• Monday, September 16, 2019

MILITARY MISSPENDING GONE WILD! THE UGANDA SU-30s

Discussion in 'Military Forum' started by kenyannoobie, Sep 11, 2019 at 5:37 PM.

  1. kenyannoobie

    kenyannoobie FULL MEMBER

    Messages:
    216
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2012
    Ratings:
    +0 / 179 / -0
    Country:
    Kenya
    Location:
    Kenya
    su1.jpg su2.jpg su3.jpg su4.jpg

    Everyone has an opinion-and the rest of the world must all suffer the sound of our expert opinion on boxing,climate change,politics and everything else under the sun. Occasionally however some people make genius decisions that make all competent observers go,"dude,WTF,my son!?"
    Case in point Museveni's 2011 choice to buy a half squadron of Su 30s. Laymen were amazed,Ugandan patriots screamed and clapped while knowledgeable analysts screeched with laughter-one in Nairobi made a bet with me swearing they'd all be grounded with max 3 years due to running costs.

    "According to Airnews magazine, the Ugandan Peoples Defence Force has acquired six of these modern fighters at a cost of $746 million, the last of which was delivered this year."
    https://www.businessdailyafrica.com...r-supremacy/3405664-1738478-cjxsqm/index.html

    On top of the FAC,the fly away cost,is the CPFH topping out at 7.5mn$ annually per Su 30 or 42 mn$ for all.

    http://nationsdawnofanera.weebly.com/-fighter-aircraft.html

    The UPDF budget 2019 is 600 mn$ for 50,000 servicemen training,pay,welfare,maintenance and acquisitions. Keeping the Sues flying would take 8% of that figure! Those earthern houses in the last pic are standard UPDF barrack housing (the big house is where the prez Museveni stays,ofc!)while transport is nonexistent with only 10 Mi 17s. You can only wonder at their TTPs when they lost half their attack gunships after 3 of their Hinds augured into Mt. Kenya 2012 en route to Somalia.

    su5.jpg su6.jpg

    "Sources say it was an unprecedented catalogue of mistakes, inexperience and bad orders from commanders that could have been the most likely causes of the triple helicopter crashes. There are claims that the choppers switched from their original flight plan which would have seen them fly north of the mountain towards their destination in Wajir but instead flew south of the mountain leading them into thick fog.

    A Kenyan newspaper also reported that contrary to well established international aviation rules and regulations, the pilots of Uganda’s three ill-fated Mi-24 attack helicopters that crashed in the Mt Kenya ranges were communicating in Luganda.

    The newspaper also reported that the Kenyan aviation authority could hear UPDF soldiers as they communicated among themselves in Luganda – just minutes before the crash. They crashed after 30 minutes into their flight before realising there was bad weather ahead."

    https://www.monitor.co.ug/SpecialRe...oppers-crash/688342-3352880-kqsbnj/index.html


    Museveni planned on a full squadron of these heavyweight 4.5++ gen jets to be paid for with oil from the newly discovered L Albert basin on the DRC border but its still in the ground since 2006 discovery. Dictators generally don't consult-if he were so inclined he could've asked the IAF or Malaysians their experience with the Russians getting them to fulfill their after sales maintenance agreements:an Indian insider told me they variously screamed, wept and pleaded with them to no avail.

    Anyway another 2 were bought,1 was written off and another badly damaged in a crash and the remaining 6 are grounded on the apron at Entebbe airport. While flyable the flyguys would stampede over the border to cash in on their 500 hours in 4.5++gen jets and quickly convert to airline jets with Kenya airways earning 3x their pay. Imagine the opportunity cost! He could've gone for a similar number of rebuilt Su 25s and/or Tucs but what's done is done and the money is down the hole.

    Anyway,while we variously criticise the cost of buying and building subs,carriers, new MBTs,frigates etc etc remember this story.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 5
  2. Beast

    Beast ELITE MEMBER

    Messages:
    15,675
    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Ratings:
    +6 / 38,187 / -38
    Country:
    China
    Location:
    China
    Su-27/Su-30 planes are expensive in maintenance.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1
  3. war&peace

    war&peace ELITE MEMBER

    Messages:
    32,617
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2015
    Ratings:
    +26 / 57,277 / -9
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Sweden
    After reading this I personally think that a squadron of JF17 thunders can be more than sufficient for Uganda's air force given if PAF agrees to sell after seeing what they did to SU30s
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019 at 6:33 PM
    • Thanks Thanks x 7
  4. kenyannoobie

    kenyannoobie FULL MEMBER

    Messages:
    216
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2012
    Ratings:
    +0 / 179 / -0
    Country:
    Kenya
    Location:
    Kenya
    Dude;here is their defence budget 2019:"Given that initially the allocation towards defence was about Shs.2.2 trillion (Approx. $600 million)"
    https://www.independent.co.ug/museveni-doubles-military-spending/


    You've seen how short the UPDF is of everything welfare,platforms,kinetic ability,force multipliers etc etc and you want them to fork over 35 mn$ for 12 Block 2 JF-17s to fight these mofos in the DRC,S Sudan and CAR!?


    SU7.jpg SU8.jpg

    SU9.jpg

    With an annual operating cost of 2.25 mn$ or 25 mn$ in total. Also bear in mind Uganda is a 5th world country with a GDP per capita of barely 800$. Before buying any weapons system the questions are threat matrix and cost followed by survivability,useability etc,etc:can you really justify a new squadron of new JF 17s for Uganda now?
     
  5. war&peace

    war&peace ELITE MEMBER

    Messages:
    32,617
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2015
    Ratings:
    +26 / 57,277 / -9
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Sweden
    I didn't say that they should buy JF17s now. I'm rather skeptical that even PAF will agree the way they treated Su30s but what I said is that they should have gone for JF17s instead of Su30's because it is much more suitable for them. It is smaller airplane at a much lower price but very capable and upgradable. Much easier and cheaper to both fly and maintain while the related infrastructure required is also smaller like smaller pens, sheds, repair shops, etc. Thus Ugandian airforce would be flying these airplanes are lot more as compared to SU30's and a lot more useful airplane than Su30 for them.
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2019 at 4:16 PM
  6. AZADPAKISTAN2009

    AZADPAKISTAN2009 ELITE MEMBER

    Messages:
    29,607
    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2009
    Ratings:
    +39 / 29,171 / -2
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    China
    They are better off to build their ground forces with Pakistan's Heavey Machinery

    a) Tanks
    b) Trucks
    c) APC
    d) Weaponry + Ammo

    They should sell the Su-30 to Pakistan in return for Ground Equipment
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2019 at 8:57 PM
    • Thanks Thanks x 3
  7. CHI RULES

    CHI RULES FULL MEMBER

    Messages:
    1,460
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2015
    Ratings:
    +0 / 1,082 / -1
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Pakistan
    Sir considering situation in Nigeria even selling them the JF17s may have it's demerits in future.
     
  8. Alternatiiv

    Alternatiiv SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    2,859
    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2018
    Ratings:
    +15 / 3,843 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Turkey
    How about no planes. Uganda doesn't need jets. They need gunship helicopters and infrastructure.
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 3
  9. war&peace

    war&peace ELITE MEMBER

    Messages:
    32,617
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2015
    Ratings:
    +26 / 57,277 / -9
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Sweden
    pls read post #5

    why sir?
     
  10. T|/|T

    T|/|T FULL MEMBER

    Messages:
    568
    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2019
    Ratings:
    +0 / 722 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Pakistan
    Actually this is all corruption. Russians might have given huge kickbacks to the few powerful. This shows if leaders are not sincere, and are corrupt, there is no way the country can rise.
     
  11. Alternatiiv

    Alternatiiv SENIOR MEMBER

    Messages:
    2,859
    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2018
    Ratings:
    +15 / 3,843 / -0
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Turkey
    Not about how they treat the jet. It's just that they don't have a purpose for these jets. There are militias, and for terrain like that of Uganda which is very plane, helicopters are enough to bomb militias. And they can be used for relief and rescue purposes as well.

    Just my opinion, not an expert.
     
  12. kenyannoobie

    kenyannoobie FULL MEMBER

    Messages:
    216
    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2012
    Ratings:
    +0 / 179 / -0
    Country:
    Kenya
    Location:
    Kenya
    Wish I could give you 2 likes!
     
  13. war&peace

    war&peace ELITE MEMBER

    Messages:
    32,617
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2015
    Ratings:
    +26 / 57,277 / -9
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Sweden
    read my post # 5 again.
     
  14. CHI RULES

    CHI RULES FULL MEMBER

    Messages:
    1,460
    Joined:
    Mar 23, 2015
    Ratings:
    +0 / 1,082 / -1
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Pakistan
    Nigeria is one of the highest corrupt country and especially their military is most famous in this trait, they may repeat foolishness of Uganda due to unavailability of technical capabilities and shear dishonesty, if any thing happens to their purchased JF17, it may bring bad name for product. Our hi tech defense products should be sold only to countries which can handle them properly.
     
  15. war&peace

    war&peace ELITE MEMBER

    Messages:
    32,617
    Joined:
    Aug 12, 2015
    Ratings:
    +26 / 57,277 / -9
    Country:
    Pakistan
    Location:
    Sweden
    Actually if you just follow the stereotypes then yes but if you follow the news..The new president is not corrupt and trying to eliminate corruption from his country. Nigeria has much larger resources and much bigger country and still they ordered a small number of JF17s so it shows they are not stupid and doing things methodically.

    A Kenyan worried about Uganda's acquisition of fighterjets sounds so familiar
     
    • Thanks Thanks x 1