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Iran to add a new Midget sub in the comming month

VEVAK

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In the coming months Iran will be adding a new Midget sub to it's fleet.


upload_2018-2-18_13-11-35.png



I'm not sure if Iran classifies the Fatteh class as a Midget Sub or not! If not they are adding a new Gadir class to the fleet in the next month or so and the Fatteh still has a year of testing left.

I think for Iran the most adequate size sub would be ~1000tonne 200ft x 20ft sub equipped with wide range of weapons, systems and sensors produced at a rate of 1 every 4 years. That's 5 produced in the next 20 years & you start putting them on your reserve fleet after they serve for 2 decades allowing you to keep 5 modern versions active at all times & the ability expand your reserves over time.
 

Hack-Hook

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I think for Iran the most adequate size sub would be ~1000tonne 200ft x 20ft sub equipped with wide range of weapons, systems and sensors produced at a rate of 1 every 4 years.
where laws of physic apply here ?
how you fit that range of weapon and equipment in that submarine ?
 

VEVAK

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where laws of physic apply here ?
how you fit that range of weapon and equipment in that submarine ?
As laws of physics dictate a +1000 tone subs with a 20 ft diameter as appose to the Fatteh can carry more weapons, larger sonars, the ability to transport wider range of weapons like heavier sub launched UAV, larger more advanced sub launched UUV, larger stock of Land attack cruise missiles, more torpedo's, more mines.... And with it goes more fuel and longer range, more batteries and the ability stay under water in stealth mode for longer periods,....

How many 500-600 tone Fatteh subs do you think we can build in the next 2 decades? And how many Fatteh class subs do you think we can keep deployed at any given time? What's the point of having 20 Ghadir Class subs if at any given time 16 of them remain docked and easy targets for an initial strike?

As long as the weapon system(s) you build is mostly Iranian built then it doesn't matter how much it costs to build because the money gets recycled back into your economy and helps to create jobs in various industries!

Building Fatteh Class subs as appose to something larger is the same mistake Iran is making with the Mowj Class frigates because at the end of the day it's NOT the actual hull that takes time to build and 2 Mowj Class frigates will NEVER be as capable as a ship twice the size of the Jamaran in terms of various types of weapons, sensors,... it can carry

Iran today at ISOICO facility alone has all the tools, facilities and resources necessary to build it's own:
+800ft long x 150ft wide Helo carrier that can be used as a replenishment ship. (Every 4 years)
+600ft long x 80ft wide missile cruiser equipped with VLS and over 100 Missiles from SAM to AsCM to LACM (Every 4 years)
+200ft x20ft Subs equipped with LACM, Torpedo's, Mines, UUV & Sub launched UAV's (Every 4 Years)

Iran needs to make the decision today as to what it wants it's Navy to look like 20 years from now!

And instead of keeping the countries money in foreign banks that money should be in invested in various industries tools and facilities inside the country by investing that money in the defense industry.

What Iran does with it's money for the next 2 decades is vital! In the next 2 decades the vast majority of Iran's population will be over 50 years of age and we need to plan for and start preparing for how we want to defend the country then starting today!
Iran will NOT have the luxury to rely on it's man power in 2-3 decades from now which means you have to rely on tools and weapon systems that are force multipliers!
Which also means Iran like Japan needs to put large investments towards robotics for military use to industrial use and consumer use

keeping large number of cash & reserves in banks rather than investing in our own defense industries (especially in areas that have duel use applications) has brought Iran nothing but trouble and year after year Iran's regional rivals keep getting bolder and bolder and if that's how they behave today how do you think they'll behave when the vast majority of Iran's population is over 60 years old and defending against Iranian Missiles becomes easier and easier for them and we have no Air Force to intercept incoming aircrafts?
 

Hack-Hook

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As laws of physics dictate a +1000 tone subs with a 20 ft diameter as appose to the Fatteh can carry more weapons, larger sonars, the ability to transport wider range of weapons like heavier sub launched UAV, larger more advanced sub launched UUV, larger stock of Land attack cruise missiles, more torpedo's, more mines.... And with it goes more fuel and longer range, more batteries and the ability stay under water in stealth mode for longer periods,....

How many 500-600 tone Fatteh subs do you think we can build in the next 2 decades? And how many Fatteh class subs do you think we can keep deployed at any given time? What's the point of having 20 Ghadir Class subs if at any given time 16 of them remain docked and easy targets for an initial strike?

As long as the weapon system(s) you build is mostly Iranian built then it doesn't matter how much it costs to build because the money gets recycled back into your economy and helps to create jobs in various industries!

Building Fatteh Class subs as appose to something larger is the same mistake Iran is making with the Mowj Class frigates because at the end of the day it's NOT the actual hull that takes time to build and 2 Mowj Class frigates will NEVER be as capable as a ship twice the size of the Jamaran in terms of various types of weapons, sensors,... it can carry

Iran today at ISOICO facility alone has all the tools, facilities and resources necessary to build it's own:
+800ft long x 150ft wide Helo carrier that can be used as a replenishment ship. (Every 4 years)
+600ft long x 80ft wide missile cruiser equipped with VLS and over 100 Missiles from SAM to AsCM to LACM (Every 4 years)
+200ft x20ft Subs equipped with LACM, Torpedo's, Mines, UUV & Sub launched UAV's (Every 4 Years)

Iran needs to make the decision today as to what it wants it's Navy to look like 20 years from now!

And instead of keeping the countries money in foreign banks that money should be in invested in various industries tools and facilities inside the country by investing that money in the defense industry.

What Iran does with it's money for the next 2 decades is vital! In the next 2 decades the vast majority of Iran's population will be over 50 years of age and we need to plan for and start preparing for how we want to defend the country then starting today!
Iran will NOT have the luxury to rely on it's man power in 2-3 decades from now which means you have to rely on tools and weapon systems that are force multipliers!
Which also means Iran like Japan needs to put large investments towards robotics for military use to industrial use and consumer use

keeping large number of cash & reserves in banks rather than investing in our own defense industries (especially in areas that have duel use applications) has brought Iran nothing but trouble and year after year Iran's regional rivals keep getting bolder and bolder and if that's how they behave today how do you think they'll behave when the vast majority of Iran's population is over 60 years old and defending against Iranian Missiles becomes easier and easier for them and we have no Air Force to intercept incoming aircrafts?
very simple , what you wanted can't be achieved with something like a 1000t submarine you need to build a submarine comparable to kilo class .

and then you must decide you want them foe Persian gulf or sea of Oman and Indian ocean?

and you wont teach toddler jumping at first, you start by crawling and baby steps
 

AmirPatriot

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My understanding is that this will be the last Ghadir class submarine to be handed over to the navy. After that, I presume Iran will mass produce the Fateh.
 
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Myth_buster_1

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if i get a penny for every lie that comes out from iran defence news i will become a billionaire in no time. with hobby grade techology iran is only fooling iran.
 

VEVAK

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very simple , what you wanted can't be achieved with something like a 1000t submarine you need to build a submarine comparable to kilo class .

and then you must decide you want them foe Persian gulf or sea of Oman and Indian ocean?

and you wont teach toddler jumping at first, you start by crawling and baby steps
With modern advancements a sub similar to the Type 212 size sub is more than sufficient for Iran's main sub fleet
And technologically it's within Iran's capability to build it's just a matting of being willing to pay for it!
And I'm not claiming an Iranian sub that size would have the same dive capability as an American or German sub but in terms of weapons it will be more than sufficient

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_212_submarine

After the 1st one is built Iran could easily build subs similar in size to the Type 212 every 4 years

Iran's has already built 800ft long x 150ft long Tankers and container ships so converting that hull to a Helo carrier/ Replenishment ship for the military is just a matter of wanting to do it not capability

Same with a missile cruiser ~ double the size of the Jamaran Class

Point is the Iranian government needs to weak the hell up and start funding Iran's defense industries today so we don't come up short 20-30 years from now when most of our population is over 60 years old
Today we have the manpower and a work force that needs jobs that can take on various project all across Iran's Defense industry but in 20-30 years that work force just wont be there and that's the truth!
 

Hack-Hook

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With modern advancements a sub similar to the Type 212 size sub is more than sufficient for Iran's main sub fleet
And technologically it's within Iran's capability to build it's just a matting of being willing to pay for it!
And I'm not claiming an Iranian sub that size would have the same dive capability as an American or German sub but in terms of weapons it will be more than sufficient

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Type_212_submarine

After the 1st one is built Iran could easily build subs similar in size to the Type 212 every 4 years

Iran's has already built 800ft long x 150ft long Tankers and container ships so converting that hull to a Helo carrier/ Replenishment ship for the military is just a matter of wanting to do it not capability

Same with a missile cruiser ~ double the size of the Jamaran Class

Point is the Iranian government needs to weak the hell up and start funding Iran's defense industries today so we don't come up short 20-30 years from now when most of our population is over 60 years old
Today we have the manpower and a work force that needs jobs that can take on various project all across Iran's Defense industry but in 20-30 years that work force just wont be there and that's the truth!
Germany build submarine since before WW1, you want Submarine like type 212 , then first build its fuel cell. and you say we can miniaturize the component like Germany with more than 100 year experience in the field can do ?
and no the shipyard may have the capabilities to build the ships in that size but first you must build a fleet to defend that ship and more importantly come up with a design for that ship .you can't just go and say ey dude I heard you built some Aftamax Bulk Carrier under license , here i want you build one of those and modify it for a carrier. no you can't the design is not suitable for the task at all.
 

Stryker1982

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Ghadir sub launching a torpedo :

https://www.aparat.com/v/dkhBK/خط_تولید_و_تحویل_زیردریایی_غدیر

Ghadir-sub watches American carrier :
Ghadir subs hold valfajr torpedos right?

I don't think they can hold any hoot missiles. In which case, I'm assuming the hoot can only be deployed on the 3 kilo class subs.


Fateh seems large enough to do so though if it ever comes online. An operational hoot would make any ship a floating coffin in the PG.
 

VEVAK

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Germany build submarine since before WW1, you want Submarine like type 212 , then first build its fuel cell. and you say we can miniaturize the component like Germany with more than 100 year experience in the field can do ?
and no the shipyard may have the capabilities to build the ships in that size but first you must build a fleet to defend that ship and more importantly come up with a design for that ship .you can't just go and say ey dude I heard you built some Aftamax Bulk Carrier under license , here i want you build one of those and modify it for a carrier. no you can't the design is not suitable for the task at all.
I believe I specifically said that the Sub would NOT be as advanced as a German or American Sub!
As for the design Iran has had the designs for the 1200 tone Besat class aka Qaeem class for some time it's mostly a matter of accepting to fund it!
And if you choose to build 1200 tone sub as Iran main sub fleet and stick to it then in the future it would be far easier to upgrade in time

And a ship like the one below using the same hull and yes major changes in design to the deck and upper sections of the hull can be converted to HELO Carrier/ Replenishment ship! That's armed with up to 12 Helo's + the ability to launch UAV's like the Saegheh + VLS that has up to 60 Missiles including SAM's/Antishp missiles + multipole CIWS

upload_2018-2-20_11-45-30.png



And not all Helo carriers need to have a complicated unbalanced looking design like an Aircraft Carrier





If I was in Iran's place I would build a more balanced design using that hull with the upper 300ft built like a missile cruise equipped with SAM, LACM, ASCM, Radars, Sonar, torpedo's, CIWC..... & I'll have 500 ft in the back for Holding and lunching Helo's & UAV's...
 

Hack-Hook

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I believe I specifically said that the Sub would NOT be as advanced as a German or American Sub!
As for the design Iran has had the designs for the 1200 tone Besat class aka Qaeem class for some time it's mostly a matter of accepting to fund it!
And if you choose to build 1200 tone sub as Iran main sub fleet and stick to it then in the future it would be far easier to upgrade in time

And a ship like the one below using the same hull and yes major changes in design to the deck and upper sections of the hull can be converted to HELO Carrier/ Replenishment ship! That's armed with up to 12 Helo's + the ability to launch UAV's like the Saegheh + VLS that has up to 60 Missiles including SAM's/Antishp missiles + multipole CIWS

View attachment 455028


And not all Helo carriers need to have a complicated unbalanced looking design like an Aircraft Carrier





If I was in Iran's place I would build a more balanced design using that hull with the upper 300ft built like a missile cruise equipped with SAM, LACM, ASCM, Radars, Sonar, torpedo's, CIWC..... & I'll have 500 ft in the back for Holding and lunching Helo's & UAV's...
Again being able to build a big ship is not enough ,the design must be able to endure a certain amount of stress ,and it must be capable of changing path and speed very faster than an aftamax .
Its engine is in another class compared to a commercial ship.
A military design unlike commercial one must be capable of this

Now show me maneuvering capabilities of an aftamax
 
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