What's new

Mechanised Divisions Pakistan Army

iLION12345_1

FULL MEMBER
May 1, 2016
1,890
12
5,517
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
In the first picture, does the cage serve to sand bags as additional protection or just to carry supplies.
View attachment 775599
In this picture it's being used to carry sand bags.
Can be used for carrying stuff too but in these cases, protection. M113 cannot stop HMG rounds (12.7) from the side. Only upto 7.62MM. So heavier sniper and HMG bullets remain a threat, hence the sandbags. Keep in mind sandbags are extremely effective at stopping bullets so even just one sandbag there is going to stop any small arms ammo, it’s obviously not ideal but it’s definitely an upgrade. In PA the other versions of M113 (Saad) have increased armor at the sides too to help with this, and the VCC variants even mount ERA in some cases for further increased protection.

At the end of the day all of this is less ideal than actual Modern APCs, but any benefit is better than none, especially considering the BMPs used by the adversary’s dont fare better in this regard.
 

Desert Fox 1

FULL MEMBER
Aug 11, 2020
1,046
2
2,270
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
PA doesn't like to use side skirts in exercises perhaps.
Commander Bahawalpur Corps Visits Bridge Company at Asrani


The Commander visited the Bridge Training Area, where he was welcomed by GOC Mechanized Division. He was also briefed about the conduct of bridge training being conducted as part of operational readiness cycle.

View attachment 775580 View attachment 775579


View attachment 775585
The 2nd set of images is of the time when Sher Afgun was the corps commander thus must be of before 2018.
Also it seems that 26 mech has AK-1, AK, as well as Type-85II.
 

PanzerKiel

MILITARY PROFESSIONAL
Dec 5, 2006
2,950
160
18,392
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
Can be used for carrying stuff too but in these cases, protection. M113 cannot stop HMG rounds (12.7) from the side. Only upto 7.62MM. So heavier sniper and HMG bullets remain a threat, hence the sandbags. Keep in mind sandbags are extremely effective at stopping bullets so even just one sandbag there is going to stop any small arms ammo, it’s obviously not ideal but it’s definitely an upgrade. In PA the other versions of M113 (Saad) have increased armor at the sides too to help with this, and the VCC variants even mount ERA in some cases for further increased protection.

At the end of the day all of this is less ideal than actual Modern APCs, but any benefit is better than none, especially considering the BMPs used by the adversary’s dont fare better in this regard.
M113 can stop 12.7 mm rounds from all sides.

Sandbags are mainly there to protect the crew compartment from RPG and SPG 9 rounds by decreasing their effectiveness.
 

MilSpec

ELITE MEMBER
Feb 19, 2011
12,567
36
22,825
Country
India
Location
United States
M113 can stop 12.7 mm rounds from all sides.

Sandbags are mainly there to protect the crew compartment from RPG and SPG 9 rounds by decreasing their effectiveness.
M113, A1 and A2 variants, Which is the bulk of your fleet are rated for protection againt 7.62x51 and shell fragmentation.

Even The M113A3 was designed to provide protection against a standard 7.62mm threat.

The M113’s minimal armor offered protection against small arms and artillery fragmentation but not against hits from weapons of 14.5mm and higher. Although appliqué armor could be applied, it never became standard issue.
 

PanzerKiel

MILITARY PROFESSIONAL
Dec 5, 2006
2,950
160
18,392
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
M113, A1 and A2 variants, Which is the bulk of your fleet are rated for protection againt 7.62x51 and shell fragmentation.

Even The M113A3 was designed to provide protection against a standard 7.62mm threat.

The M113’s minimal armor offered protection against small arms and artillery fragmentation but not against hits from weapons of 14.5mm and higher. Although appliqué armor could be applied, it never became standard issue.
Of course, 14.5 would be an issue.

I said about 12.7 mm, they all are rated for against these calibers. M113 can protect itself against 12.7 mm. It had been a norm for them to get hit from 12.7 mm weapons of terrorists, but they're has not been one instance in which they have been even disabled by 12.7 weapons.

12.7 mm weapons are available with normal infantry units on both sides. No one would like to induct a platform giving protection against 7.62 only.
 

Signalian

PDF THINK TANK: CONSULTANT
Aug 18, 2015
7,450
227
20,344
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
In the first picture, does the cage serve to sand bags as additional protection or just to carry supplies.
View attachment 775599
In this picture it's being used to carry sand bags.
Is that a LMG on mount ?
In the first picture, does the cage serve to sand bags as additional protection or just to carry supplies.
View attachment 775599
In this picture it's being used to carry sand bags.
Considering this a COIN Ops, supplies shouldn't be an issue. Added protection is a requirement. Have you seen cages installed around Stryker or M-113 serving in Iraq and Afghanistan ? same solution.
 

MilSpec

ELITE MEMBER
Feb 19, 2011
12,567
36
22,825
Country
India
Location
United States
Of course, 14.5 would be an issue.

I said about 12.7 mm, they all are rated for against these calibers. M113 can protect itself against 12.7 mm. It had been a norm for them to get hit from 12.7 mm weapons of terrorists, but they're has not been one instance in which they have been even disabled by 12.7 weapons.

12.7 mm weapons are available with normal infantry units on both sides. No one would like to induct a platform giving protection against 7.62 only.
COL William T. Nuckols Jr. and Dr. Robert S. Cameron
1630812136470.png




United States General Accounting Office Report to Congressional Committees

1630812465442.png




 

PanzerKiel

MILITARY PROFESSIONAL
Dec 5, 2006
2,950
160
18,392
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan

iLION12345_1

FULL MEMBER
May 1, 2016
1,890
12
5,517
Country
Pakistan
Location
Pakistan
COL William T. Nuckols Jr. and Dr. Robert S. Cameron
View attachment 775648



United States General Accounting Office Report to Congressional Committees

View attachment 775649



Panzerkiel is also correct, because of the many thousands of the M113s in service with the PA, more than half are Talha, Saad or VCC variants which Do have protection from 12.7mm, they have been up-armored (the local ones with thicker armor in general and the Italian ones with add on armor and ERA).
Whereas the regular M113 that were bought from America are only rated for 7.62MM at the sides, it has been noted in actual combat they can usually stop 12.7MM (thank angles for the reason!), but the added side armor as sandbags is there for this reason on these base M113s, to ensure nothing gets through.
Is that a LMG on mount ?

Considering this a COIN Ops, supplies shouldn't be an issue. Added protection is a requirement. Have you seen cages installed around Stryker or M-113 serving in Iraq and Afghanistan ? same solution.
Yep, MG3 on the mount.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 1, Members: 0, Guests: 1)


Top Bottom