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New fighter for PAF Doctrine?

Xone

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The hope of a new fighter plane is dying down in an endless waiting, it is almost year with no visible signs of HJ-7, F-16, J 10C, J16, SU35. All rumours have gone into hearsay.
Even our JF 17 B3 has gone into uncertainty of prolonged delay, What is going actually on, is kept either under the complete cover or nothing is happening at all. In such a situation, everyone is free to think and imagine, as no restriction on the imaginations and dreams.
Go on, get joyride of The Black Stallion of of wistful wishes and dreams.
 

Trailer23

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What proof you want ?? You want me to show video or bring audio for you ? Are you even for real or here to just joke around ??? No, not just a simple conversation taking place around Farnborough dude. Their defence ministers during their visits made the offer. The representatives of the company made the offer. Even in one or two case their Prime Ministers themselves brought up the issue. Including UK prime minister David Cameron when he visited Pakistan during Nawaz Shareef time. You don't prefer to be realistic you prefer to be in denial.
Yes. Plain simple 'Yes' will do. I'm not looking for an Audio or Video, but is there anything to support your claim in Aviation Week, Shepard, Jane's or even a Pakistani Newspaper that may have quoted.

And i'm a Realist. I see what's in front of me and avoid illusions made to fool the masses.
Same people were in denial when it was told VT 4 is coming.
I see. Since 2011, how many predictions have you made that have actually come true? If you're a true insider, your track record should be 100%. I too could put a list of 50-items on my Wish List. If one of the 49 comes true, I could put my hands up in the air and shout, "Daikha, kaha tha, na".

Not that I follow the equipment the Pakistan Army or Navy procures.
As for J-10 C it's pretty much INSHALLAH a done deal. Also after giving access to Russia to Gawader and don't even rule out J-16, although not a very high possibility.
I've stated earlier that i'm not going to speak on J-10C/E, but will go on the record and say that J-16 is waste of conversation which i'm not interested in (at all).
As far as F-16s are concerned, their love in PAF is not going anywhere and I know of some negotiations which have taken place for them.
Yes, i'm also aware of those negotiations as well.
So if Biden government also shows willingness we very well can get a deal for few squadrons of Block 72.
Sure, if the Biden and his team are willing to sell us those Block 72's, I have no issues with it, but keep in mind that they won't be PAF Colors before 2026/2027. First get the Sale approved and wait for your kids to be old enough to go off to college before you see the first one land at a PAF Base.
 

Zarvan

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Yes. Plain simple 'Yes' will do. I'm not looking for an Audio or Video, but is there anything to support your claim in Aviation Week, Shepard, Jane's or even a Pakistani Newspaper that may have quoted.

And i'm a Realist. I see what's in front of me and avoid illusions made to fool the masses.

I see. Since 2011, how many predictions have you made that have actually come true? If you're a true insider, your track record should be 100%. I too could put a list of 50-items on my Wish List. If one of the 49 comes true, I could put my hands up in the air and shout, "Daikha, kaha tha, na".

Not that I follow the equipment the Pakistan Army or Navy procures.

I've stated earlier that i'm not going to speak on J-10C/E, but will go on the record and say that J-16 is waste of conversation which i'm not interested in (at all).

Yes, i'm also aware of those negotiations as well.

Sure, if the Biden and his team are willing to sell us those Block 72's, I have no issues with it, but keep in mind that they won't be PAF Colors before 2026/2027. First get the Sale approved and wait for your kids to be old enough to go off to college before you see the first one land at a PAF Base.
No you are not the realist. Also not everything gets reported by Janes or other websites. That doesn't mean talks don't take place. In fact I have seen several times Janes taking stuff from this website to report matters, and not just jane few other websites have also done same. If we go for BLOCK 72 we would make sure we get them fast. It would be way before 2026.
 

The Eagle

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EFT have been offered several times, it's our leadership which didn't went ahead.
As far as I know, we did approach for EFT and there's been talks but given the price for offered Tranche; it would have been foolish to go for it while Tranche III was costing us more than our pocket. I don't find our leadership being responsible for not going for it.
 

Trailer23

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If we go for BLOCK 72 we would make sure we get them fast. It would be way before 2026.
Right, that statement of yours is laughable. It proves that you're not a realist - not even close.

I say this because you just proved the planet you're on, hasn't been discovered yet.

Take a close look at the Countries that have placed orders. NATO & Oil Rich Arab Nations that are putting Cash upfront. Oh and those Countries didn't have to face a blockade from a number of Congress OR Senate.

Where does Pakistan stand as of now? I know, we're the ones who go to the Car Dealership and ask for further discounts - & ask if they can throw in the Rust Proofing & Window Tinting.

But i'll tell you what, lets get by the first hurdle of getting the approval for Block 72's. Deliveries are least of our problems.
 
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Metal 0-1

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As far as I know, we did approach for EFT and there's been talks but given the price for offered Tranche; it would have been foolish to go for it while Tranche III was costing us more than our pocket. I don't find our leadership being responsible for not going for it.
What about Tranche II? Just asking?
 

The Raven

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So, with the year almost over, where's the J-10C, JH-7, F-16 Block 72, J-16? :rofl: These were meant to be "imminent", "days away from landing in Pakistan". That then quickly changed to "before the US election" :omghaha: Let's see what the ego boys come up with this time.
 

jupiter2007

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So, with the year almost over, where's the J-10C, JH-7, F-16 Block 72, J-16? :rofl: These were meant to be "imminent", "days away from landing in Pakistan". That then quickly changed to "before the US election" :omghaha: Let's see what the ego boys come up with this time.
There is no point of mentioning JH-7 because Pakistan will never go for that, going for it would be going backward.
Since we have shifted our foreign policy toward China and Turkey, our relationship with USA is not the same. If we become a puppet state of USA and stop CPEC, we can acquire advanced fighters from USA but we all know that’s not going to happened. We will have to wait and
See how Biden Administration handle fragile relationship between USA and Pakistan. In 2021 we will know if administration will allow Pakistan to acquire new F-16s or even surplus. We have to be realistic, we can’t be a day dreamer. Even if USA allow Pakistan to purchase F-16, is Pakistan willing to pay 90+ million for each plane?

As far as J-10C is concerned, it might be possible to go for it if other options are not available.
 
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Air Wolf

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One way to look at all of "this is coming and that is coming" is....Organized Misinformation to keep the enemy at bay...Some hiccups in Block III which required some time to be sorted out....till then its best to keep the enemy in a continuous state of guesswork and make it difficult for them to devise an effective attack strategy
 
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Armchair

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Keep an eye on the EW aircraft taking part in Shaheen IX. :)
So it seems j10 is not coming alone?
A j10 with a ws15 would be even more interesting. As there would be a meaningful future legacy rather than the dead end of the ws10.

Key is if PAF can convince the Chinese.

Imagine a j10p with ws15, heavy ew pods, MERs and pl-15 / pl-21s. Rafale killer sounds about right
 
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PakCan

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This forum has become a land of fantasy. Everyother member has a wish list and inside news to what's coming. Repeated topics the quality has really deteriorated, I am no expert, I visit the forum because I like to get update on Pak armed forces. I really wish the members and moderators make sperate wish list page in in the 3 branches sub forum where member can go at it. Just my 2 cents.
 

Deino

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So it seems j10 is not coming alone?
A j10 with a ws15 would be even more interesting. As there would be a meaningful future legacy rather than the dead end of the ws10.

Key is if PAF can convince the Chinese.

Imagine a j10p with ws15, heavy ew pods, MERs and pl-15 / pl-21s. Rafale killer sounds about right

OHM ... can we come back to reality?? ... just back from "vacaition" you are once again trashing this thread with your fan-boy BS. The next proposal is surely again this mystical twin-engined mega J-10 ... at best with two WS-15. :hitwall: :crazy:
 

Scorpiooo

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Bhai jaan, is there any Aircraft that hasn't been rumored in the calendar year 2020?

[Covid ke waja yaha say sab farig baithay howay thay]​

Aside from the F-16's, every Chinese Military Jet had been rumored/covered extensively here, other forums, YouTube, facebook, f#*kin' Twitter etc.

And you'd be surprised that all those rumors were coming from pretty much the same sources - regardless the platform used.

And yes, we all contributed to add fuel to the fire.

Now, lets say J-15 or J-16 were coming, you'd be making the EXACT SAME statement, wouldn't you...?

Personally, I don't think we can be in a position to be placing orders for both J-10's & F-16's. I'm pretty sure that our Economic situation prevents us from doing so. But yes, we've all said this that something needs to be done & we are currently light-years away from Project AZM.

Let me just say one thing in regard to the F-16's, and that is entirely depending on how Biden and Congress reacts to Pakistan asking for F-16's.
a. If they approve, we could get some used ones & we could talk about Viper upgrades and all the add-ons once its approved.
b. However, if you or anyone else here is dreaming of Block 72's, know one thing that they won't be ordered & delivered in 2021, 2022, 2023 - all the way up to 2027. NATO & friendly Nations with deep pockets come first - and so they should as they are in the waiting list. This isn't Habib Bank, where you can cut the queue to get ahead to the Teller. Also, in 4 Years time, Trump could be back in Office and we know how he could just stop and delay the order.

What does that mean for Pakistan? Wasted years when we could in that period have 3-4 Squadrons of some Chinese Fighter Jet, even if it has to be the J-10.

Think where India will be in 2025 in numbers? They're already getting like 19 MiG-29's from Russia for dirt-cheap price tag. Plus, by then they'll have more Rafales & would have added further Su-30's.

So, here is how I see it.

1. See if you can grab any used-F-16's if they are willing to deliver 'em within 12 Months. Block 72's can be considered.
-Also consider adding some Chinese Fighter Jet that compliments the JF-17.
2. If the first point fails, how many options do you think PAF will have?
And I would hate to waste my breath talking about EFT, Rafales, Gripen, Su-'s & MiG's.
Best and relistic option are only J10x in limited number i.e 2 to 3 sqr for now
and later add J31/J35 atleast 2 sqr till project azm, offcouse continue of improved blocks of JFT till azam
OHM ... can we come back to reality?? ... just back from "vacaition" you are once again trashing this thread with your fan-boy BS. The next proposal is surely again this mystical twin-engined mega J-10 ... at best with two WS-15. :hitwall: :crazy:
Is there any evidence to suggest that it was truly offered (several times). I'm sorry, but unless there is irrefutable proof like an article in a Newspaper and/or magazine - i'm not buying it.

As I mentioned earlier, its not about Biden.
Even if he/they approve, when do you think you will be receiving them at the earliest?

Here is a scenario...
1. Biden approves.
2. We wait 4+ Years.
3. 2025 - Trump is back.

Now the first thing that nut will do is reverse pretty much everything Biden does do.

So, where does that leave PAF. Empty handed once again just because we're hell bent on acquiring Vipers.

I hope to God that i'm wrong, but we've been jerked 'round one to many times for these jets.

Well, I don't really know what's going on between PAF & China - and lets be honest, no one here does.

So lets wait & see for the official word.
If PAF really want rellay again on vipers then simple get EDA or 3rd party and upgrade them V standard .. will economical and fast as well.
 

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