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JF-17 Block-3 -- Updates, News & Discussion

araz

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The most important is why not kilomov already developing and maturing RD93MA series engine when its probable parameters already out in news and on PDF threads 10 years ago. This should be a confirm news at least at least in 2018 and thus as a matter of good planning, Block-III first flight should be with RD93MA Why only on this July-20 Kilomov move forwards? after first Block-III experimented in Dec-19. Why?
Simply because it takes time maturing new engines. Testing alone can take 1-2 years. WS13 does not make sense simply because PAF has built up rebuild and overhaul facilities.
A
 

ziaulislam

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Secrecy is not the same as delay and so far there is no indication the program is behind schedule we just don't have insight into it. If there are any delays. my guess would be they would relate to the AESA radar as it might be a simple piece of hardware per say, but the algorithms behind it would be nothing but. If its performance is lacking in any of the domains required by PAF or standard across western radars, PAF would want those issues ironed out. One thing we do know is there is a prototype flying in China for a while. There very well could be more than one going through their rounds of testing the avionics and EW systems and what not.

As far as the engine is concerned, even if it is ready in 2022-23 timeframe its not a big deal. Block IIIs could very well flying with the current version of RD-93 before swapping out for the new engine. PAC Kamra might also be involved in the upgradation of the existing engine fleet over time as well.
My guess is block III will be delayed for few months to get rd93ma on board
I think instead of march we will be seeing august 2021 as production time line
Its not just about but the size as well... Smart bombs require much more space then dumb bombs on tk500.furthermore in case of air to air engagement these drop bombs needs to be released. So it will ve really risky to send these planes with munition in fuel tanks which might need to drop in case of interception by enemy.


Too much if and buts for too little to gain. Dual rack is much better option
Tk500 is not the future
Smart bomb with small diameter is
For example
The stormbreaker with its hexagonal launcher can launch 6, 200kg guided bombs from a single hard point
 

ARMalik

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There is no delay. A few Block-3 jets will be made public soon. Not too different to when PAF showed about 10 x JF-17Bs a few months ago.
 

Tameem

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There is no delay. A few Block-3 jets will be made public soon. Not too different to when PAF showed about 10 x JF-17Bs a few months ago.
There is delay.
RD93MA is still in testing phase and without RD93MA there is no way to install and AESA Radar (Which required more power to its Thousand TRMs) and Without AESA, there is no point PL-15 can be used independently outside AWACS cover. Thus whole purpose is lost.

So, with only Block-III frame available in hand (to Block-2 Accessories) would not makes it truly JF-17 Block 3 everyone vouching for.
 

AZADPAKISTAN2009

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The safe thing to do would be order another 50 batch :coffee:

a) 50% Block II A , with Turkish Sniper Pods
b) 50% Block II B , with Turkish Sniper Pods
 

Ali_Baba

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The JF17 Block III is delayed for sure, and the cause is the need to integrate with the RD93MA to get the best out of the plane.

Russia has not published a timeline for the RD93MA at all, so we dont know when it's testing will be complete. Given that it is based on a proven design, it should be quicker than if it was a brand new design, but you are looking at 1-2years from now before those engines are delivered to PAF/CATIC, etc.

It is possible that when the existing RD93 on the existing fleet expire their engine lifespans, then those JF17s will be upgraded to use the RD93MA.

To cover the production gap, and keep pace with the retirements of the legacy fleet, additional interim orders of JF17s Block II and B's are warranted.


It would be interesting to know how India is getting on with its Mig-29K engines?

" The RD-93 is developed from the RD-33 engine that powers the MiG-29UPG fighters of the Indian Air Force and MiG-29K jets of the Indian Navy. "

 
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Xone

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The JF17 Block III is delayed for sure, and the cause is the need to integrate with the RD93MA to get the best out of the plane.
Pakistan may be bog down due to the non-availability of the engine in time. Pakistan should complete the rest of the work and the engine change may be left for the time of its availability in the future. The delay in the production of JF17 B3 will negate the edge Pakistan is looking over its rivals with the advent of block 3. The resource available for block 3 will go to the other purchases and momentous attained with the in-house production of thunders will further diminish with every day lost in the wait. Pakistan should look for alternatives as intentional delay may result in some sort of denial and exploitation of the need.
 

GriffinsRule

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No one really knows the reason for any delay, or if there is even a delay to begin with. We are all guessing here.
 

aziqbal

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its getting late and we haven't seen a Block 3 this year

before this year is out I would like to see Block 3 under construction at Kamra

however the last media video from PAC gave us no hint of a block 3 under construction

I think it will be 2021 by the time we see it now and 2020 was basically block II + JF17B + export
 

Akh1112

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The rumors of delays due to rd93ma are entirely false. The B3 will continue to use the RD93. The claim of the RD93 not producing enough power is also false as the KLJ-7A can be retrofitted without requiring an engine upgrade, so can the LKF601E which uh im almost certain use the same TRM's. Only potential delays i forsee are covid. Otherwise everything is on track to be ready based off of the timelines provided. I.e first few jf17 b3 are on the production line, with delivery expected in december/January. Be patient.
 

gangsta_rap

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Russia is going to seriously punish Pakistan for backing Azerbaijan against Armenia in Azerbaijan's Karabakh region. They won't supply RD-93MA. JF-17 Block 3 is put on hold indefinitely.
wtf
i want to hold you to a bet for 200$ CAD that nothing like this will happen. we can set a timeframe until the end of the year
 

FuturePAF

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The safe thing to do would be order another 50 batch :coffee:

a) 50% Block II A , with Turkish Sniper Pods
b) 50% Block II B , with Turkish Sniper Pods
Probably a better investment would be working with the Turks to buy their composite production techniques and applying it to the JF-17 Airframe, while we are waiting on the Engine and AESA radar.

While more expensive upfront it will help reduce maintenance and lifecycle costs in the long run, and make the JF-17 a better export prospect; “F-35 class airframe”. A good project in anticipation of Project AZM.

A lighter airframe could compensate for continued use of the standard RD-93, until the RD-93MA is fully certified
 

araz

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Probably a better investment would be working with the Turks to buy their composite production techniques and applying it to the JF-17 Airframe, while we are waiting on the Engine and AESA radar.

While more expensive upfront it will help reduce maintenance and lifecycle costs in the long run, and make the JF-17 a better export prospect; “F-35 class airframe”. A good project in anticipation of Project AZM.

A lighter airframe could compensate for continued use of the standard RD-93, until the RD-93MA is fully certified
The need to keep cost down and to deliver JFTs on time is more acute that incorporation of 5th gen composites. We have a working relationship both with the Chinese-and the Turks. We also have our own projects ongoing. So waut for the 5th generation to come on line for all the bells andxwhisyles and a tootoo dress. Till then it is progressive enhancements on the JFT.
A
 

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