• Thursday, November 15, 2018

Indian Army and its old Weapons and Equipments

Discussion in 'Indian Defence Forum' started by ptltejas, Oct 27, 2012.

  1. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    Haubits FH77: This are modern one BOFORS. which have great capabilities. it fires its shell automatically. Bofors new howitzers are also best but considering the name Bofors hardly some one try to deal with it. Technologically it has best capabilities for the modern war need only guided projectile which can change its direction after fire.

    [​IMG]

    We have near to 400 of this kind howitzers and which are war proven but 100 are not in good condition. the hell is that just due to blacklisting we do not update this gun and repair it. this is bad for the strategy aspect. we need the indigenous model and if possible to purchase new bofors model howitzers.
     
  2. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    The 105 mm Indian and Light Field Guns (IFG/LFG) were being replaced by 130mm M-46 Field Gun. About 200 of the M-46 guns are purchased each year to replace the 105mm IFG/LFG. Nearly 500 of the M-46 guns were earmarked for upgrade to the 155mm/39-caliber and 155mm/45-caliber by Soltam Systems Ltd. of Israel. But the attempt to upgrade the Russian-supplied 130MM guns to 155MM calibre has been ridden with failures. By early 2009 approximately 180 pieces of 130mm M46 Russian medium guns had been successfully "up-gunned" to 155mm calibre with ordnance supplied by Soltam of Israel. The new barrel length of 45 calibre enhanced the range of the gun to about 40 km with extended range ammunition.

    Source: Army Equipment
     
  3. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    M777 howitzer: India is going to purchase 145 of this kind. this is better than bofors but less in number. the weight of this gun is only 4218 where as the bofors is of 11tons. this is latest as of 2005 design. it can be easily send at border area rapidly. As the bofors are better for war this howitzers are also shall be better however considering that it is not in our army inventory not consider it as a howitzer right now.

    Specifications
    Weight 4,218 kg (9,300 lb)[1]
    Length Combat: 10.7 m (35 ft 1 in)
    Travel: 9.5 m (31 ft 2 in)
    Barrel length 39 calibers
    Crew 5
    Caliber 155 mm (6.1 in)
    Carriage split trail
    Rate of fire Normal: 2 rpm
    Maximum: 5 rpm
    Effective range M107: 24 km (15 mi)
    ERFB: 30 km (18.6 mi) base bleed
    Excalibur: 40 km (25 mi)

    we need this type many guns and also of bofors latest models. Right now except the bofors we have no any other best models as modern war. though they are useful. also need new projectile-shells whose direction can be changed in mid air like the M107: 24 km (15 mi)
    ERFB: 30 km (18.6 mi) base bleed
    Excalibur which can change its direction so useful against moving targets.
     
  4. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    Field Gun: M-46(900), 100mm M-1944(350), Indian Field Gun MK 1/2/3 (600-1300), Light Field Gun (700), 100 mm field gun M1944 (BS-3) (350),

    India replace its Indian Field Gun Mk 1/2/3 by M-46122 mm and Light Field guns which are nearer 600-1300 + 700 = 1300-2000.

    130 mm towed field gun M1954 (M-46): India has 900 guns of this kind.

    Specifications
    Weight 7.7 t (16,975 lbs)
    Length 11.73 m (38 ft 6 in)
    Width 2.45 m (8 ft)
    Height 2.55 m (8 ft 4 in)
    Crew 8
    Shell separate-loading charge and projectile
    Caliber 130 mm (5.1 in)
    Breech Horizontal sliding wedge
    Recoil hydropneumatic
    Carriage split-trail
    Elevation -2.5° to 45°
    Traverse 50°
    Rate of fire 6 (normal)
    8 (burst)
    5 (sustained)
    Muzzle velocity 930 m/s (3,051 ft/s)
    Maximum range 27.5 km (17 mi) (unassisted)
    38 km (23.61 mi) (assisted)

    In the wiki page it is stated that the gun is not automatic but manually loaded.

    [​IMG]
     
  5. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    100 mm field gun M1944 (BS-3)

    Specifications
    Weight 3,650 kg (8,047 lbs)
    Barrel length Bore: 5.34 m (17 ft 6 in) L/53.5
    Overall: 5.96 m (19 ft 7 in) L/59.6
    (with muzzle brake)
    Crew 6 to 8
    Shell 100 × 695 mm. R
    Caliber 100 mm (3.93 in)
    Carriage split trail
    Elevation -5° to 45°
    Traverse 58°
    Rate of fire 8 to 10 rpm
    Muzzle velocity 900 m/s (2,953 ft/s)
    Maximum range 20 km (12.42 mi)

    [​IMG]

    India has 350 this kind of guns in reserve. however russia has phased out it from its inventory like the M-46 is of old design and Ordinance board is make it with new changes but then also the new automatic fire system and with newly material tech and design and also computer guidance like the bofors are not their need better guns.
     
  6. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    Mountain Guns:
    Mountain guns are artillery pieces designed for use in mountain warfare and areas where usual wheeled transport is not possible.

    76 mm mountain gun M48 (215)
    we have nearer 215 guns of this kind. I have no Idea whether we can use other guns or howitzers as we have used bofors in the time of the kargil war. considering large border need those guns in more numbers.

    Specifications
    Weight 680 kg (1,500 lb)
    Barrel length 1.25 m (4 ft 1 in) L/16.4
    Caliber 76.2 mm (3 in)
    Breech interrupted screw
    Recoil hydraulic recoil compensation
    Carriage folding split trail
    Elevation -15 / +45 degrees, manual handwheel
    Traverse 25 degrees
    Rate of fire 20 - 25 rpm
    Muzzle velocity 387 m/s (1,270 ft/s)
    Maximum range 7.8 km (4.5 mi)

    [​IMG]

    its 1948 model.
     
  7. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    Self-propelled artillery: FV433 Abbot SPG (80), M-46 Catapult(100-170), 2S1 Gvozdika (110)

    Self-propelled artillery (also called mobile artillery or locomotive artillery) vehicles are combat vehicles armed with artillery. Within the term are covered self-propelled guns (or howitzers) and rocket artillery. They are high mobility vehicles, usually based on caterpillar track carrying either a large howitzer or other field gun or alternatively a mortar or some form of rocket or missile launcher. They are usually used for long-range indirect bombardment support on the battlefield.(wiki)


    FV433 Abbot SPG(80)


    Armour 10 and 12 mm plate
    Main
    armament 105 mm L13A1 gun, 40 rounds (including 6 rounds HESH) carried
    Secondary
    armament 7.62 mm L4A4 MG with 1,200 rounds, smoke dischargers
    Engine Rolls-Royce K60 Mk 4G multi-fuel opposed piston engine
    240 bhp @ 3750 rpm
    Power/weight 6.9lb/bhp
    Suspension torsion bar 5 units per side
    Operational
    range 480 km (300 mi)
    Speed 47 km/h (29 mph)

    [​IMG]


    It was in service in UK till 1995 but in india it yet be their. we have 80 this type systems to be replaced by other system. so can not be considered useful for modern war.
     
  8. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    M-46 Catapult: The M-46 Catapult is a self-propelled gun developed in India by Combat Vehicles Research and Development Establishment of DRDO. It is based on the conversion of ageing British/Indian Vijayanta tank's hull mounted with Russian 130mm M-46 field gun.

    [​IMG]

    A total of 170 M-46 Catapult systems were built and are now being phased out from active service being replaced by 4,000 new 155 mm self-propelled howitzers.(wiki)
     
  9. indian my friend

    indian my friend FULL MEMBER

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    dont talk about indian army its full of corruption even bangladesh has better weapons but thanks to our brave soldiers they even fight with junked rifles and grenandes which are even bad to crackers lol
    and by better weapons i mean they get what they order but in india if we order tank we will get pistol because all money goes in getting ferrais for politicians of india. dammmm it
     
  10. ptltejas

    ptltejas FULL MEMBER

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    2S1 Gvozdika:





    Specifications
    Weight 16 tonnes (35,273 lbs)
    Length 7.26 m (23 ft 10 in)
    Width 2.85 m (9 ft 4 in)
    Height 2.73 m (8 ft 11 in)
    Crew 4
    Shell separate loading, cased charge
    Caliber 122 mm
    Breech Horizontal sliding wedge, semi-automatic
    Elevation -3 to +70 degrees
    Traverse 360 degrees
    Rate of fire Maximum: 5 rpm
    Sustained: 1-2 rpm
    Muzzle velocity 680 m/s (2,200 ft/s)
    Maximum range Conventional: 15.3 km (9.5 mi)
    Extended: 21.9 km (13.6 mi)
    Armor 20 mm (.78 in)
    Main
    armament 2A18 122 mm (4.8 in) howitzer
    Engine YaMZ-238N diesel
    220 kW (300 hp)
    Suspension torsion bar
    Operational
    range 500 km (310 mi)
    Speed Road: 60 km/h (37 mph)
    Off-road: 30 km/h (18 mph)
    Swim: 4.5 km/h (2.8 mph)

    [​IMG]

    we have 110 guns of this kind. however as more details are not available cannot decide whether useful for modern war or not.
     
  11. sancho

    sancho PDF THINK TANK: ANALYST

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    The question is, are all these weapons still in service, or phased / stored? If they are stored, they still could be useful, because any weapon is useful in a war, the difference is only how useful it is.
    It is very obvious that IA failed for decades to modernise it's artillery and armoured vehicle fleet (and you should should add some of the older armourd vehicles here too, that needs to be replaced), while it's not doing too bad in the other fields. Tanks for example are pretty modern with Arjun, T90 and coming upgrades for T72. What is missing is, a lighter tank/tank destroyer that is more mobile than these heavy tanks and could be air transported to all borders. IA is already working in this field and has send our RFIs or even RFPs, for tracked and wheeled tank destoyers, but as usual things are moving on in Indian time. :frown:

    There are also efforts to replace several types of howitzers guns and mortar carriers, but again, these tenders were opened long ago and nothing changed so far.

    Good work btw!
     
  12. AUSTERLITZ

    AUSTERLITZ PDF THINK TANK: ANALYST

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    Artillery usually can't be called obsolete unless the its below 105mm barrel.Tanks yes.Normal t-72 is obsolete by global standards but not by the standards of the pakistani and chinese armies.T-72 AJEYA is a capable machine.
     
  13. Capt.Popeye

    Capt.Popeye ELITE MEMBER

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    Quite right here, except for the 105mm bit. It just happens that calibers below 105mm are not popular any more plus this is the age of standardisation. That being said, 105mm and 155mm are pretty much standardised across Armies all over the world now.

    Artillery does not grow obsolete anywhere as rapidly as Armor as you correctly infer.Take the example of the Indian Army's M-46 130mm which made its first appearance in 1954. Though it was originally designed as a Naval Gun its unmatched merit as an Arty gun was discovered and exploited. In its heydays, right upto the end of the 80s, it was unmatched by anything in Western Arsenals. It lobbed a 33kg HE shell over 27km while the US M-109 155mm gun had a range of only 14.6km.
    The M-46 is still a formidable weapon, even more so with the longer barrel upgrade. The only thing obsolescent with it is the fire control system, its ammo handling system and that it does not use all the modern shells available. There modern guns like the Bofors FH-70 hold the advantage.

    The Indian Army earlier used the M-1955 100mm guns too but for a very short while it still uses the D-30 122mm guns in reducing numbers. The Arty Regt. needs to standardise on the 105mm and 155mm calibers just to improve logistics management.

    About the tanks, while the T-72 is still relevant in the sub-continental context, its armor and FCS are obsolescent, which is typical of all AFVs actually; so eventually it will have to be phased out-esp considering development of newer anti-armor weaponry. Any upgradation of these can only be some form of life-extension, which will not be cost-beneficial finally.
     
  14. phylumchordata

    phylumchordata FULL MEMBER

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    Mumbai Police now

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  15. BordoEnes

    BordoEnes SENIOR MEMBER

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    Pltejas, To have a decent Army you dont need everything off the chart and brand new goodies. For example in the 1980/90 Turkey had a huge quantity of outdated SPH and barrely operational. We Upgraded our old M52 for example, To M52T standart which is somewhat similiar to M109A5... I think India has more then enough Tech and know-how to upgrade these Old SPHs, Cheap and Cost-effective.

    M52T: 365 of these babies in Service
    [​IMG]
    Crew: 5
    Weight: 29.5 Ton
    Main Gun: 155mm
    Barrel Lenght: 39 Calibre
    Engine: MTU Diesel
    Engine Power: 450Hp
    Range: 18/24/30
    Max RoF: ?
    Armed with Modern Turkish/German(Builders of Pzh2000) Fire Control System.

    Made from this junk...
    [​IMG]

    By upgrading you can make a significant difference...