YOUR ummah for you........ :disagree:
Stop sitting on the fence of belief, jump to one side or the other , commit yourself to heaven or hell.
 

X-ray Papa

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Actually, it is not so much non-Pakistani mistreatment of Pakistan but
once-"Pakistani Muslim" mistreatment of Pakistan. We got kicked hard. Something our chest thumping Bangladeshi "Muslim" guests and their Hindu masters holding the leash on their dog collars keep reminding us on this very forum time and time again.

Nationalism is only the privilege of Bangladeshis, because to them their language and culture is supreme, and we must bury our language and culture and grovel before them cowering under the whip of "Islamic Unity". You only need to go to the "Chill Bangladesh" thread and see what our so called "brethren in faith" really think of Islamic Unity. One statement:
"Brother, Islamic Unity is fine and I am all for it, but when it comes to a choice, it is my nation first " There are other statements with expletives against the founding fathers of Pakistan, Punjabis, Baluchis, Sindhis, and people of KPK best not repeated here.

That is what our "once-Pakistani Muslim" brethren in faith are saying right here, on this very forum. They have been screaming these in our ears for 70 years. Then they turn around and talk Islamic brotherhood in the name of the Ummah. We have been so deafened by the mantra of "Islamic brotherhood ", that we don't listen, not even to the abuse..

The Turks, Iranians, Arabs, North Africans, Indonesians all have national identities. Are those clones of India.
Why shouldn't Pakistan have its national identity
Lmao Bihari, go get some polio vaccine before talking about getting kicked hard.
The real traitors are you west pakistanis.
 

Baibars_1260

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Ummah can ONLY exist if ALL Muslims accept and embrace it's concept. Not just by Pakistanis continuely emphasising it.
When did all Muslims embrace the concept? The Turks learnt that lesson in 1918-1919 when the 600 year old Ottoman Empire was toppled by Arab nationalism. Pakistan learnt its lesson in during our Civil War in 1971 facing Bengali nationalism.

Try telling an Arab, Iranian or Albanian Muslim that Pakistani Muslims are the same as them. That there is no difference between them and Pakistani Muslims. See what the response would be.
Try telling a Bangladeshi they were Pakistanis once and see what the response would be. But these former ethno-linguistic parochial chauvinists keep thrusting the Islamic Brotherhood mantra down our throats. They keep telling US Pakistanis that we are NOT Pakistanis but their "Muslim brothers".
 

X-ray Papa

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When did all Muslims embrace the concept? The Turks learnt that lesson in 1918-1919 when the 600 year old Ottoman Empire was toppled by Arab nationalism. Pakistan learnt its lesson in during our Civil War in 1971 facing Bengali nationalism.



Try telling a Bangladeshi they were Pakistanis once and see what the response would be. But these former ethno-linguistic parochial chauvinists keep thrusting the Islamic Brotherhood mantra down our throats. They keep telling US Pakistanis that we are NOT Pakistanis but their "Muslim brothers".
@DalalErMaNodi @Atlas @Michael Corleone
@SpaceMan18
This Bihari is too much, talking bad about Bangladesh in every post.
 

Baibars_1260

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You identify yourself as a Muslim but refute basic tenets of Islam such Muslim unity and borderless Islamic regions. There is no such thing as a Pakistani Muslim or Indian Muslim but only a Muslim. Putting your own skewed interpretation questions your motives.
We cant discuss religion here but the basic tenets of my faith (as I understand it) says exactly that. Nations and Tribes are created for a purpose.
Will refer you to the Surah Al Hujoorat 49:13.

Don't you think that is a great direction given by our faith?
 
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KhanBaba2

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We dont force our woman to wear hijab, but majority still wear hijab voluntarily and the rest who dont wear hijab still show moderation and also very small percentage who wear sexy cloth.
Actually I was asking what Islam allows and not what Indonesia allows.
 

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