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skyshadow

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He really believes Fateh uses such an ancient front sonar?
im afraid he dose, and can you blame him? these kind of technology is state secret he don't know any better, what we see or talk about is 10 years old this is the first lesson they teach in military.
 

SalarHaqq

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im afraid he dose, and can you blame him? these kind of technology is state secret he don't know any better
Will have to disagree on this particular aspect, brother.

Because:

1) In principle the author in question is following Iranian naval developments (particularly in the submarine department) closely enough not to miss major news releases about sonars.

2) You might have forgotten that Iran unveiled the advanced Soroush sonar in July 2016.





Yet the author's cutaway of the Fateh submarine, still depicting the older sonar type, was published on his website on 16 September 2020:

fth.jpg


While in his article dedicated to the Fateh-class, the author had included a photograph of the older sonar, adding the following caption: An Iranian made circular sonar array consisting of vertical staves. This layout is similar to WW2 and 1950s Soviet designs.

fth2.jpg


He did not update the picture, nor complete his presentation through the addition of an illustration of the Soroush sonar shown above.

This leaves two potential explanations:

1) The author simply missed the news releases about the Soroush. However, wasn't the Soroush revealed at the same time as IRIB broadcast their report about Admiral Sayyari inspecting the interior of the Fateh submarine, which the author has included screenshots of in his article? Either way, this doesn't seem to be the most likely explanation.

2) He is aware of the Soroush but chooses not to mention it, subjectively considering there is "no proof" that it was fielded, or even believing that it constitutes "propaganda".

This is a common issue with western analysts of Iranian military affairs. They as good as always display a degree of bias and will apply differential treatment to Iran, for no other reason than the fact that the regimes ruling over their countries of origin and/or of residence, are hostile to Iran and to the Islamic Republic. Or in other words, the dominant, western regime-sponsored narrative (or shall we say, propaganda) overwhelmingly antagonizes Iran and so analysts are led if not compelled to follow suit.

This is why when several possible hypotheses offer themselves to them, they will almost systematically tend to choose the one which presents Iran in the least favorable light, the one most sceptical of domestic Iranian achievements. In the present case, there is actually more reason to believe that the Soroush sonar has effectively been brought into service rather than to assume it hasn't. But since Iran published no direct photographic documentation of the Soroush sonar inside a Fateh class submarine, the author will use it as a justification to postulate Fateh is still using the old sonar.

That still doesn't justify total obfuscation of the new sonar by the author though (in his article, he makes no mention of it whatsoever), especially if he is going to make sure to include qualifications such as "WW2 design" when referring to older Iranian-made sonars.
 
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skyshadow

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Will have to disagree on this particular aspect, brother.

Because:

1) In principle the author in question is following Iranian naval developments (particularly in the submarine department) closely enough not to miss major news releases about sonars.

2) You might have forgotten that Iran unveiled the advanced Soroush sonar in July 2016.





Yet the author's cutaway of the Fateh submarine, still depicting the older sonar type, was published on his website on 16 September 2020:

While in his article dedicated to the Fateh-class, the author has included a photograph of the older sonar, adding the following caption: An Iranian made circular sonar array consisting of vertical staves. This layout is similar to WW2 and 1950s Soviet designs.

View attachment 670970


The author did not update the picture, nor complete his presentation through the addition of an illustration of the Soroush sonar shown above.

This leaves two potential explanations:

1) He simply missed the news releases about the Soroush. However, wasn't the Soroush revealed at the same time as IRIB broadcast their report about Admiral Sayyari inspecting the interior of the Fateh submarine, which the author has included screenshots of in his article? Either way, this doesn't seem to be the most likely explanation.

2) He is aware of the Soroush but chooses not to mention it, subjectively considering there is "no proof" that it was fielded, or even believing that it constitutes "propaganda".

This is a common issue with western analysts of Iranian military affairs. They as good as always display a degree of bias and will apply differential treatment to Iran, for no other reason than the fact that the regimes ruling over their countries of origin and/or of residence, are hostile to Iran and to the Islamic Republic. Or in other words, the dominant, western regime-sponsored narrative (or shall we say, propaganda) overwhelmingly antagonizes Iran and so analysts are led if not compelled to follow suit.

This is why when several possible hypotheses offer themselves to them, they will almost systematically tend to choose the one which presents Iran in the least favorable light, the one most sceptical of domestic Iranian achievements. In the present case, there is actually more reason to believe that the Soroush sonar has effectively been brought into service rather than to assume it hasn't. But since Iran published no direct photographic documentation of the Soroush sonar inside a Fateh class submarine, the author will use it as a justification to postulate Fateh is still using the old sonar.

That still doesn't justify total obfuscation of the new sonar by the author though (in his article, he makes no mention of it whatsoever), especially if he is going to make sure to include qualifications such as "WW2 design" when referring to older Iranian-made sonars.
agreed
 

aryobarzan

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Will have to disagree on this particular aspect, brother.

Because:

1) In principle the author in question is following Iranian naval developments (particularly in the submarine department) closely enough not to miss major news releases about sonars.

2) You might have forgotten that Iran unveiled the advanced Soroush sonar in July 2016.





Yet the author's cutaway of the Fateh submarine, still depicting the older sonar type, was published on his website on 16 September 2020:

View attachment 671016

While in his article dedicated to the Fateh-class, the author had included a photograph of the older sonar, adding the following caption: An Iranian made circular sonar array consisting of vertical staves. This layout is similar to WW2 and 1950s Soviet designs.

View attachment 670970


He did not update the picture, nor complete his presentation through the addition of an illustration of the Soroush sonar shown above.

This leaves two potential explanations:

1) The author simply missed the news releases about the Soroush. However, wasn't the Soroush revealed at the same time as IRIB broadcast their report about Admiral Sayyari inspecting the interior of the Fateh submarine, which the author has included screenshots of in his article? Either way, this doesn't seem to be the most likely explanation.

2) He is aware of the Soroush but chooses not to mention it, subjectively considering there is "no proof" that it was fielded, or even believing that it constitutes "propaganda".

This is a common issue with western analysts of Iranian military affairs. They as good as always display a degree of bias and will apply differential treatment to Iran, for no other reason than the fact that the regimes ruling over their countries of origin and/or of residence, are hostile to Iran and to the Islamic Republic. Or in other words, the dominant, western regime-sponsored narrative (or shall we say, propaganda) overwhelmingly antagonizes Iran and so analysts are led if not compelled to follow suit.

This is why when several possible hypotheses offer themselves to them, they will almost systematically tend to choose the one which presents Iran in the least favorable light, the one most sceptical of domestic Iranian achievements. In the present case, there is actually more reason to believe that the Soroush sonar has effectively been brought into service rather than to assume it hasn't. But since Iran published no direct photographic documentation of the Soroush sonar inside a Fateh class submarine, the author will use it as a justification to postulate Fateh is still using the old sonar.

That still doesn't justify total obfuscation of the new sonar by the author though (in his article, he makes no mention of it whatsoever), especially if he is going to make sure to include qualifications such as "WW2 design" when referring to older Iranian-made sonars.
Down playing Iran's achievements in any domain is a policy dictated by the western ruling elite and handed down to publishing houses (media) and practiced by the individual authors ( e.g ..WWII, North korean copy...Obsolete..Iranian regime...etc) are buzz words used to denigrate any thing related to Iran. The reverse is also practiced (positive reporting) and the latest examples are articles, opinion pieces and news media reports about countries that have recently joined the western camp..India, Ukraine..etc...This submarine analyst would not have been published if his report would have provided a final positive taste in the mind of reader about an Iranian product... so he used the WWII and outdated photo/data regarding the sonar to be able to publish..Irony is that Israeli media and some of the Israeli analysts are most fair about evaluating Iranian products (I guess being in the receiving end of the iranian products they have to be more realistic about the capabilities..lol)
 

Hack-Hook

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well the photos answer the question of sleeping bunks , and I don't like it . its were ever they could put a mat , no special compartment for sleeping . it only add stress and pressure on sailors . just think its your sleeping shift and a guy need to do some work on the panel over your bunk or decide to fire a torpedo .

and loading torpedoes from outside make it a lot harder to resupply the submarine in middle of the sea , winder if it was not possible to put a hatch in frontal section of the submarine for doing so
 
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sahureka2

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well the photos answer the question of sleeping bunks , and I don't like it . its were ever they could put a mat , no special compartment for sleeping . it only add stress and pressure on sailors . just think its your sleeping shift and a guy need to do some work on the panel over your bunk or decide to fire a torpedo .

and loading torpedoes from outside make it a lot harder to resupply the submarine in middle of the sea , winder if it was not possible to put a hatch in frontal section of the submarine for doing so
However, it is necessary to stop and think that it is a submarine of only about 600 tons, therefore the space on board is limited, to make a comparison I am attaching the video of the 591 ton Italian Toti class submarine
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Italian_submarine_Enrico_Toti_(S_506).
In service in the Italian Navy from 1965 to 1997, today transformed into a museum.
Observe the captain's cabin from minute 4:15 and then until minute 5:17 where you can see the "beds" in the torpedo room



Also look at this video from 5:02 minutes, from these images you realize that space is small and is also used for multiple purposes.
Therefore, for a submarine the size of a Fateh, one cannot expect to have cabins dedicated for the crew.

Moving on to how torpedoes are loaded, even the Kilo class does not have a special opening to load torpedoes, but are inserted directly from the front opening of the torpedo tubes.
2
 
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