What's new

Pakistan F-16 Discussions 2

Raider 21

PDF THINK TANK: ANALYST
Feb 18, 2016
2,758
6
4,759
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Arab Emirates
Hi,

In 1990s we were assured by many. Maybe you are too young to know. I can't forget the taste of the soily, brown wheat that the Americans sent in lieu of the millions of dollars earned by the sweat of Pakistanis.
Short sighted ppl can never learn from the past.
If Pak acts deftly, they may be able to pick up f-16s from third parties. This will only take Trump's approval. But Pak has to act soon before US troops all leave and nothing is left to bargain with.

We saw a smart move with the Jordanian F16s. Another deal like that and PAF can get to the ideal 100 aircraft fleet.
Those millions for PEACE GATE deals, had a lot of Saudi help and financing. That's why the first batch of jets being delivered did a mandatory stop in Saudi Arabia when the American pilots handed over to the newly qualified Pakistani Viper drivers. Anything before delivery via Saudi Arabia was on the US, after that the rest was up to Pakistanis (including the nearly fatal crash during a demo in front of the audience during the induction of Vipers).
 
Last edited:
Jan 3, 2020
1,002
0
1,125
Country
Pakistan
Location
Canada
Those millions for PEACE GATE deals, had a lot of Saudi help and financing. That's why the first batch of jets being delivered did a mandatory stop in Saudi Arabia when the American pilots handed over to the newly qualified Pakistani Viper drivers. Anything before delivery via Saudi Arabia was on the US, after that the rest was up to Pakistanis (including the nearly fatal crash when during a demo in front of the audience during the induction of Vipers).
Elaborate on the near fatal crash ?
 

spectregunship

FULL MEMBER

New Recruit

Aug 18, 2020
70
0
79
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
Hello everyone....
This is my first every reply on the forum while having been a silent spectator for about over a decade. Can't make tall claims about anything but here is something I want to add : this is the final fleet of F-16s that we have and will maintain for times to come. With the kind geo-politics going around, yanks are not going to be in the mood to release or even talk about sale of big ticket weaponry let alone vipers. As mentioned earlier on this thread about 8 x Blk 52 and case in point our AH1Zs left for storage. All we can do is be happy with these 70 odd majestic machines and re-align our minds for the new decade of 2020s. As much as I love the US systems especially vipers, it is simply hard to absorb the fact but it is what it is. Cheers.
 

baqai

FULL MEMBER
Sep 28, 2006
1,908
1
2,475
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
Those millions for PEACE GATE deals, had a lot of Saudi help and financing. That's why the first batch of jets being delivered did a mandatory stop in Saudi Arabia when the American pilots handed over to the newly qualified Pakistani Viper drivers. Anything before delivery via Saudi Arabia was on the US, after that the rest was up to Pakistanis (including the nearly fatal crash when during a demo in front of the audience during the induction of Vipers).
i would also like to learn about the near fatal crash
 

Trailer23

SENIOR MEMBER
Jun 2, 2012
3,437
104
10,390
Country
Pakistan
Location
United Arab Emirates
For as long as I can remember, every page has more or less the same conversation 'bout Pakistan's chances of acquiring additional* F-16's.

* I say additional because there is also the debate about New or Old/Used.

Regardless. the Americans have always played hardball and now realize that Pakistan is getting better at the game too.

Getting more F-16's a debate that can only be addressed after the 2020 Elections.

Pakistan is in no position to pay full price for new Block 70/72. On the flip side, i'd be interested to know what the asking price (per unit) would it cost to get some Block 25/30.
 

ziaulislam

ELITE MEMBER
Apr 22, 2010
15,037
10
14,283
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
For as long as I can remember, every page has more or less the same conversation 'bout Pakistan's chances of acquiring additional* F-16's.

* I say additional because there is also the debate about New or Old/Used.

Regardless. the Americans have always played hardball and now realize that Pakistan is getting better at the game too.

Getting more F-16's a debate that can only be addressed after the 2020 Elections.

Pakistan is in no position to pay full price for new Block 70/72. On the flip side, i'd be interested to know what the asking price (per unit) would it cost to get some Block 25/30.
or rather Pakistan doesn't think it brings something to table which they desperately they need

this isnt the 1990s when all that china could offer were f6s/f7 radar less old vintage plans and rest of market was just france vs USA

why would Pakistan spend 4X on a sanctionable jet if it brings nothing new to the table..it wont
 

Falcon26

SENIOR MEMBER
Dec 24, 2015
2,116
4
5,661
Country
United States
Location
United States
Hello everyone....
This is my first every reply on the forum while having been a silent spectator for about over a decade. Can't make tall claims about anything but here is something I want to add : this is the final fleet of F-16s that we have and will maintain for times to come. With the kind geo-politics going around, yanks are not going to be in the mood to release or even talk about sale of big ticket weaponry let alone vipers. As mentioned earlier on this thread about 8 x Blk 52 and case in point our AH1Zs left for storage. All we can do is be happy with these 70 odd majestic machines and re-align our minds for the new decade of 2020s. As much as I love the US systems especially vipers, it is simply hard to absorb the fact but it is what it is. Cheers.
Pakistan has at least $10 billion CSF funds withheld by the US. It is very likely that these funds will be released with the conclusion of the Taliban and afghan government accords. There’s no question about that. The only reason they were held was Pakistan’s inability to satisfy US conditions of bringing the Taliban to the negotiating table. This will become a mute point once a deal is reached between the Afghans. In fact, Pakistan’s value will increase given how Pakistan will become key to the success of the deal.

I wouldn’t discount another major military deal between Pakistan and the US. But it all depends on how Pakistan plays it’s card, which to be brutally honest, isn’t all that impressive.
 

Armchair

SENIOR MEMBER
Jun 4, 2014
3,332
8
5,402
Country
Bangladesh
Location
Turkey
I think the time is now. If the Dems win, game is up for Pak anyways. So, PMIK could play this game:

1. Visit the US, get in touch with the Pak community, say good things about Trump
2. Offer a juicy trade deal "to help US industry". Trump loves to make deals.
3. Deal should be for say, 10 billion dollars (over an insane period of years, say 10 years). Buy US, x, y and z products, perhaps even steel. All these would essentially be useful for Pak and would be bought from other sources anyways. In return, get open license from Trump to purchase third party F-16s and get EDA.
As well as other NATO military gear. And get all the Afghan retreat equipment.
4. If PMIK riles up the Pakistanis for Trump, Trump is the kind of guy that doesn't forget a favour.
5. Pak target should be for an additional 100 F-16s - EDA, third party, doesn't matter where you get them from.

All this talk about waiting after the elections are by people who have no understanding of US politics.
 

Yasser76

SENIOR MEMBER
Mar 28, 2017
2,075
1
3,178
Country
United Kingdom
Location
United Kingdom
I think the time is now. If the Dems win, game is up for Pak anyways. So, PMIK could play this game:

1. Visit the US, get in touch with the Pak community, say good things about Trump
2. Offer a juicy trade deal "to help US industry". Trump loves to make deals.
3. Deal should be for say, 10 billion dollars (over an insane period of years, say 10 years). Buy US, x, y and z products, perhaps even steel. All these would essentially be useful for Pak and would be bought from other sources anyways. In return, get open license from Trump to purchase third party F-16s and get EDA.
As well as other NATO military gear. And get all the Afghan retreat equipment.
4. If PMIK riles up the Pakistanis for Trump, Trump is the kind of guy that doesn't forget a favour.
5. Pak target should be for an additional 100 F-16s - EDA, third party, doesn't matter where you get them from.

All this talk about waiting after the elections are by people who have no understanding of US politics.
You are advocating cosying up to Trump 2 weeks prior to an election he may well lose. If there is one way to piss off the Biden presidency it is your suggestion above.
 

ziaulislam

ELITE MEMBER
Apr 22, 2010
15,037
10
14,283
Country
Pakistan
Location
United States
Pakistan has at least $10 billion CSF funds withheld by the US. It is very likely that these funds will be released with the conclusion of the Taliban and afghan government accords. There’s no question about that. The only reason they were held was Pakistan’s inability to satisfy US conditions of bringing the Taliban to the negotiating table. This will become a mute point once a deal is reached between the Afghans. In fact, Pakistan’s value will increase given how Pakistan will become key to the success of the deal.

I wouldn’t discount another major military deal between Pakistan and the US. But it all depends on how Pakistan plays it’s card, which to be brutally honest, isn’t all that impressive.
unlikely that these will be released..do you think congress will accept such a high fund/paycheck..i think it is IMPOSSIBLE..the funds approved are less then 2 billion..


so what pakistan can do or the best case senrio would be to ask the president to use his other powers to compensate for it..for example debt writing off..

pakistan has 20b $ loan from G20 and 20+ from WB/AB/IMF..we should aim for that..get maximum debt relief
I think the time is now. If the Dems win, game is up for Pak anyways. So, PMIK could play this game:

1. Visit the US, get in touch with the Pak community, say good things about Trump
2. Offer a juicy trade deal "to help US industry". Trump loves to make deals.
3. Deal should be for say, 10 billion dollars (over an insane period of years, say 10 years). Buy US, x, y and z products, perhaps even steel. All these would essentially be useful for Pak and would be bought from other sources anyways. In return, get open license from Trump to purchase third party F-16s and get EDA.
As well as other NATO military gear. And get all the Afghan retreat equipment.
4. If PMIK riles up the Pakistanis for Trump, Trump is the kind of guy that doesn't forget a favour.
5. Pak target should be for an additional 100 F-16s - EDA, third party, doesn't matter where you get them from.

All this talk about waiting after the elections are by people who have no understanding of US politics.
best think Pakistan can do is to by pass congress..
all they need to do is get a security waiver and buy second hand f16s and conduct a structural upgrade afterwards...
TAI can help with stutural upgrades..

getting new f16s without hard cash is impossible..
getting CSF 12+b $ funds approved from congress is impossible..
 

Falcon26

SENIOR MEMBER
Dec 24, 2015
2,116
4
5,661
Country
United States
Location
United States
unlikely that these will be released..do you think congress will accept such a high fund/paycheck..i think it is IMPOSSIBLE..the funds approved are less then 2 billion..


so what pakistan can do or the best case senrio would be to ask the president to use his other powers to compensate for it..for example debt writing off..

pakistan has 20b $ loan from G20 and 20+ from WB/AB/IMF..we should aim for that..get maximum debt relief

best think Pakistan can do is to by pass congress..
all they need to do is get a security waiver and buy second hand f16s and conduct a structural upgrade afterwards...
TAI can help with stutural upgrades..

getting new f16s without hard cash is impossible..
getting CSF 12+b $ funds approved from congress is impossible..
It won’t be possible. The money has already been set aside for Pakistan pursuant to state department and pentagon certification that Pakistan is bringing the Taliban to the negotiating table.

Briefing reporters, U.S. officials stressed the suspension did not affect civilian aid to Pakistan and that the money could go through if Islamabad took decisive action against the groups.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 2, Members: 0, Guests: 2)


Top Bottom