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Lack of focus on indigenous solutions

Pak Nationalist

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Why do military-linked commercial ventures become profitable, but defense manufacturing institutions like HIT struggle in making anything worthwhile (other than manufacturing equipment based on ToT and then not pursuing advancements/innovations in transferred technologies)? Is the solution corporatization of defense enterprises on the same lines Askari-led businesses undergo?
 

Pappa Alpha

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Making indigenous solutions involves taking risks. Taking risks is not a path usually chosen by someone looking for a hurdle free promotion.
 

fitpOsitive

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Making indigenous solutions involves taking risks. Taking risks is not a path usually chosen by someone looking for a hurdle free promotion.
R&D is not militarys job. It's a work purely undertaken by civilian organizations or other corporate entities.
In Pakistan military is doing a lot of stuff, that in my opinion military shouldn't be allowed to do, especially defense production.
Every department should do its own work.
 
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Aamir Hussain

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Investment will only happen if there is a long term commitment on the part of MoD to encourage local production. The route is simple, license production from kits, deletion through local parts, and then upgrade and evolution to a better variant that can be labeled as ones own indigenous production. But to do this one needs long term contracts and commitment towards indiginization.

The easiest to do is local production of Trucks and MRAPS. Identify a heavy duty chassis, pick out a powerful engine off the shelf, look for a robust axle, and carefully select a differential/gearbox to go with the engine train and the axles. Mate them on the selected chassis and the rest is all design and metal fabrication and mechanical integration. The armored sheets can be imported first then we can ask Special Steel based out of Karachi to work out production. Run flat tires can be imported. I believe bullet proof glass can be sourced within Pakistan or can be imported from out side for the time being.

If there is a robust demand for these MRAPS say over a ten year period, then PA should place an order of procuring X number of vehicles over a ten year period. The down stream industry that is producing autoparts like Balochistan Wheels (Allow and metal wheel rims), Agriautos (Shock absorbers and other parts), Balochistan Glass (Wind shields), Thal Engineering (electrical harness), The General Tyre and Rubber, Thermal Systems (Air Conditioning and heating) and many more, can then be included in the production and supply to this project.

I have made it seem a simple project but it can be done if the will is there. For starters we can look at GAZ trucks out of Russia that are robust and can be licensed produced as far as the chassis and power train is concerned.
 

Blacklight

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Investment will only happen if there is a long term commitment on the part of MoD to encourage local production. The route is simple, license production from kits, deletion through local parts, and then upgrade and evolution to a better variant that can be labeled as ones own indigenous production. But to do this one needs long term contracts and commitment towards indiginization.

The easiest to do is local production of Trucks and MRAPS. Identify a heavy duty chassis, pick out a powerful engine off the shelf, look for a robust axle, and carefully select a differential/gearbox to go with the engine train and the axles. Mate them on the selected chassis and the rest is all design and metal fabrication and mechanical integration. The armored sheets can be imported first then we can ask Special Steel based out of Karachi to work out production. Run flat tires can be imported. I believe bullet proof glass can be sourced within Pakistan or can be imported from out side for the time being.

If there is a robust demand for these MRAPS say over a ten year period, then PA should place an order of procuring X number of vehicles over a ten year period. The down stream industry that is producing autoparts like Balochistan Wheels (Allow and metal wheel rims), Agriautos (Shock absorbers and other parts), Balochistan Glass (Wind shields), Thal Engineering (electrical harness), The General Tyre and Rubber, Thermal Systems (Air Conditioning and heating) and many more, can then be included in the production and supply to this project.

I have made it seem a simple project but it can be done if the will is there. For starters we can look at GAZ trucks out of Russia that are robust and can be licensed produced as far as the chassis and power train is concerned.
Agree on all points, except that, Run Flat tyres have an extra inner rim, that can be manufactured locally as well.
 

Bossman

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Why do military-linked commercial ventures become profitable, but defense manufacturing institutions like HIT struggle in making anything worthwhile (other than manufacturing equipment based on ToT and then not pursuing advancements/innovations in transferred technologies)? Is the solution corporatization of defense enterprises on the same lines Askari-led businesses undergo?
Even with a bigger industrial base India tried many times and failed.
 

Pak Nationalist

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Making indigenous solutions involves taking risks. Taking risks is not a path usually chosen by someone looking for a hurdle free promotion.
Most of these commercial ventures in the civilian sphere are led by retired officials. Could handing over the reins of defense production and research facilities in the hands of retired officers be another potential solution? I think we all agree on the nature of problems, we should discuss potential solutions.
R&D is not militarys job. It's a work purely undertaken by civilian organizations or other corporate entities.
In Pakistan military is doing a lot of stuff, that in my opinion military shouldn't be allowed to do, especially defense production.
Every department should do its own work.
Do you mean following the DRDO model? NESCOM has a heavy civilian presence, but I guess the leadership roles are filled by people from military backgrounds. Are you suggesting making these organizations civilian-run and civilian-led?
Even with a bigger industrial base India tried many times and failed.
They are succeeding as well. You can't succeed if you don't try. Can we sustain the increasing asymmetry in both conventional and strategic realms without indigenizing solutions considering there is a limit to what we can buy off the shelf from the world due to geopolitical and economic limitations?
 
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Jf-17 block 3

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A mbda type consortium between Pakistan, Turkey, Qatar and Malaysia will be really beneficial to all countries
 

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