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JF-17 vs Rafale: Why Pakistani JF-17 Thunder Poses A Serious Threat To Indian Rafale Fighter Jets?

rent4country

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Interestingly, every other news item from India especially is talking about upcoming JF-17 Block-III model and that doesn't looks like just a theoretical approach based upon open information from public domain. India is well in knowledge as what thunder Block-II did on 27th February and can imagine what Block-III can be. On other note, IAF wants more money for quantity of latest gadgets in more numbers fearing the outcome when it is about quality and skills.

Indian Air Force is just shying away to accept it openly in regard to February, 2019 but has to come with twists & more of media articles as a bargain for more budget in view of a capable platform like JF-17s. Why don't we hear IAF preparing or referring to F-16s possible Block-70/72? Of-course, they do know what the upcoming Block-III is going to do. To enforce such argument, one can see that despite being upgraded the fleet and purchasing latest Rafale with all the goodies, IAF still need more & more and that is not just the corruption but fear as well.

IAF chief has already seen it coming and its like preparing excuses in advance either not to be bothered by Indian Establishment for any action or in-case of face-off, shall never be blamed for any losses. A planned homework with demand of more & more weapons which is not going to be fulfilled soon hence, there is a lot of time for preparedness. I don't think that PAF will stop at JF-17 Block-III only.
When china refuses to induct and use any version of JF-17, considering how deadly and potent you think this platform is, does that make you wonder why? Alternatively, can you name a single frontline aircraft we or any NATO partner exports that we/they don't use themselves?
 
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Mrc

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When china refuses to induct and use any version of JF-17, considering how deadly and potent you think this platform is, does that make you wonder why? Alternatively, can you name a single frontline aircraft we or any NATO partner exports that we/they don't use themselves?

I m saying for beggining it's a total shiit fighter...

Indians don't need to worry about it
 

Beast

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When china refuses to induct and use any version of JF-17, considering how deadly and potent you think this platform is, does that make you wonder why? Alternatively, can you name a single frontline aircraft we or any NATO partner exports that we/they don't use themselves?
F-5EII Tiger made by American and it export to a variety of countries and it's well received. It is used as aggressor in USAF but never the frontline service.

Btw, JF-17 now exported to Myanmar and Nigeria.
 

dbc

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You are correct with regards to JF-17 being (relatively) under-powered, but assuming that the future of aerial skirmishes in the Subcontinent lies entirely in the BVR domain, I don't see how that variable can't be offset by other variables such as swarm tactics, diversions, and radar jamming. Now I understand that the Rafale's powerful radar and Meteor missile would enable it to fire upon Pakistani targets while staying within Indian airspace, and it could pick off targets in Pakistani airspace based on data-link with Sukhois or Migs. If these front-line fighters encounter radar jamming a la 27th Feb, the Rafale would have a reduced battlefield picture at best.
The JF-17's maneuverability is its limiting factor but if its PL-15s and AESA radar can enable it to declare Fox 3 before the Rafale gets a shot off, then I don't see why JF-17s wouldn't stay behind the F16s.

In summation, assuming Pakistan aggressively jams the radars of Indian interceptors flying CAPs by the border, and if the F16s maintain closer proximity to their side of the border to deal with the Sukhois and Migs, the JF17s could (theoretically) be positioned further back and in larger numbers to deal with the advanced BVR capabilities of the Rafale. So you are correct in stating that until the JF17's airframe and engine are on par with the Block 52 F16s, the Vipers will occupy a niche of their own. But all of this is just a hypothetical scenario based on my opinions: one that does not take into account how India's supposedly revised post-Balakot aerial warfare doctrine will pan out.
Sorry the sweet spot for BVR engagement between agile fighters is 20 NM to 40 NM anything else is a wasted missile. Thrust, agility, SA, pilot training, counter measures all pay an import role in survivability. Plus Russian engines isn’t suited to sub continent conditions neither is the French motor part of the reason the Emirat’s are dragging their heals over their purchase. The French engine Is vastly superior to Russian ones in reliability and service life so the Indians will be able to sustain much higher ops tempo with their M88s and F404/ F414.

JF 17 will prove a decent mud mover but it will be out matched by most Indian platforms in AA combat. The PAF have vastly superior personnel but they aren’t miracle workers so PAF has the upper hand in minor skirmishes but will be overwhelmed if fighting prevails for more than a week.
 

Mrc

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F-5EII Tiger made by American and it export to a variety of countries and it's well received. It is used as aggressor in USAF but never the frontline service.

Btw, JF-17 now exported to Myanmar and Nigeria.

F 15 silent Eagle never made it to US Airforce stealthy version of f 15 with heavy Ram coating and most advanced f 15 avionics was supplied to overseas buyers including saudi

F 16 block 60 supplied to UAE and sufa supplied to Israel while US continued to use block 52
 

rent4country

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F-5EII Tiger made by American and it export to a variety of countries and it's well received. It is used as aggressor in USAF but never the frontline service.

Btw, JF-17 now exported to Myanmar and Nigeria.
I asked, is there a single military aircraft(platform) the American military exported that it did not use itself. If JF-17 is such potent aircraft as claimed, then it's a fair question to ask - how come the Chinese airforce does not include it in its inventory?
 

Beast

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I asked, is there a single military aircraft(platform) the American military exported that it did not use itself. If JF-17 is such potent aircraft as claimed, then it's a fair question to ask - how come the Chinese airforce does not include it in its inventory?
Pakistan ask for our help to design an aircraft they want and we do it. What is wrong with that? It uses RD-93 engine which is another type which we don't want to introduce to our fleet to complicate our logistic maintenance. Any problem?
F 15 silent Eagle never made it to US Airforce stealthy version of f 15 with heavy Ram coating and most advanced f 15 avionics was supplied to overseas buyers including saudi

F 16 block 60 supplied to UAE and sufa supplied to Israel while US continued to use block 52
Silent eagle is just a modified version of F-15 widely used in USAF.
 

rent4country

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Pakistan ask for our help to design an aircraft they want and we do it. What is wrong with that? It uses RD-93 engine which is another type which we don't want to introduce to our fleet to complicate our logistic maintenance. Any problem?

Silent eagle is just a modified version of F-15 widely used in USAF.
you introduced a few SU 35s, so you were happy to add multiple different kinds of engines to your ecosystem with no issue. Besides Jf-17 has over 300 in service- and you have created an ecosystem for other countries in China.

The claims made of this aircraft are lofty here, surely such a lofty aircraft would be needed in your arsenal?
 

Path-Finder

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The claims made of this aircraft are lofty here, surely such a lofty aircraft would be needed in your arsenal?
isn't the mighty supreme techlologically advanced teja getting more of a push to sell to customers abroad then its receiving any attention in its own nation? by force its being introduced into your vayu sena.

okay the yanks created F20 tiger shark for export but not for their own consumption. what will you say about that concept? since you sit in yankiville! F5 is another example that someone gave earlier.

just being pathetic for the sake of being pathetic.
 

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Sorry the sweet spot for BVR engagement between agile fighters is 20 NM to 40 NM anything else is a wasted missile. Thrust, agility, SA, pilot training, counter measures all pay an import role in survivability. Plus Russian engines isn’t suited to sub continent conditions neither is the French motor part of the reason the Emirat’s are dragging their heals over their purchase. The French engine Is vastly superior to Russian ones in reliability and service life so the Indians will be able to sustain much higher ops tempo with their M88s and F404/ F414.

JF 17 will prove a decent mud mover but it will be out matched by most Indian platforms in AA combat. The PAF have vastly superior personnel but they aren’t miracle workers so PAF has the upper hand in minor skirmishes but will be overwhelmed if fighting prevails for more than a week.
Who says fighting will continue more than a week. Probably by that time, Nukes will come into the play. Pakistan is conventionally inferior against India. So, we shall use them if necessary, but then, it would mean we are at the brink of being defeated and out of any other options (surrender is not on table).
 
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Who says fighting will continue more than a week. Probably by that time, Nukes will come into the play. Pakistan is conventionally inferior against India. So, we shall use them if necessary, but then, it would mean we are at the brink of being defeated and out of any other options (surrender is not on table).
I am 200% sure! There would never be a full scale war between India vs Pakistan or india vs china.

Small incidents and drama only will be continued.

No one wants a full scale of war.. If happens then no one will be winner for sure.
 

GumNaam

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I am 200% sure! There would never be a full scale war between India vs Pakistan or india vs china.

Small incidents and drama only will be continued.

No one wants a full scale of war.. If happens then no one will be winner for sure.
no war is needed. india is already falling apart. but then again, precisely because of the fact that india is falling apart, they may just drag the entire neighborhood down along with them.

hum tau doobain gay, tumhay bhi lay doobain gay sanam...as they say.
 

bahadur

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According to the Global Times and secondary research by the EurAsian Times, the latest, powered-up version of the JF-17 fighter jet reportedly features technologies from China’s high-end J-20 fighter jet that will immensely boost its combat efficiency.

According to pictures disseminated on various social media platform, the JF-17 aircraft is installed with many commercial off-the-shelf technologies from the state-owned Aviation Industry Corporation of China.

These include a new and larger holographic wide-angle head-up display and integrated cockpit display comparable to the one used by the J-20, in addition to an advanced infrared missile approach warning system used by J-20 fighter jets.


Analysts said the new additions to the JF-17 can give pilots more situational awareness, permitting them to concentrate more on combat instead of flying the aircraft. In March 2019, Yang Wei, chief designer of the fighter jet, said development and production of the JF-17 Block 3 were underway, and the third block will see the JF-17’s information-based warfare capability and weapons enhanced.


PL-15 Missiles For JF-17 ::

The reports regarding the deployment of longer-ranged Chinese PL-15 missiles on an upgraded JF-17 jet have caused anxiety in the Indian Air Force. Global Times earlier reported that the upgraded JF-17 will host an infrared search and track system along with a cross-section radar that lessens the pseudo-stealthy airframe. The PL-15’s beyond visual range missile has reportedly also caused serious worry in the Pentagon.

The PL-15’s striking range in actual aerial engagements is definitely lower than the maximum range 300 km but is nevertheless much greater than its US’ AIM-120 AMRAAM estimated to be approximately 180 km.

US general Herbert Carlisle voiced serious concerns in 2015 when the development of the PL-15 entered the public domain: “Look at our adversaries and what they’re developing, things like the PL-15 and the range of that weapon.” General Carlisle raised the same issue in an interview with FlightGlobal: “The PL-15 and the range of that missile, we’ve got to be able to out-stick that missile.”

The PL-15 missile, which is a radar-guided weapon, is advertised as having a greater range than both US-built AMRAAM and the Russian R-77, which is in service with the Indian Air Force.

With a length of over 4metres, the PL-15 is much longer than the AMRAAM and has a powerful radar and rocket motor. Experts writing for EurAsian Times maintain that the fundamental role of the PL-15 is to demolish ‘high-value’ targets such as airborne early-warning aircraft (AWACS) and aerial refuelling aircraft, which could handicap any opponent including the US.

The PL-15 uses a conventional rocket motor, unlike the Meteor missile which will be used by the Rafale fighter jets for the IAF. The Meteor has a stated range of “well in excess of 150km” according to its manufacturers but is also smaller in length than the PL-15.

Therefore, experts talking to the EurAsian Times conclude that the PL-15 has greater range than the Meteor on account of its higher fuel capacity and poses a serious threat to the French origin jets which will be operated by the Indian Air Force.


https://eurasiantimes.com/jf-17-vs-...serious-threat-to-indian-rafale-fighter-jets/
global times ?
name is enough . :sarcastic:
 

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