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New fighter for PAF Doctrine?

The Eagle

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I will repeat myself again as I said before even in this thread; JF-17 Block-III is the new air craft for PAF and then, we will keep the qualitative and technological edge ahead, 5th Gen Air Craft will be here. In the mean time, new Vipers or an upgrade will do the best as bonus.
 

Zarvan

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I will repeat myself again as I said before even in this thread; JF-17 Block-III is the new air craft for PAF and then, we will keep the qualitative and technological edge ahead, 5th Gen Air Craft will be here. In the mean time, new Vipers or an upgrade will do the best as bonus.
And here I disagree. One more Chinese jet will come. Most likely J-10 C. Even Chinese J-31 is 10 to 15 years away. We don't have that much time.
 

The Eagle

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And here I disagree. One more Chinese jet will come. Most likely J-10 C. Even Chinese J-31 is 10 to 15 years away. We don't have that much time.
Disagreement is good especially when the same ensues a healthy argument. However, mine was an opinion and yes, I can be proven wrong. However, in the end PAF will be stronger by any means so I like the disagreement.
 

Zarvan

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Disagreement is good especially when the same ensues a healthy argument. However, mine was an opinion and yes, I can be proven wrong. However, in the end PAF will be stronger by any means so I like the disagreement.
If J-31 gets ready fast then we may go for less numbers of J-10 C or J-16. Because after Air Chief flight in J-11, we can't rule them out also. Pakistan should wait for WS 19 and WS 15 engines to get ready before going for 5th Generation Jets.
 

The Eagle

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If J-31 gets ready fast then we may go for less numbers of J-10 C or J-16. Because after Air Chief flight in J-11, we can't rule them out also. Pakistan should wait for WS 19 and WS 15 engines to get ready before going for 5th Generation Jets.
Zarvan Bhai! It will be naive to prelude CAS flight into any aircraft as an evidence of interest or intention to check for induction.

FC-31 or J-35 or something else, in my opinion, after Block-III, there will a 5th gen AC as a next for PAF.

Rest of speculation, rumors or even media sensations will continue like this. As I said, I can be wrong but that's what I have observed or....... Since, we don't know the level of capability with PAF, I see most of us feeling the lack of counter to IAF or an insecurity because we don't see a new platform same as like Rafale for India. I see that, it's just us feeling like unsafe or insecure but it's the PAF at front and I don't find any reason for them to compromise even a bit. At least, I am confident and capability exist so keep calm.

Military follows the plans and doctrine which is designed way above than enemy's expectations and based upon Intel information about the rival's manoeuvring.
 

Salza

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Pakistan do need a double engine fighter plane for the Navy perhaps not a requirement on Eastern and Kashmir side as of now.
 

araz

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If J-31 gets ready fast then we may go for less numbers of J-10 C or J-16. Because after Air Chief flight in J-11, we can't rule them out also. Pakistan should wait for WS 19 and WS 15 engines to get ready before going for 5th Generation Jets.
Maulana Saheb.
I think maintaining 2 5th gen fighters-will become honorous. I think what ever comes from whereever will be our 5th generation offering. Another factor which I think will be important will be that PAF might just wait till IAF makes a follow on order of the Rafale. The reason maywell be in my humble opinion that sunk costs of the project will not allow IAF to go for a 5th gen offering from any where and might give the PAF an advantage in the short term. PAF at the moment is sitting comfortably with an in house AESA bearing fighter which will keep IAF at bay till a follow on order of Rafale-is-made.
A
 

The Eagle

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I think maintaining 2 5th gen fighters-will become honorous. I think what ever comes from whereever will be our 5th generation offering. Another factor which I think will be important will be that PAF might just wait till IAF makes a follow on order of the Rafale. The reason maywell be in my humble opinion that sunk costs of the project will not allow IAF to go for a 5th gen offering from any where and might give the PAF an advantage in the short term. PAF at the moment is sitting comfortably with an in house AESA bearing fighter which will keep IAF at bay till a follow on order of Rafale-is-made.
A
Very well explained. Despite their attempts to consume PAF resources in number & platform race; IAF is actually caught for its own trap whereby PAF is matching in quality with a home grown fighter which can be produced in numbers PAF need. Furthermore, the time comes when IAF will think to up the ante, I see that PAF will be already maintaining the edge & keeping the ladder in hand. Current picture pretty much dictates the same thing which is already being observed by many of Indian Analysts as well that IAF is lagging behind for almost 6-8 years to PAF and for this edge alone, I don't see anyone is sitting comfortably. As we go by the topic, I will repeat that JF-17 Block-III is the new fighter Air Craft for PAF and next may come in 5th Generation class.

We had the Falcons but everyone may remember that India has been ruling the Internet Skies for years with an Asian Raptor ala MKI, Mirage-2K, Migs, Jaguars but PAF came out victorious with Falcons plus Thunders & Old Mirages. What keeps the PAF ahead? Indeed, unlike the number game, PAF maintained an active & quality wise affective fleet regardless of enemy's fleet quantity.
 

Bilal Khan (Quwa)

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Maulana Saheb.
I think maintaining 2 5th gen fighters-will become honorous. I think what ever comes from whereever will be our 5th generation offering. Another factor which I think will be important will be that PAF might just wait till IAF makes a follow on order of the Rafale. The reason maywell be in my humble opinion that sunk costs of the project will not allow IAF to go for a 5th gen offering from any where and might give the PAF an advantage in the short term. PAF at the moment is sitting comfortably with an in house AESA bearing fighter which will keep IAF at bay till a follow on order of Rafale-is-made.
A
For the PAF, the intended outcome of 5th-gen/next-gen is probably deep strike, not multi-role. For the latter, the JF-17 and F-16 are enough, and if they're not, then some existing platform will suffice even if the IAF gets additional Rafale's.

Otherwise, I think 5th-gen/next-gen is for a niche requirement set, and the full realization of it probably won't materialize before 2040 (i.e., fighters plus loyal wingman drones, automated munitions, directed energy weapons, etc).
 

Path-Finder

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We had the Falcons but everyone may remember that India has been ruling the Internet Skies for years with an Asian Raptor ala MKI, Mirage-2K, Migs, Jaguars but PAF came out victorious with Falcons plus Thunders & Old Mirages. What keeps the PAF ahead? Indeed, unlike the number game, PAF maintained an active & quality wise affective fleet regardless of enemy's fleet quantity.
look east, look west! MKI is the best. all is trumped by mini AEW&C. :sarcastic:
 

ziaulislam

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Fankly i think if FC 31 is 5 years away, then better wait for it and concentrate on getting jf17 numbers up quickly and weapon system for jf17.

Any used f16/subsidized f16 if available as bonus
 
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Deino

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Fankly i think if FC 31 is 5 years away, then better wait for it and concentrate on getting jf17 numbers up quickly and weapon system for jf17.

Any used f16/subsidized f16 if available as bonus

Agreed, but I would be very careful with an estimate of "5 years away". Even if we assume a similar test and evaluation phase for the J-35 like the J-20 it is anyway a new type and only 5 years from maiden flight (which was still not accomplished) to service entry and LRIP, even more to an export customer, is IMO unlikely.

But we'll see.
 

araz

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Agreed, but I would be very careful with an estimate of "5 years away". Even if we assume a similar test and evaluation phase for the J-35 like the J-20 it is anyway a new type and only 5 years from maiden flight (which was still not accomplished) to service entry and LRIP, even more to an export customer, is IMO unlikely.

But we'll see.
Plus if the news of PLAN interest is true theor own/requirements will preceed sales.
A
 

Arsalan

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Zarvan Bhai! It will be naive to prelude CAS flight into any aircraft as an evidence of interest or intention to check for induction.

FC-31 or J-35 or something else, in my opinion, after Block-III, there will a 5th gen AC as a next for PAF.

Rest of speculation, rumors or even media sensations will continue like this. As I said, I can be wrong but that's what I have observed or....... Since, we don't know the level of capability with PAF, I see most of us feeling the lack of counter to IAF or an insecurity because we don't see a new platform same as like Rafale for India. I see that, it's just us feeling like unsafe or insecure but it's the PAF at front and I don't find any reason for them to compromise even a bit. At least, I am confident and capability exist so keep calm.

Military follows the plans and doctrine which is designed way above than enemy's expectations and based upon Intel information about the rival's maneuvering.
Not true!

A few months ago ACM took a commercial flight in an Airbus A-320. Now i have been informed by some strategically planted and cultivated sources of mine on Facebook that since that flight of ACM on A-320, PAC have started working on a conversion program for A-320 and we have signed a deal of 24 new plus 12 old A-320s and they are being converted into a fighter cum AESA cum ballistic missile launch platform. This is a done deal, the planes are on way to Kamra and the ballistic missiles have already been delivered to the base. You are way to immature to understand the significance of ACM flying in plane! Do you think he will do it unless we are sure to buy that plane? Why will he fly in a plane if PAF is not going to buy it. It is not like that plane belonged to a friendly country participating in a joint exercise in Pakistan so the ACM will hop in to take a ride! NO! If he went to fly that it is 200% confirmed that PAF have decided to buy them.


Oh and do not give me the same old lame excuse! As you know (or perhaps you dont even know such basic things), MONEY NO PROBLEM!! YO YO!!
 

SABRE

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For the PAF, the intended outcome of 5th-gen/next-gen is probably deep strike, not multi-role. For the latter, the JF-17 and F-16 are enough, and if they're not, then some existing platform will suffice even if the IAF gets additional Rafale's.

Otherwise, I think 5th-gen/next-gen is for a niche requirement set, and the full realization of it probably won't materialize before 2040 (i.e., fighters plus loyal wingman drones, automated munitions, directed energy weapons, etc).
Ah, Bilal!

I have almost abandoned this forum. I say almost because I drop in now and then to remain updated on new developments (if any) & read comments & reviews from from few sane voices that exist here. For me you top these sane voices. But I respectfully disagree on your "deep strike" prediction solely based on the fact that while deep penetration strikes remain relevant the deep penetration strike aircraft (DPSA) are almost obsolete. What Pakistan actually needs is a future proof aircraft and the future continues to be multirole . But whatever multirole aircraft Pakistan acquires it must have the ability to instantly switch between different role at the push of a button, much like Gripen.
 

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