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Shawnee

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Whether based on land or at sea, Dark Sword appears to be uniquely well suited to operate under a 'loyal wingman' or 'tethered' concept of operations in addition to an independent one. Under such a setup, Dark Sword would be able to speed ahead of manned fighters on command to collect data and targeting information, or even engage targets itself. Such a capability would be useful to stealthy and non-stealthy manned fighters alike. But for the latter, it could be a huge force multiplier, providing high-end counter-air defense and strike capability without the cost of procuring droves of high-end stealthy manned fighters.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...-dark-sword-fighter-like-combat-drone-emerges

It’s one of a family of next gen Chinese UCAV being developed to do a host of combat missions. Chinese hope to even develop future versions of Dark Sword into the worlds first hypersonic drone in order to assist in air defense and air to air weapons development.

I would say Iran is now lagging both China and Russia in the Next gen UCAV department (at least publicly).

Closet thing Iran has to next gen UCAV is Sofreh Mahi project which after RQ-170 capture one wonders if the project has been cancelled or pivoted to a different design. I have been adamant on here for the need of a high altitude supersonic family of Iranian drones that can drop high altitude glide munitions or CMs onto enemy targets as well as A2A versions for air defense.

Karrar is a novel technique in line with traditional Iranian architecture of using current gen drone technology and cheaper costs. From that standpoint it’s unique as a current gen interceptor a combination of a drone, missile, with anti air seeker. Still I would consider it as more a loiter munition with some niche uses rather than full fledge interceptor that can be relied on during war or conflict to adequately assist with air defense.

Most countries have given that role to next gen UCAVs like Lockheed’s classified projects And Chinese various flying wing/delta wing projects such as Dark Sword and Sharp Sword.
An interceptor version of dark sword is still a concept. Dark sword has many versions and one is a shape shifting UAV!

Iran has shown an interceptor UAV in action at 500-600 m/s per this video.
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TheImmortal

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An interceptor version of dark sword is still a concept. Dark sword has many versions and one is a shape shifting UAV!

Iran has shown an interceptor UAV in action at 500-600 m/s per this video.
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Dark Sword has also flown, it’s a confidential project and China is even more secretive than Iran about its projects.

Both dark sword and Karrar have the same amount of live kills against a competent aerial target.....zero

So again the effectiveness of Karrar against a true aerial target is same as dark sword....hypothetical.

Karrar is merely a Jerry rigged drone/missile hybrid developed before Iran had true MALE drones. Now it’s modified itself with a seeker for anti air operations. Effectiveness? Who knows. Anyone can hit a target drone in a test, hitting an actual fighter jet is a a different matter.

Of all Iranian drones to see combat during Syrian conflict, never once came across a report of Karrar being used....very telling. Even though it’s been a platform available for over a decade and has higher speed than traditional turboprop Iranian drones.

Dark sword can actually carry a radar in its which would further capability to A2A missiles in its bay. Closest thing Iran has done is jerry rig some manpads to a subsonic drone in the past.

Also I should add It can also supercruise at above Mach 2 Allowing it to effectively chase and intercept targets on top of its ultra low RCS design. Compare this to Karrar that has similar range to an F-5 and may or may not be able to sustain Mach 1 which is still to slow against after burning and super-cruise capable aircraft.

Your ridicule against China rapid movement in the flying wing and next gen UCAV space shows is uncalled for and immature. I would suggest you do more research into their various programs as they are one of the leading countries developing next gen UCAV and may over take the US in this field in next decade.
 

Shawnee

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Dark Sword has also flown, it’s a confidential project and China is even more secretive than Iran about its projects.

Both dark sword and Karrar have the same amount of live kills against a competent aerial target.....zero

So again the effectiveness of Karrar against a true aerial target is same as dark sword....hypothetical.

Karrar is merely a Jerry rigged drone/missile hybrid developed before Iran had true MALE drones. Now it’s modified itself with a seeker for anti air operations. Effectiveness? Who knows. Anyone can hit a target drone in a test, hitting an actual fighter jet is a a different matter.

Of all Iranian drones to see combat during Syrian conflict, never once came across a report of Karrar being used....very telling. Even though it’s been a platform available for over a decade and has higher speed than traditional turboprop Iranian drones.

Dark sword can actually carry a radar in its which would further capability to A2A missiles in its bay. Closest thing Iran has done is jerry rig some manpads to a subsonic drone in the past.

Also I should add It can also supercruise at above Mach 2 Allowing it to effectively chase and intercept targets on top of its ultra low RCS design. Compare this to Karrar that has similar range to an F-5 and may or may not be able to sustain Mach 1 which is still to slow against after burning and super-cruise capable aircraft.

Your ridicule against China rapid movement in the flying wing and next gen UCAV space shows is uncalled for and immature. I would suggest you do more research into their various programs as they are one of the leading countries developing next gen UCAV and may over take the US in this field in next decade.
Long story short: Show me a supersonic dark sword flying. That is the difference.

I agree with you that in the long run, we will lag behind China and Russia in UCAV despite having the first UCAV in the world in 1985 because we do not have proper heavy turbofans.
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TheImmortal

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Long story short: Show me a supersonic dark sword flying. That is the difference.

I agree with you that in the long run, we will lag behind China and Russia in UCAV despite having the first UCAV in the world in 1985 because we do not have proper heavy turbofans.
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I can’t show you footage of something that is high priority project for China anymore than I can show you footage of US with it’s aurora project. But both exist and are operational in some capacity.

Iran can get there, it’s the mindset that is different. Such Advanced programs are traditionally IRGC driven, but IRGC also operates on a cheap to operate model and shuns away from ultra high tech items. That doesn’t mean a cheaper more disposable flying wing UCAV drone can’t be developed. It certainly can, US had a Mach 3 recon drone at 90K altitude in 1960’s with 3000 mile range. So surely Iran can build an (degraded) armed version of that in near future in 2020.

The Sofreh Mahi project has shown us Iran clearly has CONSIDERED a next gen UCAV drone. The question is has anyone in the defense industry shown significant interest in such a capability.

Let’s see what comes of the rumors of Iranian advancement in micro engine and turbofan jet engine. Could be some surprises on the horizon
 

TheImmortal

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@Shawnee

In case your interested this is China’s Sharp Sword supersonic UCAV design which is similar in some aspects to Sofreh Mahi model that Iran revealed many years ago.




If Iran can solve the engine equation. Such a UCAV is well within Iran’s capability and would make a great addition to IRGC strike capability.
 

Mr Iran Eye

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No, no and no !! You are delusional because Iran is not necessarily lagging behind China and Russia on drones. This is completely wrong and we will see in the near future. Iran is very advanced in nanotechnology and can make high tech drones. It is unbelievably exceptional what Iran can do with a small military budget compared to Russia and China.

And know that Iran has secret weapons that have not yet been disclosed so be careful with your speculations
 

Shawnee

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Interceptor/Anti-aircraft version of karrar UAV in action.

@AmirPatriot

I need your mechanical knowledge on this footage dude.

The footage shows limited kinetic data such as one spot speed of about 600 m/s plus a pretty fast yaw (angular) acceleration. Yaw is marked on the lower left of the footage. One spot speed is hidden. Unknown service ceiling and rate of climb. How easy is it for a few drones of this kind to circle and harass/intercept an F15 on its route?
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IblinI

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@Shawnee

In case your interested this is China’s Sharp Sword supersonic UCAV design which is similar in some aspects to Sofreh Mahi model that Iran revealed many years ago.




If Iran can solve the engine equation. Such a UCAV is well within Iran’s capability and would make a great addition to IRGC strike capability.
a little correction, this is WZ–8, a high altitude,high speed recon drone(wz in chinese means Unmanned recon), which it has being deployed in actual mission at Taiwan,South China sea.
WZ–9 is the famous Soar dragon, a HALE drone, WZ–10 is likely to be the Divine eagle, an AWACS HALE.
The PLA seems to show lack of interest in conventional turboprop ucav.
 
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TheImmortal

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Fotros needs to be equipped with SAR and a more power imaging and monitoring system, hopefully Iran incorporates some information learned in Global Hawk to Fotros.

Never understood why a drone that big has such an off the shelf Flir.
 

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