• Tuesday, December 12, 2017

Lost 3 crore, I need help

Discussion in 'Members Club' started by Talwar e Pakistan, Dec 8, 2017 at 1:09 AM.

  1. Talwar e Pakistan

    Talwar e Pakistan SENIOR MEMBER

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    My father and I live in the U.S and we have a lot of property in Pakistan in which we sell and buy to make money. We cannot make constant trips, so my father's handler for this business is his brother who my father trusted really well and we had bought/sold many properties through him.

    We sold a plot worth around 3 crore (around 260,000 dollars) and the check/cash was given to my uncle in his name by the buyer. My uncle lost all of the money within a span of 15-20 days to gambling inflicting a large financial and emotional blow to the family.

    There is little that we can do against the gambling mafia as they are dangerous and have lots of influence and connections, taking any action against them can threaten your life and the life of your family members.

    Is there anything that can be done to recover this money through legal methods considering that gambling is illegal in Pakistan? I know it's pretty hopeless at this point, but are there any options?

    My uncle was near to committing suicide and we would not like to press any legal actions against him. If it's possible, legal action should be directed towards the gamblers instead.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017 at 1:41 AM
  2. Mitho1980

    Mitho1980 FULL MEMBER

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    Yup dont even trust ur shadow with ur money these days... Now u have learnt a lesson. Move on.
     
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  3. The Diplomat

    The Diplomat FULL MEMBER

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    First of all i'm sorry to hear such news, it's a cancer to Pakistani society and especially overseas Pakistani that want to invest in Pakistan.

    May I ask where the plot was, if the plot was in Bahria Town I would suggest writing to Malik Riaz, he's actually very helpful and can probably help in one way or another. I know who had somewhat of a terrible experience (not similar to yours) and he wrote to Malik Riaz who helped him. If the plot is located in DHA then maybe try writing to your local Corps Commander or visiting DHA office, I would say that the staff at DHA are not helpful but it's worth a try.

    Secondly I would suggest to you is taking the matter to court, sir I know that these Mafias are influential and have connections however the amount stated above is a lot of money for one and secondly it's your right to take the matter to court.

    If the check has not been cashed yet and only been swapped between parties then I suggest you quickly ring up the person that wrote the cheque and tell them to call their bank and to stop any transactions from taking place for the time being.

    Please, do you really expect some one to move on from an investment like that, please use your mind.
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017 at 1:30 AM
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  4. AZADPAKISTAN2009

    AZADPAKISTAN2009 ELITE MEMBER

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    Well technically no gambling exist where you can lose 260,000 USD , it must be sitting in your Uncle's bank account

    Unless you gave your uncle rights to property (power) he can't ask the seller to give him money under his name. If your family gave up the rights willingly. And if he owned the rights to selling there is not much that can be done here

    If check was issued to your Uncle's name the bank he deposited the cash should have a record of when he took out the money I doubt it would be on same day
     
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  5. somebozo

    somebozo ELITE MEMBER

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    1. Your father trusted a gambler to handle his hard earned money..WOW..just WOW.
    2. Does your uncle have a power of attorney from your Father? if not this could be treated as impersonation.
    3. Now you became a party in funding illegal gambling.
    4. If taxes were not paid, this will also be a case of tax evasion as commercial trading of property is treated as business.
    5. If you are US national and a person was owning / operating business as your proxy, this further complicates the situation. As it may be treated as tax evasion on overseas income by US citizen by nominee ownership.
    6. And finally, your uncle does not need to handle cash / cheque under his sole responsibility. Payments can me made via cross cheque and they can go directly to your father account.
    7. If proceeds from previous sale has made its way to USA via informal hundi/hawal channels, then this is another serious offense of money laundering along with tax evasion.
    8. Without satisfactory and accurate documentary trail, not only your uncle can have the case dismissed as revenge for family feud but it can also turn around against you as an offense of defamation by false legal proceedings.
    So you can register a FIR and lodge a complain with FIA, but it will be largely against your favor without being able to present top notch accurate documentation. Your uncle is probably not that foolish, he has stashed the money safely and the gambling story only seems to be a cover for disappeared money.
     
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  6. Skyliner

    Skyliner FULL MEMBER

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    According to my info you can't do anything legally,
    Even if you file a suit, the recovered money won't be handed back to you. It will just be passed towards govt exchequer, because of gambling.
     
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  7. somebozo

    somebozo ELITE MEMBER

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    Once you engage in illegal activity, one becomes a party to it.
    The safest bet is to not engage in gambling at all..

    Once money enters into any kind of illegal gambling / betting , it is treated as black money and belongs to the government. Even if money is recovered, you will not get a penny and may even be sued for legal penalties.

    Your uncle isnt that stupid, he has launched a perfect cover story to part you from your cash..
     
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  8. AZADPAKISTAN2009

    AZADPAKISTAN2009 ELITE MEMBER

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    Your father / you can actually Open a fraud case against your uncle , and demand the Banks where he deposited the checks show if the money indeed was removed from it after check cleared

    How long the courts will take to pass a judgement so Banks would be obliged to disclose the financial track history of your uncle god knows if they is possible.

    However owning Property in Pakistan while abroad is not illegal :coffee:

    However , let it be known in Pakistan , you can't move that kind of Money easyly
     
  9. Divergent

    Divergent FULL MEMBER

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    I’m sorry for the loss and I hope it gets resolved
     
  10. haman10

    haman10 ELITE MEMBER

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    Holy goddamn. 260K lost for gambling? thats just beyond any human can ever do. you must give your uncle a medal for that.
     
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  11. somebozo

    somebozo ELITE MEMBER

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    Using other people bank account is illegal and keeping deposits into someone else account by proxy can be treated as assets concealment. And since US nationals are involved, you are looking at a complicated outlook here
     
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  12. The Diplomat

    The Diplomat FULL MEMBER

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    This is a good idea, you can lodge a complaint with Banking Mohtasib, my father money was taken from his account without permission recently from the Bank Manager and my father wrote to the Banking Mohtasib and they got the problem sorted in a few weeks. Very good service.
    http://www.bankingmohtasib.gov.pk/complaints.php
     
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  13. AZADPAKISTAN2009

    AZADPAKISTAN2009 ELITE MEMBER

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    Well property / company assets all can be entrusted to a third party world wide a lawyer or trust or someone close

    It all really depends on having power of Attorney which basically allows your uncle all sort of rights

    Typically the third part is a Trust / Law firm, to protect the abuse of theft / fraud

    When someone dies , the same powers are invoked , to distribute the funds to the remaining family members etc (i.e your lawyer's law firm and Trust)


    • Launch fraud case
    • Get record of financial transaction from your uncle's bank
    • Confirm money was released or not (Banks normally won't cooperate till there is Court order)
    • If it is sitting in his bank account commence the recovery process
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017 at 1:44 AM
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  14. Talwar e Pakistan

    Talwar e Pakistan SENIOR MEMBER

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    Yes you're right, my bad, it was lost within a span of 15-20 days - I misunderstood my father.

    Also, we gave my uncle the rights to sell the property.
     
  15. AZADPAKISTAN2009

    AZADPAKISTAN2009 ELITE MEMBER

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    Well if you gave away the power of attorney / rights , then unfortunately it would be very difficult you will still have to contact a good law firm in Pakistan to get legal advice on this

    The power of attorney / rights to property etc is suppose to grant the other person "FULL" rights to do what they wish with the property from legal prespective.

    • Unless you can demonstrate (By means of signed agreement) the money should have gone into your father's Bank Account (and money never came), Obviously the taxes become payable once the money actually reaches your Father's account. If it went to your uncle's account it is due on him not before he explains why it went to his account. Obviously you are looking at written proof/ agreement
    • It would be in interest of state of Pakistan, to assit you in such case, as they would be able to recover the Tax on that sale which your uncle must obviously have not paid. With understanding that your father would have in good faith paid these taxes with successful transfer of funds to their own account

    There is no such thing as spending 260k on Gambling
     
    Last edited: Dec 8, 2017 at 1:59 AM