• Friday, November 22, 2019

On this day, Two IAF Migs are shot down

Discussion in 'Air Warfare' started by Windjammer, May 27, 2016.

  1. Windjammer

    Windjammer ELITE MEMBER

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    "Both IAF jets were shot inside Pak territory which were involved in hostile attack"

    "A living prisoner is more useful than a dead one, Pak Army did not kill Ahuja"

    "No one, not even the Defence Attache turned up to receive their own pilot"

    [​IMG]
    POW Flt.Lt Nachiketa was involved in hostile attack on Pakistani positions. When his Mig-27 was shot he ejected and after landing on the ground he tried to escape. He fired on the Pakistani soldiers with his pistol but still he could not escape and was captured. Indian govt. refused to take its pilot which was afterwards handed over to the Red Cross

    Indian Air Force openly entered into the conflict on 26 May 1999 and launched air strikes 10 kms across LoC inside Pakistani territory. Pakistan warned that if India would continue to violate its airspace than it would target them in retaliation. On 27 May 1999, IAF MiG-27ML (Serial No. 1135) flown by Flt Lt K. Nachiketa of No. 9 Squadron intruded into Pakistan airspace at 11:15 a.m. (PST) near Hunzi Ghund. It intruded twice and first marked a Pakistani position on the LoC with smoke bombs and then came in for a rocketing and strafing attack on the same post. Gunner Shafaqat Ali commanded by Capt. Faheem Tipu of Air Defence using an ANZA-II SAM tracked and shot down the MiG as it exited. The pilot ejected and was taken POW. He resisted with his pistol after landing and was involved in a fire fight with Pakistani troops to evade capture.

    Shortly later, two more Indian MiG-21 jets intruded into Pakistan airspace at 11:35 a.m. (PST) and dived in for a rocketing attack on the same Pakistani position. Naik Talib Hussain Basharat again commanded by Capt. Faheem Tipu started tracking and one of the MiG-21 (Serial No. C1539) was shot down again with ANZA-II SAM at a height of 1,500 metres. The wreckage fell 10-12 kilometres inside Pakistan territory. The pilot, Sqn Ldr Ajay Ahuja of No. 17 Squadron was killed and the body was handed over to India on 29 May 1999.
    [​IMG]
    Pak Army soldiers with the tail of Indian MiG-21 fighter jet in Hunzi Ghund in Pakistan territory.


    After the Indian jets were shot down, Indian media started a propaganda that Pakistan Army could not shoot any Indian aircrafts and the IAF is continuing their activities. The Pakistani defence spokesman Brig. Rashid Qureshi refuted it and cleared that after the Indian planes had been shot down they did not violate the Pakistani airspace and continued to patrol inside Indian territory at a very high altitude.

    When FIt Lt. Nachiketa was released on 4 June 1999 as a unilateral gesture of goodwill by Pakistan, on the order of Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif, no one, not even the Defence Attache turned up to receive their own pilot. The reason they did not want to be publicly seen receiving their prisoner pilot back. The Foreign Office had taken precautions to associate the ICRC with the wellbeing of the Indian pilot. They examined him and found him medically fit in the condition they took his custody and transported him to the border. Squadron Leader Ahuja's body was returned with full military honours by the Pakistan Army, that has always stuck by the traditions of the battlefield. As Ahuja's body was handed over to India, even before any post-mortem examination it raised alarm that Ahuja may have shot dead after he had parachuted safely to the ground. India had maintained that the Ahuja had "ejected after his MiG-21 was hit by a surface to air missile fired upon from across the LoC."Later India maintained that according to the post-mortem report Ahuja was shot twice-once through the ear and again in the chest. India launched strong protest with Pakistan over the 'brutal shooting' of Sqn Ldr. Ahuja by his Pakistani captors. This was another attempt to malign Pakistan in the eyes of the world. Knowing fully well that Ahuja fighter plane was shot down when it was engaged in rocketing, artillery firing and automatic firing. In such a combat situation some bullets hitting Ahuja can not be ruled out.

    IAF changed their operational technique after their jets were shot down and used Jaguars and Mirage 2000 fighter jets. They also began using laser-guided bombs from high-altitude. As a result, their bombing was ineffective and they failed to clear the targets.

    [​IMG]
    The remains of ejection seat and other survival equipments of Indian jets being shown to the international media, the UN observers were also present on the scene.
     
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  2. Indus Falcon

    Indus Falcon SENIOR MEMBER

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    Thanks Windy!!! This thread is going to be interesting :-)
     
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  3. Imran Khan

    Imran Khan PDF VETERAN

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    upload_2016-5-27_15-6-29.jpeg



    [​IMG]
    lost Mig-21Bis which killed its pilot Squadron Leader S. Raghuvanshi

    [​IMG]
     
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  4. Burhan Wani

    Burhan Wani STAFF

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  5. Imran Khan

    Imran Khan PDF VETERAN

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    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Windjammer

    Windjammer ELITE MEMBER

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  7. The Sandman

    The Sandman ELITE MEMBER

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    Great share awesome work windjammer :tup::tup::tup:
     
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  8. Stephen Cohen

    Stephen Cohen BANNED

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    @Windjammer

    AFTER this initial loss ; IAF used Chaffs and flares and You could not bring down any more plane

    A total of 100 Stingers were fired by Pakistani troops during the entire conflict

    Only the First two were successful

    @Windjammer

    The Mig 27 was Lost because of ENGINE failure

    Your stingers took out Mig 21 and a Mi 17 helicopter
     
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  9. Tipu7

    Tipu7 SENIOR MEMBER

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    I doubt your claim of 100 stingers ......
    Plus
    One Mig 21, one Mig27 and One Mi17 gunship was shot down by man pads ......
     
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  10. Stephen Cohen

    Stephen Cohen BANNED

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    @Windjammer


    https://in.rbth.com/articles/2013/01/16/migs_over_kargil_how_the_fulcrum_buzzed_the_falcons_21659

    Mig 27 was lost due to gun Gas ingestion ie Engine flame out

    http://kaiser-aeronaut.blogspot.in/2009/01/kargil-conflict-and-pakistan-air-force.html

    An excerpt

    while a MiG-27 went down due to engine trouble caused by gun gas ingestion during high altitude strafing. (Incidentally, the pilot of the MiG-27 Flt Lt Nachiketa, who ejected and was apprehended, had a tête-à-tête with this author during an interesting ‘interrogation’ session.)

    @Windjammer

    If you want to discuss Kargil war ; Do it in its ENTIRETY

    Not just the parts which are convenient to you

    What about the Atlantique Incident

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantique_incident
     
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  11. Tipu7

    Tipu7 SENIOR MEMBER

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    Every aircraft suffer from engine failures when hit by man pad.

    Behind every crashed air craft due to technical glitches, there is manpad.

    Remember these two quotes ...... :-)

    He is discussing a certain incident of war which took place TODAY.
    If you want to discuss entire war, there are couple of threads already running..... you can share your thoughts there.......
    If crashed plane or faces of POW are hurting your feelings, then better keep distance from this thread :-)
     
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  12. Imran Khan

    Imran Khan PDF VETERAN

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    according to our sources after we shot down three birds indians never fly over pakistan and stay away . abut 100 stingers claim they could be 101 or 99 or exact 100 ?:enjoy: why did not pakistanis use crotale and hq-2 and mistral then sir whom stopping us ? stinger was not our last missile as i remember ?
     
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  13. Stephen Cohen

    Stephen Cohen BANNED

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    India WON the kargil War ; Pakistan LOST it ; despite USA being your friend

    even though we were fighting defensively and with restraint

    And when we Threatened to EXPAND the conflict across the International Border
    General Musharraf WENT TO USA for HELP

    It was Pakistan which was PREPARING fora Nuclear war because it was
    worried about INDIAN ARMY storming across the International Border

    It was Pakistan which Lost Both the Kargil War on the LAND
    and suffered a Massive diplomatic embarrassment and Loss of face : PERIOD

    Those planes were NOT flying over Pakistani territory

    Your soldiers on the peaks INSIDE our territory had Stingers

    By the way Read this

    http://kaiser-aeronaut.blogspot.in/2009/01/kargil-conflict-and-pakistan-air-force.html

    While the photo-recce missions typically did not involve deliberate border violations, there were a total of 37 ‘technical violations’ (which emanate as a consequence of kinks and bends in the geographical boundaries). Typically, these averaged to a depth of five nautical miles, except on one occasion when the IAF fighters apparently cocked-a-snoot at the PAF and came in 13 miles deep.
     
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  14. Imran Khan

    Imran Khan PDF VETERAN

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    India actually lost Kargil war: Gen Pal


    * Indian general says what his country gained from war has not been consolidated

    By Iftikhar Gilani

    NEW DELHI: An Indian general, who commanded troops during 1999 Kargil war, on Sunday broke his 11-year silence to say that India actually lost the war in strategic terms.

    Lieutenant-General (r) Kishan Pal, the then head of Srinagar-based 15 Corps, told a private channel that he did not speak because he was never convinced about this war.

    “We did gain some tactical victories, we regained the territories, but lost 587 precious lives. I consider this loss of war because whatever we gained from the war has not been consolidated, either politically or diplomatically. It has not been consolidated militarily,” he said, when was asked for his assessment of the conflict 11 years later.

    Gen Pal was recently in a controversy involving the battle performance report of one of his juniors, Brigadier Devinder Singh. An armed forces tribunal has indicted Pal for showing bias against Brigadier Singh; former 70 infantry brigade commander, and belittled his achievements in the war besides falsifying accounts of battles during the Kargil operations.

    Meanwhile, a Chandigarh-based former army major has also come out with a revelation that his inputs on Kargil ‘intrusion’, sent to his seniors as early as January-February 1999, were ignored and he was asked to stop sending such reports in writing.

    Major Manish Bhatnagar, who participated in the Kargil war, said not only were his inputs ignored, later, when a full-scale conflict broke out, he was court martialled on another pretext and made to leave the army.

    He said he had informed his senior officers about the heavy presence of hostile forces and had also apprised them of the large number of bunkers and occupation of vital points by them during his posting. “Later, when the strength of ‘intruders’ was found to be more than the perceptions of the top generals — resulting in mass causalities of soldiers — officers like me were persecuted to hide their wrongs,’” Bhatnagar said.

    Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

    Source: https://defence.pk/threads/india-actually-lost-kargil-war-gen-pal.262456/#ixzz49rYZEqJb
     
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  15. Stephen Cohen

    Stephen Cohen BANNED

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    @Windjammer

    After IAF brought in Mig 29 and Mirage 2000 ; PAF was just a spectator
    watching the proceedings
     
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