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New fighter for PAF Doctrine?

araz

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Spot on sir. There is another threat of TTP & ISIS using the turmoil of civil war (in case it happens) to attack Pakistan. We need to increase the surveillance of the area to ensure no trickling of terrorists happen.
I think the ISIS is very much a hybrid force. Once Taliban take over Afghanistan it will disappear. However, even before that there will be a power struggle between the Taliban and the Government. How much chaos is caused in the process and how quickly Taliban take over will be something that needs to be seen. We can support Afghanistan and the Taliban government while it gets on its feet, but it should be on the condition of Afghans remaining that side of the fence.
The Chinese will see opportunities in stabilizing Afghanistan and unlike Russia they will want to develop infrastructure to be able to firstly explore and extract mineral resources in , and secondly establishing links with Central Asia and expand their market share. That in my view will propel Pakistan forward provided there is a sane head to think this through and act on it in time. This rather than licking the US Arse is what we should be gearing up to.
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ziaulislam

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I would not trust modern day US policy makers WHO HAVE REPEATEDLY SHOWN HOW GOOD THEY ARE AT LEAVING A MESS IN THEIR WAKE IF IT SUITS THEM. You have to understand the US financial condition currently will not allow them to support Pakistan in any way unless they are tied down in dire straits. They will simply leave Afghanistan in a lurch and let the Afghans sort it out amongst themselves. This remains my concern. I think we need to hasten and reinforce the fencing effort so we can control what comes in from and goes out to Afghanistan. Unless we do so we will be hosting another 3-4 million people for another 3 decades
Ok with respect to finanacial aid USA even today disperse more then 60b$ in aid ..

Its not about money...

if we leverage our situation good we can easily leverage aid even once they leave

However our goal should be focused on finanacial tools in from of WB AB or debt relief rather then pure money/military equipment as that is easy to leverage and much more useful(as something is done on ground rather then money going to generals & politicans)
 

ziaulislam

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On the topic i have always maintained that PAF needs to check mate india on quality.

J10 doesnt provide that in comparison to rafale

So J10 today doesnt make any sense although seemingly PAF is about to acquire it

The more favourable option is either J11(Or flanker with chinese stuff) or j35

Otherwise continue focus on jf17, f16 and limited mirage5 is the right strategy

250 odd jf17+ 70 f16 is covers the medium low tier role and j10 wouldnt add much beyond rafale
J35 will be in high demand but i doubt a few squardons will be denied by china early on for PAF. So smarter move will be waiting a few yrs and focusing more on network centric war and jf17
May be SAMs as well
 

ziaulislam

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J35 can also to some extent address strike roles given its stealth design and evolution of small diameters stand off loitering ammunition

It will also address first look first kill issues

I doubt india will jump to F35 since indians dont believe in chinese tech effectivness..same way they walked away from russian fifth gen fighter
 

Scorpiooo

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Atleast 26-36 with AESA along permissions to intergrade Chinese and Pakistani weapons
Article shares mentioned 16 then limited demand to. 8 birds

Secondly American will never allow integration of Chinese or even pakistani on there birds never ever
 

mingle

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Article shares mentioned 16 then limited demand to. 8 birds

Secondly American will never allow integration of Chinese or even pakistani on there birds never ever
My bad I posted wrong thread I thought it's Su35 thread I deleted my post
 

SABRE

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On the topic i have always maintained that PAF needs to check mate india on quality.

J10 doesnt provide that in comparison to rafale

So J10 today doesnt make any sense although seemingly PAF is about to acquire it

The more favourable option is either J11(Or flanker with chinese stuff) or j35

Otherwise continue focus on jf17, f16 and limited mirage5 is the right strategy

250 odd jf17+ 70 f16 is covers the medium low tier role and j10 wouldnt add much beyond rafale
J35 will be in high demand but i doubt a few squardons will be denied by china early on for PAF. So smarter move will be waiting a few yrs and focusing more on network centric war and jf17
May be SAMs as well
IMO, you are right about qualitative lopsidedness between the J-10 and Rafale.

JF-17+F-16+Mirage-III/V is a right strategy but one that will last only a short while.

- Mirages are surviving on borrowed life.

- We can acquire as many JF-17s as we want but it will not change the fact that the aircraft was designed to be 2nd tier fighter and is likely to continue in that role.

- If Pakistan fails to secure logistics support and weapons for F-16s than we are looking at non-technical attrition of the aircraft in the future. Addressing this should be priority alongside buying new F-16s - that is IF we plan to buy new F-16s and are able to get them.

By J-35 I assume you mean J-31/FC-31? The aircraft has not completely passed the developmental phase. It is too soon to consider it.

I have a feeling that Pakistan has been impressed with Flankers, but more particularly the Chinese J-11B and J-16. But the Russians have prevented China from exporting these aircraft to anyone. However, if they want to push Su-35 to Pakistan then we could and should insist on a modified aircraft. Unfortunately, we think in terms of piecemeal acquisitions of 8 or 16 or 18 aircraft, which means ToT and customisations of the aircraft similar in pattern to the Indian Su-30MKI cannot be on the cards.
 

Scorpiooo

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IMO, you are right about qualitative lopsidedness between the J-10 and Rafale.

JF-17+F-16+Mirage-III/V is a right strategy but one that will last only a short while.

- Mirages are surviving on borrowed life.

- We can acquire as many JF-17s as we want but it will not change the fact that the aircraft was designed to be 2nd tier fighter and is likely to continue in that role.

- If Pakistan fails to secure logistics support and weapons for F-16s than we are looking at non-technical attrition of the aircraft in the future. Addressing this should be priority alongside buying new F-16s - that is IF we plan to buy new F-16s and are able to get them.

By J-35 I assume you mean J-31/FC-31? The aircraft has not completely passed the developmental phase. It is too soon to consider it.

I have a feeling that Pakistan has been impressed with Flankers, but more particularly the Chinese J-11B and J-16. But the Russians have prevented China from exporting these aircraft to anyone. However, if they want to push Su-35 to Pakistan then we could and should insist on a modified aircraft. Unfortunately, we think in terms of piecemeal acquisitions of 8 or 16 or 18 aircraft, which means ToT and customisations of the aircraft similar in pattern to the Indian Su-30MKI cannot be on the cards.
But purchase of Russian flanker ... could open the restriction on Chinese flankers... can work as win win situation for both parties
 

MIRauf

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What will only 8 jets will bring in PAF ?
Not sure about the thinking of PAF on that, for layman like me, 10/14 would have made sense as 18 current would have taken the tally to 28/32. Thus the PAF would have ended up with two squardren at either 14 or 16 vipers apiece. I guess PAF would have gone for 8 more later on to bring the tally up to 36 Block-52+ or so, I reckon we will never know as PAF opted not to pay 100% out of pocket.

PS: Sorry, I didn't mean to write thesis on this, but I couldn't pen it all down in the "Cliff Notes."
 

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