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Over 60% of ‘Made In India’ IAF Tejas Grounded

anathema

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India lost 180 pilots in the last 10 years due to inferior standards, PAF did not!

You fly more - you loose more ! Thats a direct corelation. Pak started to fly more after iaf increased sorties - crash rate went through the rooof. It might be surprising for you - flying costs lot of money. And also objectively if you analyze - F7's and even thunder doesnt have endurance . On station each sortie time does not last for more than 30-40 mins. So whoever is feeding you these BS of 220 hrs - its just BS. Only F16 - has a good loiter time and MirageIII coz it refueles (assuming all have got Rose). Similarly - Su30's have got the best loiter time followed by M2ks, Mig29's , etc. So if you ask Su 30 pilot - they would be clocking more than 300 hrs. If you ask Mig21 pilot - they might be clocking 150 -180 hrs.
So learn to undertand the figures when people quote rosy picture. And listen to fighter pilot podcast of indian airforce pilots

Fighter Pilot podcast - Bundle Tyagi

Fighter Pilot Podcast - Harsh Mandar
 

anathema

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see dude 200 pilots in our air force have not died, we fly the same aircraft mirages, mig-21/f-7 , jf-17 and f-16s. We buy our spares from all over the world ( see a lot of folks make f-16 parts)
Rofl - have you done your analysis. Heres what you do - for last 10 years create a list of PAF reported crashes ( there are unreported ones too) , create a list of PAF mortalities, segregate between rotary/fighter ; Create the same list for IAF. And compare them. Take into consideration IAF is twice PAF. Calculate ratios - by all accounts PAF fares very pooorly.
 

PAKISTANFOREVER

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Rofl - have you done your analysis. Heres what you do - for last 10 years create a list of PAF reported crashes ( there are unreported ones too) , create a list of PAF mortalities, segregate between rotary/fighter ; Create the same list for IAF. And compare them. Take into consideration IAF is twice PAF. Calculate ratios - by all accounts PAF fares very pooorly.




Where is the CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence that the PAF is not doing well? If you are not lying then remember to post the links here.
You fly more - you loose more ! Thats a direct corelation. Pak started to fly more after iaf increased sorties - crash rate went through the rooof. It might be surprising for you - flying costs lot of money. And also objectively if you analyze - F7's and even thunder doesnt have endurance . On station each sortie time does not last for more than 30-40 mins. So whoever is feeding you these BS of 220 hrs - its just BS. Only F16 - has a good loiter time and MirageIII coz it refueles (assuming all have got Rose). Similarly - Su30's have got the best loiter time followed by M2ks, Mig29's , etc. So if you ask Su 30 pilot - they would be clocking more than 300 hrs. If you ask Mig21 pilot - they might be clocking 150 -180 hrs.
So learn to undertand the figures when people quote rosy picture. And listen to fighter pilot podcast of indian airforce pilots

Fighter Pilot podcast - Bundle Tyagi

Fighter Pilot Podcast - Harsh Mandar





There is 0 CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence for ALL the above........ :azn:
 

halupridol

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Where is the CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence that the PAF is not doing well? If you are not lying then remember to post the links here.






There is 0 CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence for ALL the above........ :azn:
There is no credible & genuine evidence for a lot of things,,, this is not a court room.
N no one is going to spoon feed u.
Google n find out.
Ur gib me evidence,, gib me proof in each n every thread is getting boring.
 

anathema

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Where is the CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence that the PAF is not doing well? If you are not lying then remember to post the links here.
Why i woud lie ? :-) Do a search. In think for benefit of PDF - you guys can compile the list and let everyone know the outcome. Why should it be spoon fed? Hint - ratio favors very badly for PAF.

There is 0 CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence for ALL the above........ :azn:
Listen to the podcast links that i posted above. Flight hours calculated is very different based on platform. All of these flying hours that you guys have fed on is meaningless.
 

PAKISTANFOREVER

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There is no credible & genuine evidence for a lot of things,,, this is not a court room.
N no one is going to spoon feed u.
Google n find out.
Ur gib me evidence,, gib me proof in each n every thread is getting boring.



Which is why so many lies, propaganda and made up stories run wild all over the Internet.......... :disagree: Certain lies and made up stories are being forced to be accepted as "FACTS"........:disagree:........ONLY the TRUTH, REALITY and FACTS matter. Everything else means NOTHING!.
Why i woud lie ? :-) Do a search. In think for benefit of PDF - you guys can compile the list and let everyone know the outcome. Why should it be spoon fed? Hint - ratio favors very badly for PAF.


Listen to the podcast links that i posted above. Flight hours calculated is very different based on platform. All of these flying hours that you guys have fed on is meaningless.






As you are the one making the claims, the onus is on YOU to provide the CREDIBLE, GENUINE & IRREFUTABLE FACTS that have been cross referenced and validated. If you don't then it means you are lying and making it all up. It is already a PROVEN FACT that india is the BIGGEST FAKE NEWS & PROPAGANDA factory in the WORLD:


 
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Windjammer

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It was a honest comment windy - that loop was truly great for JF :)
Ironically nothing new always performed it in Pakistan but others have strict safety rules in place for all participating.

I am not neutral - am i and neither are you. So what is the point.
People are known to talk to even Plants and although we may not openly admit it but deep down in our heart of hearts we know the score.

Economy and managing economy is not PAKs strength. And also coz funds are obviously usurped by army - isnt it. It controls everything. Since when has PA ever taken its sister services along. PAF and PN (horrible treatment) is considered as after thought. Nosy haider , kargil reports how PAF was kept in loop. However that been said - PAF does play important for public perception
No dear, Pak Army being the largest of the three arms may take a bigger chunk of defence budget but since 1965 it has realised the importance of the air arm hence it was the army which used it's own budget to fund Jordanian F-16s for PAF. PN however was neglected in the past but the importance of sea lanes has been very much realised. During Kargil, what role could PAF have played since IAF was conducting missions within it's own side of LOC.....had the IAF carried out strikes on Pakistani side then PAF would have played it's part.

Just learning from better players and paying back in the same coin. I suppose in statecraft these are valid strategies. What has this got to do with public perception ? Park armed forces main objective is to manage public perception - thats amply clear. Fauji inc has lot to looose.
Democracy has never actually taken a foothold in Pakistan until most recently and suffice to say that the institutions or establishment run by Fauji are the most credible and beneficial plus at least a common foot soldier doesn't need to go on social media for a decent meal.
 

Khan vilatey

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You fly more - you loose more ! Thats a direct corelation. Pak started to fly more after iaf increased sorties - crash rate went through the rooof. It might be surprising for you - flying costs lot of money. And also objectively if you analyze - F7's and even thunder doesnt have endurance . On station each sortie time does not last for more than 30-40 mins. So whoever is feeding you these BS of 220 hrs - its just BS. Only F16 - has a good loiter time and MirageIII coz it refueles (assuming all have got Rose). Similarly - Su30's have got the best loiter time followed by M2ks, Mig29's , etc. So if you ask Su 30 pilot - they would be clocking more than 300 hrs. If you ask Mig21 pilot - they might be clocking 150 -180 hrs.
So learn to undertand the figures when people quote rosy picture. And listen to fighter pilot podcast of indian airforce pilots

Fighter Pilot podcast - Bundle Tyagi

Fighter Pilot Podcast - Harsh Mandar

I agree with you the PAF flies more and loses a 3-4 aircraft in a year which is about 0.01 % of our Air Force. This is consistent with any professional Air Force.

why does India fly less and lose more aircraft and pilots? 200 pilots in 10 years on just migs ? Point me to one other air force with such high iteration numbers ?

the second point about endurance is funny as well. The f-7 has a sortie time of 45 minutes it was used as an interceptor or point defense aircraft. But the jf-17s endurance is 3 hours / sortie. It does have air Refueling capability from block 2 onwards so can be extended to 6 hours with drop tanks and aerial refueling similar to f-16. india and paksitan both have 4 tankers each which is not sufficient for 24 hour coverage.

just to add insult to injury outside of su-30, Rafael and mirage 2000 ( the last two in very limited numbers) nothing in the IAF has endurance.

Rofl - have you done your analysis. Heres what you do - for last 10 years create a list of PAF reported crashes ( there are unreported ones too) , create a list of PAF mortalities, segregate between rotary/fighter ; Create the same list for IAF. And compare them. Take into consideration IAF is twice PAF. Calculate ratios - by all accounts PAF fares very pooorly.

you keep quoting a secret list of planes crashing in the Pakistani military, these things are myths just like India shooting down a Pakistani aircraft.

You can check a list of PAF crashes on the PDF’s outsourced partner for all things PDF would not do on BharatRakshah they keep a list I think Pakistan had 2 crashes in 2019.

you can also search dawn.com where a crash is always reported. This is not India my friend we have transparency and democracy all part of the Niya Pakistan.

Where is the CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence that the PAF is not doing well? If you are not lying then remember to post the links here.






There is 0 CREDIBLE & GENUINE evidence for ALL the above........ :azn:

100% agree india is never creditable or genuine about military numbers or analysis . I think this stems from their inferiority complex from being completely out done by Pakistan a country 4 times smaller, with a population 8 times smaller and a economy 25 times smaller.

I think they are 😱 afraid that when Inshallah Pakistan’s economy will grow due to CPEC what will happen to India. The scariest thought is what if Pakistan’s defence budget goes up to 18 billion a year.

k
 

anathema

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People are known to talk to even Plants and although we may not openly admit it but deep down in our heart of hearts we know the score.
Deep down i know lca would kick jfs butt - but thats my influenced opinion. Just the way posters over here feel jf block 3 will take down rafale inluding air marshal shahid lateef :suicide:

No dear, Pak Army being the largest of the three arms may take a bigger chunk of defence budget but since 1965 it has realised the importance of the air arm hence it was the army which used it's own budget to fund Jordanian F-16s for PAF. PN however was neglected in the past but the importance of sea lanes has been very much realised. During Kargil, what role could PAF have played since IAF was conducting missions within it's own side of LOC.....had the IAF carried out strikes on Pakistani side then PAF would have played it's part.
it has been corroborated widely that PAF was not even aware of Kargil mission undertaken by Pak army. Simply put - Army is the king and totally neglects sister services.

Democracy has never actually taken a foothold in Pakistan until most recently and suffice to say that the institutions or establishment run by Fauji are the most credible and beneficial plus at least a common foot soldier doesn't need to go on social media for a decent meal.
Point is is pak army a business empire or a fighting unit. How does it keep itself from conflict of interest ? What is the total market cap of Fauji inc ? How many industries does it run ? Every decision then gets influenced by monetary outcome instead of gearing up to achieve strategic outcomes.
I agree with you the PAF flies more and loses a 3-4 aircraft in a year which is about 0.01 % of our Air Force. This is consistent with any professional Air Force.
One word for your post - Junk ! Do analysis - put the crashes in table and find the relative ratio. PAF has fared very badly. Infact the crash rate is more and worse the mortality rate of pilots is higher.
 

Khan vilatey

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Deep down i know lca would kick jfs butt - but thats my influenced opinion. Just the way posters over here feel jf block 3 will take down rafale inluding air marshal shahid lateef :suicide:


it has been corroborated widely that PAF was not even aware of Kargil mission undertaken by Pak army. Simply put - Army is the king and totally neglects sister services.


Point is is pak army a business empire or a fighting unit. How does it keep itself from conflict of interest ? What is the total market cap of Fauji inc ? How many industries does it run ? Every decision then gets influenced by monetary outcome instead of gearing up to achieve strategic outcomes.

One word for your post - Junk ! Do analysis - put the crashes in table and find the relative ratio. PAF has fared very badly. Infact the crash rate is more and worse the mortality rate of pilots is higher.
No it’s not! No one agrees with this here is the the listing from the premium Pakistani ani source the India today newspaper ..........


Is the BBC pro Pakistan ?


as per the database of Indian Air Force crashes .... I kid you not they need a database to hold all these losses....
mig 21 -285
Mirage 2000 -12
Su-30 12
Mig -27 57
Jaguars 56
Kiran hjt-16 80 ( yes 80 trainers were crashed by Indian pilots )


Why are your pilots so incompetent? I must apologize IAF does not stand for incompetent Air Force, that would be a travesty to incompetent people of the world. It’s actually the abbreviation for Indians Against Flying (IAF)

k
 
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Windjammer

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Deep down i know lca would kick jfs butt - but thats my influenced opinion. Just the way posters over here feel jf block 3 will take down rafale inluding air marshal shahid lateef :suicide:
Good this Indian thinking is the best thing to happen to PAF....pre 27.2.19 all Indians were convinced that SU-30 is an overkill of PAF and MiG-29 is sufficient to take care of the entire PAF fleet but guess what....when the test came there was no Fulcrum in sight. Shahid Lateef is retired and just gives his personal opinion unlike some serving who have already won a two front war. Not.
it has been corroborated widely that PAF was not even aware of Kargil mission undertaken by Pak army. Simply put - Army is the king and totally neglects sister services.
Maybe because it was a covert operation confined to a limited area....but later on PAF was very much active. Later during 2002 stand off, PAF was given the green light to strike with strength even if one IAF aircraft crosses the border.

Point is is pak army a business empire or a fighting unit. How does it keep itself from conflict of interest ? What is the total market cap of Fauji inc ? How many industries does it run ? Every decision then gets influenced by monetary outcome instead of gearing up to achieve strategic outcomes.
Just like Indians believe that every one in Pakistan walks around carrying AK-47s and women wearing Burqas, same notion seems to be at work here.....when in 90s with the arrival of private airlines and IAF pilots leaving the airforce in droves, did it ground the IAF.....a martial law occupies more officer and soldiers away from their duties than a few establishments being run by them....when in Pakistan, i often visit Fauji Foundation shops.....you have to look for any one in uniform as all the workers, cashiers etc are civilians including many females.
 
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PAKISTANFOREVER

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Deep down i know lca would kick jfs butt - but thats my influenced opinion. Just the way posters over here feel jf block 3 will take down rafale inluding air marshal shahid lateef :suicide:


it has been corroborated widely that PAF was not even aware of Kargil mission undertaken by Pak army. Simply put - Army is the king and totally neglects sister services.


Point is is pak army a business empire or a fighting unit. How does it keep itself from conflict of interest ? What is the total market cap of Fauji inc ? How many industries does it run ? Every decision then gets influenced by monetary outcome instead of gearing up to achieve strategic outcomes.

One word for your post - Junk ! Do analysis - put the crashes in table and find the relative ratio. PAF has fared very badly. Infact the crash rate is more and worse the mortality rate of pilots is higher.






You know FULL WELL you are lying and there is 0 credible and genuine evidence for your claims. Reported to MODs for spreading lies and propaganda.
 

Khan vilatey

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Good this Indian thinking is the best thing to happen to PAF....pre 27.2.19 all Indians were convinced that SU-30 is an overkill of PAF and MiG-29 is sufficient to take care of the entire PAF fleet but guess what....when the test came there was no Fulcrum in sight. Shahid Lateef is retired and just gives his personal opinion unlike some serving who have already won a two front war. Not.

Maybe because it was a covert operation confined to a limited area....but later on PAF was very much active. Later during 2002 stand off, PAF was given the green light to strike with strength even if one IAF aircraft crosses the border.


Just like Indians believe that every one in Pakistan walks around carrying AK-47s and women wearing Burqas, same notion seems to be at work here.....when in 90s with the arrival of private airlines and IAF pilots leaving the airforce in droves, did it ground the IAF.....a martial law occupies more officer and soldiers away from their duties than a few establishments being run by them....when in Pakistan, i often visit Fauji Foundation shops.....you have to look for any one in uniform as all the workers, cashiers etc are civilians including many females.
[/QUOTE]
Fauji foundation , and defense housing society is run by ex army folks not serving folks. Should this be the case or not is a thing for the Pakistani voter to decide not an Indian on the PAKISTANI DEFENSE FORUM.

k
 

-blitzkrieg-

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1624944510114.png


see those collars..thats the inspiration for tejas wings
 

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