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PAF J-10C News, Updates and Discussion

cssniper

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Jun 22, 2012
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That's what I think too. F-16V is the best choice for PAF. No extra fighter type or extra engine type to maintain, compatible with existing pilot and weapons and PAF has almost 4 decades of experience operating the variant. But unfortunately that is no longer an option, but instead of adding just one fighter type and engine type (J-10C and WS-10), some of the members here are going crazy and adding three or four new aircraft and engine types.
Still there is possibility for PAF to get these birds, you know... haha:woot::woot::woot:
 

Big_bud

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People needs to understand that PAF is regarded as a top class fighting force highly disciplined and at par with any modern force out there despite of limited resources/options. In no way, any one should have a doubt on this. Even though, I didn't acknowledged neither claimed anything on AL-31F but one has to keep in mind that PAF is not going to compromise. That being said, whether AL-31F or WS-10; the top notch will be chosen by blue boys. IF J-10CP is here, it is going to be the spear head for PAF and in that area, there is no other option but to get the best out of it. I will hold down myself till the birds lands. We will then discuss as how, when it happened---- who was in China since when and in-fact how many of us (almost 6 members) knew from early 2019 or even before that.

I acknowledge & agree what @SQ8 used to say that any information which is for personal delight, shouldn't come to the internet unless Source say so. Secondly, any responsible person having information on any such topic, wouldn't compromise the OPSEC for few brownie points. Lastly, we all need to act responsibly. Either the J-10 or as I used to say, not only J-10 but a lot coming; means it is a huge responsibility to keep things close to your chest until the time comes.

Getting back to the topic; AL-31F has its own advantages and PAF sees that close coordination with big wigs for the future of Pakistan Defence Industries. A lot has been settled and clarified between Pakistan-Russia and I wouldn't shy to accept that thanks to China for playing a bigger role in this regard. This is same as like how Pakistan played a bigger role to clear the path for Chinese reaching the Gulf Defence Industry.

Currently, whatever being said on internet and as revealed by officials through different channels; is merely the tip of iceberg. Having said that, if even 40% of the desired modernization is revealed; I bet people will remain in shock for at-least couple of weeks if not a month.

Have you ever seen me opposing particular platform or even trying to say that so & so person is making such a stupid claim that if J-15 or J-16 or any Flanker is coming? I bet you wouldn't find me seriously doing so. You know why? I do not look at merely a platform or an opinion of someone wishing PAF to have a flanker. What interests me, is the case of seeing far beyond just a platform or an equipment. I am more interested into things impacting Country's Defence in long future.

I believe that any professional force like PAF just do not buy an equipment to live through the day and survive for tomorrow. You might not believe but PAF plans for 30+ years to the least if anything is procured or inducted into the active operations. By that logic & tactics; one can easily understand that which tech might get interest of PAF and how come the same can benefit Defence of the Country by any means or different ways. While pointing to something being interested to PAF; just pay close attention to the benefits and future lies ahead in-form of that particular platform/equipment, people will get the idea as how PAF or PN or PA is planning. How beneficial it is and how this is going to support in very long run.

If we are talking about AL-31F engine with J-10C for PAF; I wouldn't deny that plainly rather be looking at AZM becoming reality, an NGF becomes the reality and taking shape, a defence industry of Pakistan moving forward and all these factors will be combined with the help of Friends indeed. PAF may not be bringing the AL-31F or WS-10 merely for the sake of it. Trust me. It has more to do with future tech, development and progress being made to meet with modern warfare challenges. I have no doubt that Russia, China & Turkiye are already helping in different areas and the future path has been set.

Unfortunately, public denial is because of an ill painted picture of Pakistan. Don't take me wrong (everyone) but not everyone has to stomach to digest what PAF, PN or PA has been up-to. Unfortunately, most of us never tried to look at the right side of the picture but this is us keep asking for everything on platter and being spoon fed. I am not denying the fact of OpSec and secrecy level being maintained by Pakistan or China as everyone does so but did everyone belittle the particular nation or undermine them as if their defence capability is nothing at par in modern times. Surprisingly, no one ever could get the idea as how Pakistan has been the center of power struggle in the region and plays a major role to set rules. No one ever could look at things that Pakistan did. It is a dilemma but a reality since majority believes in the narrative being pushed by leading or major media outlets. There is a less of interest by the people to dig deeper and look at the things as they are instead of how they tell us to believe.

The reason as of the same proven fact that PAF do not race into quantity with the rival but always comes ahead of quality and delivering the result. This is all about to control the end game.

Pakistan armed forces and our men are certainly our pride and honor! We love our boys and we stand with them, ready to mix our blood with theirs for our country any day. But having said that, they are no supermen or martians aliens. They are very much Pakistani humans. Patriotism and optimism are double edged swords. We hear glorifying statements all too frequently about our forces and im not a big fan tbh.

With all due respect offcourse. Why we still have mirage 3s & 5s if we are thinking 30yrs ahead? Why by 2000s they were all not retired and replaced already? 30 yrs? 2022 is our first National Defence Policy announced only 74 years after freedom!

You see, I have a growing bitterness towards this attitude. Super sacred-ism that we sometimes associate to our armed forces. Nothing good on ground comes out of it. PA, PAF, PN are made of Pakistanis. Pakistanis are very casual, slow and laid back people, often somewhat ridiculous in their ideas and beliefs. The DNA of king dynasties and split N divide of colonialism perhaps still runs in our blood. We do have "some" hand full of bright people no doubt. But a lot of politics, negativity and bullshit also goes on within armed forces just like any other institute of our country. Our armed forces are only slightly better than national average in professionalism and productivity.

So no one should really believe that there is any super human force at their back! The sooner we separate reality from obsession the better it is. Praise where due but i'm sure theres no astonishment thats gona befall out of a F7 or Mirage 3 mid air. No matter how much patritoism, love and elbow grease you throw at a suzuki FX, its not becoming any 2022 vitz because of it.

P.S. I do have several people of my family in armed forces. They are all trying to serve country honestly and are bright as well. Much respect & love for all serving our country but I dont like rosey picture reports.
 
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araz

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Pakistan armed forces and our men are certainly our pride and honor! We love our boys and we stand with them, ready to mix our blood with theirs for our country any day. But having said that, they are no supermen or martians aliens. They are very much Pakistani humans. Patriotism and optimism are double edged swords. We hear glorifying statements all too frequently about our forces and im not a big fan tbh.

With all due respect offcourse. Why we still have mirage 3s & 5s if we are thinking 30yrs ahead? Why by 2000s they were all not retired and replaced already? 30 yrs? 2022 is our first National Defence Policy announced only 74 years after freedom!

You see, I have a growing bitterness towards this attitude. Super sacred-ism that we sometimes associate to our armed forces. Nothing good on ground comes out of it. PA, PAF, PN are made of Pakistanis. Pakistanis are very casual, slow and laid back people, often somewhat ridiculous in their ideas and beliefs. The DNA of king dynasties and split N divide of colonialism perhaps still runs in our blood. We do have "some" hand full of bright people no doubt. But a lot of politics, negativity and bullshit also goes on within armed forces just like any other institute of our country. Our armed forces are only slightly better than national average in professionalism and productivity.

So no one should really believe that there is any super human force at their back! The sooner we separate reality from obsession the better it is. Praise where due but i'm sure theres no astonishment thats gona befall out of a F7 or Mirage 3 mid air. No matter how much patritoism, love and elbow grease you throw at a suzuki FX, its not becoming any 2022 vitz because of it.

P.S. I do have several people of my family in armed forces. They are all trying to serve country honestly and are bright as well. Much respect & love for all serving our country but I dont like rosey picture reports.
You are right in many ways. We have our black sheep and lazy so and sos as well. However there are brighter people as well as you pointed out. The problem is not the procurement but the money for it. Our finances have been in dump for at least the last 4 decades. This has caused us to make compromises in so many fields. So take that factor into consideration.
The other factor of note is the willingness of the providers to provide. It is in part related to our finances as well but mostly "the powers that be's" perception of how strong Pak defences should be vis a vis India. So at crucial stages technologies/hardware have not been provided to us. The ban on 16s, E3s, Chinooks, and the RC400 AND MICA saga comes to mind as just a few examples, along with bumping up the Price of M2Ks (refurbished MwK5 at 6p million a pop) and pushing Rafale towards us knowing fully well we will not be able to afford the plane.
Lastly I agree to a great extent we wasted the first 30 years by not setting up ancillary industries to start building products at home. Plans for building tanks/guns and ammo were not enacted due to purely corrupt practices and criminal negligence. This is still impacting our productivity and compromised us badly during 65 and 71. However a lot of these decisions were taken by heads of state rather than the armed forces ( agreed that some of these morons were from the armed forces).
A
 

abdulbarijan

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I personally think the news has been leaked via Sheikh Rasheed. I dont specifically know why it was done but he is known as the Pindi boy and is close to military circles. Ido not think there is a need to announce it if the Chimese are bronging their J10s over. The mannerisms sugfest these are our own planes. My 2 paisas worth.
A
I would also agree with that, but given our checkered history of acquisitions not going through, I'm in the boat of lets wait and see till these birds land.

After all, I still haven't recovered from the "FC-20's landing in 2015" trauma so I hope you get where I'm coming from. :D
 

Deino

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Nov 9, 2014
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Poland is also co-manufacturing them for their airforce


But regardless who manufactures certain parts or even engines for LM, it remains still a US system and as such if the US ban it from exoirt to Pakistan from the US, why should they allow an export via Turkey, Poland or whomever?
 

TNT

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Some people just dont have the capability to see beyond 3 feet. Who would want to use mirages in 2022? Who would want to drive a suzuki fx when there are new models available?? Yes the ones that dont have money. I guess this simple fact is too complex for many to understand.
 

Bleek

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PA, PAF, PN are made of Pakistanis. Pakistanis are very casual, slow and laid back people, often somewhat ridiculous in their ideas and beliefs. The DNA of king dynasties and split N divide of colonialism perhaps still runs in our blood.
Somewhat disagree with this, remember these are the people who risk their lives out there and are responsible for national security, not the average civilian.

Just back in 2019, they witnessed how real the risk is, and numerous times before.

You would probably be correct in any other institution, but I think it's unlikely here.

Also the close mixing with the Chinese military has had a positive influence on them, you cannot be so closely linked with them without adopting similar habits and a desire to progress!

They know what's required, and will work out a way to achieve that within their limitations. I'm a firm believer in this.

If there's one thing you can pick up from the Chinese in this relationship, it should be work culture and a desire to progress. If you have that, even with the amount of shit that happens in Pakistan, you will still grow.
 

arjunk

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In coming years, paf will be left with just jf17s, f16s and j10s, so only 3 types of aircraft and 3 engine types.

Today with j10 or tomorrow, ultimately the chinese engine will come to paf.
I hope they strip weapon systems from Mirages and let civilians privately own them :crazy_pilot:
 

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