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Muslim groups call for boycott of Hilton hotels over China mosque demolition

CriticalThought

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I have occasionally read his satires on Pakistani affairs on Dawn website and the newspaper cuttings my father kept. The newspaper columns used to be printed in the Indian newspaper Asian Age many years ago.
You ignored my question. Have you actually read his writings on Islam and Muslims and so called 'Mullahs'?
 

jamahir

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You ignored my question. Have you actually read his writings on Islam and Muslims and so called 'Mullahs'?
The thread I linked has such info. I quote a section :
During the same period (1920s-30s), another (though lesser known) Islamic scholar in undivided India got smitten by the 1917 Russian revolution and Marxism.

Hafiz Rahman Sihwarwl saw Islam and Marxism sharing five elements in common: (1) prohibition of the accumulation of wealth in the hands of the privileged classes (2) organisation of the economic structure of the state to ensure social welfare (3) equality of opportunity for all human beings (4) priority of collective social interest over individual privilege and (5) prevention of the permanentising of class structure through social revolution.

The motivations for many of these themes he drew from the Qur’an, which he understood as seeking to create an economic order in which the rich pay excessive, though voluntary taxes (Zakat) to minimise differences in living standards.

In the areas that Sihwarwl saw Islam and communism diverge were Islam’s sanction of private ownership within certain limits, and in its refusal to recognise an absolutely classless basis of society.

He suggested that Islam, with its prohibition of the accumulation of wealth, is able to control the class structure through equality of opportunity.

Basically, both Sindhi and Sihwarwl had stumbled upon an Islamic concept of the social democratic welfare state.

Building upon the initial thoughts of Sindhi and Sihwarwl were perhaps South Asia’s two most ardent and articulate supporters and theoreticians of Islamic Socilaism: Ghulam Ahmed Parvez and Dr. Khalifa Abdul Hakim.

Parvez was a prominent ‘Quranist’, or an Islamic scholar who insisted that for the Muslims to make progress in the modern world, Islamic thought and laws should be entirely based on the modern interpretations of the Qu’ran and on the complete rejection of the hadith (sayings of the Prophet and his companions based on hearsay and compiled over a 100 years after the Prophet’s demise).

After studying traditional Muslim texts, as well as Sufism, Parvez claimed that almost all hadiths were fabrications by those who wanted Islam to seem like an intolerant faith and by ancient Muslim kings who used these hadiths to give divine legitimacy to their tyrannical rules.

Parvez also insisted that Muslims should spend more time studying the modern sciences instead of wasting their energies on fighting out ancient sectarian conflicts or ignoring the true egalitarian and enlightening spirit of the Qu’ran by indulging in multiple rituals handed down to them by ancient ulema, clerics and compilers of the hadith.

Understandably, Parvez was right away attacked by conservative Islamic scholars and political outfits.

But this didn’t stop famous Muslim philosopher and poet, Muhammad Iqbal, to befriend the young scholar and then introduce him to the future founder of Pakistan, Muhammad Ali Jinnah.

Jinnah appointed Parvez to edit a magazine, Talu-e-Islam. It was set-up to propagate the creation of a separate Muslim country and to also answer the attacks that Jinnah’s All India Muslim League had begun to face from conservative Islamic parties and ulema who accused the League of being a pseudo-Muslim organisation and Jinnah for being too westernised and ‘lacking correct Islamic behavior.’

Apart from continuing to author books and commentaries on the Qu’ran, Parvez wrote a series of articles in Talu-e-Islam that propagated a more socialistic view of the holy book.

In a series of essays for the magazine he used verses from the Qu’ran, incidents from the faith’s history and insights from the writings of Muhammad Iqbal to claim:

The clergy and conservative ulema have hijacked Islam.

They are agents of the rich people and promoters of uncontrolled Capitalism.

Socialism best enforces Qur’anic dictums on property, justice and distribution of wealth.

Islam’s main mission was the eradication of all injustices and cruelties from society. It was a socio-economic movement, and the Prophet was a leader seeking to put an end to the capitalist exploitation of the Quraysh merchants and the corrupt bureaucracy of Byzantium and Persia.

According to the Qur’an, Muslims have three main responsibilities: seeing, hearing and sensing through the agency of the mind. Consequently, real knowledge is based on empirically verifiable observation, or through the role of science.

Poverty is the punishment of God and deserved by those who ignore science.

In Muslim/Islamic societies, science, as well as agrarian reform should play leading roles in developing an industrialised economy.

A socialist path is a correction of the medieval distortion of Islam through Shari’a.


Parvez joined the government after the creation of Pakistan in 1947, but after Jinnah’s death in 1948, he was sidelined until he resigned from his post in 1956.
 

CriticalThought

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The thread I linked has such info. I quote a section :
The quoted section represents a typical effort by liberal elements to misrepresent Islam to suite their own agenda. In this case, the misrepresentation comprises promotion of lesser known and so called scholars who have no following amongst mainstream Muslims. Ironically, the quotes section itself reveals the validity of this scholar:

Parvez joined the government after the creation of Pakistan in 1947, but after Jinnah’s death in 1948, he was sidelined until he resigned from his post in 1956.
Why are you wasting our time by referring to sidelined scholars of no significance?

This is a caricature of Islam which liberals. atheists, and wayward Muslims try to create. It falls under the banner of spewing hate against Islam.
 

Leishangthem

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One thing if they were some grand historical edifices,but imagine ,not being able to touch any religious site from the tens of thousands ,with no historical significance? what is supposed to happen with city planning? a multimillion-dollar sky scrapper next to a decaying & crumbling religious site? actually, whole construction program can be shelved by an eyesore old crumbling structure if it's seen as untouchable,none will agree to invest there,no development , reconstruction ,city expansion ,nothing in such case ; lunatic propaganda.
 

jamahir

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The quoted section represents a typical effort by liberal elements to misrepresent Islam to suite their own agenda. In this case, the misrepresentation comprises promotion of lesser known and so called scholars who have no following amongst mainstream Muslims.
1. The first quoted Islamic scholar found that relation about a 100 years ago, long before you and I were born. :)

2. A larger number of followers shouldn't decide whether that set of thoughts should or should not be accepted. Even Islam was believed by very few initially. Ideas should be accepted based on rationality, sensibility and thoughtfulness.

Why are you wasting our time by referring to sidelined scholars of no significance?
Even Faiz Ahmed Faiz was sidelined in his last years but should that mean that his and his comrades' attempt at taking over the governance of Pakistan in 1951 must not be respected ?

You should see why these people, including those scholars you refer to, were sidelined and who sidelined them.

This is a caricature of Islam which liberals. atheists, and wayward Muslims try to create.
Again, why are these "wayward" Muslims the first ones to have their projects and thought sabotaged by the Western Crusader governments and the "non-wayward" Muslims the first ones to be armed, trained and politically-supported by the Western Crusader governments against the "wayward" Muslims ?
 
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Hack-Hook

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Is this not the common interpretation of Mosque? So is a person or city build a mosque, and it becometoo small, old etc.Can the people build another mosque in the vicinity and demolish an old one?

Of course there are special landmark mosques. But it just does not make sense to treat every mosque like it’s the mosques of Mecca or Medina.
first you must see the mosque belong to who. is it private , is it owned by the city , is it vaqf .
if its private the owner can do anything it want with it , if it is owned by the city , then its city official must decide what to do with it , and if its vaqf then nobody can touch it.
by the way when you decide to change a building its recommended you always consider its historical and cultural values and that's also something city official must decide on
 

Hack-Hook

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Yes, it is OK to tear down an old mosque and build a new one on the original site. This is again my limited knowledge. You should always contact a valid Mufti on these matters. I saw the Chinese government can tweet in Urdu. Most certainly you guys should be able to contact the Muftis here:
If somebody destroy a mosque , he must build a new one or pay for building one but as far as I'm aware there is no need for it to be in original place , it can be in a more suitable place
 

chinasun

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This is Urumqi, Xinjiang:




These are pictures of the Grand Bazaar in Urumqi, Xinjiang’s largest city, dated July 2019:


 
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silverox

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It's really annoying. We Chinese don't have to argue about this kind of thing every day and we just demolish illegal buildings. We, China, want to build a modern and powerful country. We should not discuss such useless things every day and waste our energy. These people talk about these useless things every day because they have a full stomach.
 

aziqbal

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Muslims bought by America turned a blind eye to the massacre of hundreds of thousands of Muslims by America
View attachment 779742
posts like this only give more credibility to such articles

when we talk about Palestinian being bombed usually Israel posts these kinds of images

the guilty will always try and blame others
This is Urumqi, Xinjiang:




These are pictures of the Grand Bazaar in Urumqi, Xinjiang’s largest city, dated July 2019:


1 word

FAKE
 

CriticalThought

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1. The first quoted Islamic scholar found that relation about a 100 years ago, long before you and I were born. :)

2. A larger number of followers shouldn't decide whether that set of thoughts should or should not be accepted. Even Islam was believed by very few initially. Ideas should be accepted based on rationality, sensibility and thoughtfulness.



Even Faiz Ahmed Faiz was sidelined in his last years but should that mean that his and his comrades' attempt at taking over the governance of Pakistan in 1951 must not be respected ?

You should see why these people, including those scholars you refer to, were sidelined and who sidelined them.



Again, why are these "wayward" Muslims the first ones to have their projects and thought sabotaged by the Western Crusader governments and the "non-wayward" Muslims the first ones to be armed, trained and politically-supported by the Western Crusader governments against the "wayward" Muslims ?
You are wasting time and derailing from the main discussion of the thread. Kindly take a step back, and clearly state what you are trying to say that is relevant to the topic of this thread. If there is something else you want to say, create another thread for it.
 

Sainthood 101

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@CriticalThought be stupid as hell, lol I have seen mosques being destroyed and replaced in Pakistan of all places lol
ik-pti.gif


I don't know what this man's talking about...

I am sure if in a Muslim majority- somewhat conservative society a mosque can be destroyed and replaced

Surely it's not as big a deal, stop being a weirdo in literally every thread I see you in
 

Sainthood 101

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Frankly, the Chinese govt likes to demolish churches&temples&mosques in commercial areas. Then build a new one in the residential area where believers are concentrated.
This can relieve the traffic pressure in the business district and facilitate believers to carry out religious activities.
Because the original address is in the business district, it is normal to build the Hilton Hotel.
This is good and perfectly fine as I have seen this happening
Ignore this fool lol...
 

CriticalThought

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@CriticalThought be stupid as hell, lol I have seen mosques being destroyed and replaced in Pakistan of all places lol
View attachment 780193

I don't know what this man's talking about...

I am sure if in a Muslim majority- somewhat conservative society a mosque can be destroyed and replaced

Surely it's not as big a deal, stop being a weirdo in literally every thread I see you in
Hey moron, where did you learn to address others like you address your own father? Pakistan is being ruled by liberal scumbags. The benchmark isn't what is happening in Pakistan, the benchmark is what valid Muftis say on religious topics. You are a typical libturd swine, Imran Khan's arsehole licker who holds a grudge against Islam and Muslims. I don't expect you to share anything useful on any thread.
This is good and perfectly fine as I have seen this happening
Ignore this fool lol...
And since you didn't see your own mother giving you birth, your birth could not be good and perfectly fine. Really sad to see the product of failed sperm polluting the forum.
 

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